IF / ADF / 4:3 / 5:2 / 6:1 / 16:8 ~ Maintaining at a healthy weight ~ Chapter 5

[TalkinPeace]

This thread is for those of us who have been practicing IF (Intermittent Fasting) for quite a while ( it being nearly 2 years since the Michael Mosely TV programme aired ) and are now at, or nearing, their target healthy weight.
It's also for anyone who is doing it for the health benefits alone.

How do we mix fasts and a stable food intake while having little or no weight to lose?
How do we ensure that this WOL keeps us at the healthy weight long term rather than revert to yoyo games?
How do we ensure that we keep ourselves looking great rather than just thin?

More and more of us have been maintaining at our original goal weight for many months, and others are joining all the time.
Obviously, the more the merrier!
It is also worth considering whether a second, leaner target might be achievable.

You'll find the first four maintenance threads and all the main 5:2 threads for posters practising IF to lose weight here Fasting / 5:2 on the diet forum. We're currently on thread no. 46, but there is a new main thread every 2-3 weeks.

There are three other associated threads:
This one, which is an absolute goldmine of Tips and Links on how to practice IF, and the research behind it.

And here is a treasure trove of 5:2 recipes, mostly low calorie for fasting days, but there are also recipes for when you want to treat yourself. And, now we're maintaining, we'll need more of these!

Since I started the last Maintainers thread the importance of exercise has come even more to the fore, as part of our general health and to help weight loss. BigChocFrenzys thread is here

((({South})) I hope things work out for you too
TIP I hope you are enjoying being back in the gym, I'm sure you will work off your inches in no time.
ATB Good luck with your training and toning

I'm currently 2kgs over my ideal weight, but only 1cm bigger on my waist.
I've run 65kms this week so am hoping the weight is due to water retention with muscles (I had 10 days off at the beginning of August) and my period.
I'm finding it impossible to fast at the moment because I'm training 5 times a week for my big trail race mid September, and have had some smaller races in between. I'm not teaching at the moment, so not sitting down, but working in and around the gites/garden which means I'm active all day.
I just can't face fasting when I'm running at least 10 kms (and sometimes 25kms) for a training session - and even on non training days I'm hungry. Really hungry.
Am also really happy with new man who is lovely and kind, not what I've been used to, so perhaps eating more than I should...

Anglaise Yes, the extra 2kg is probably water retention. Ignore it, unless it's still there in a couple of weeks

Running those distances and at your fast pace, you should NOT do FDs.
If it feels ok, maybe do 14:10 some days (very slim women athletes tend to prefer this to 16:8)

To improve performance at your level, you should average TDEE over training and recovery days.

Obv most of your carbs should be complex long-digesting ones, like quinoa, oats, wholegrain bread.
If you are still hungry, you may need bigger carb portions for energy - cut down on fat to compensate.

Your gentleman sounds like a keeper

I'm assuming you eat plenty of protein.

Thanks for your comments and advice BigChoc - unfortunately the scales this morning showed another 1kg increase and another cm so I think I may have mis measured...and I didn't run Saturday or Sunday, so it can't be down to water retention .
I can't fast as you say (going for a 25km run this morning with no fuel would be madness!)
So now 3kgs over goal, I haven't been that heavy for 4 years.
I'd never heard of 14:10 and that is very interesting, I'll try that. Is 14 hours long enough to get the benefits from fasting?
I need to cut down on chocolate snacking and eat more carbs, more of the long digesting ones instead of baguettes! Am eating plenty of protein.

Thanks for the support last week, folks. My news is that I’m being made redundant and my last day is in December. I’ve mixed feelings about it and holding onto the fact that having so much notice is comforting to an extent. I really need to be focused and organised over the next few months as well as keeping the emotional eating under control.

Writing off last week as not only did no fasting take place but goodies were brought into the office on two days which I had a fair bit of then on Saturday night I was out for some drinks with an old friend and lined my stomach with pizza beforehand. Fasting tomorrow and Saturday and avoiding scales until next week.

Have a good week everyone

(({ SED })) Really sorry to hear your news, obv a worrying PITA.
I hope you find another good job asap, so you can chill.

Anglaise Martin Berkhan of Lean gains reported that some very lean women athletes who trained intensely found 16:8 too stressful, so he put them on 14:10 with good results.
Your body composition and exercise demands are quite different to that of a typical 5:2er, so I would give it a go

Also, try NOCS (NO Crap September)
For 5-7 days per week:
. NO chocolate or sweet baked goods (even homemade)
. NO alcohol
. Replace white bread, rice, pasta etc by wholegrain bread, quinoa, oats

That should do the trick, but if little change after a week, then mfp for 7 days, to check cals too.

((((( Southeast ))))))
Awful as it is, a long redundancy period is actually harder than a short one : mine was 9 months and it really screwed with my head. Working for somebody who you know does not want you is really hard.
You'll need to do LOTS AND LOTS of rationalising and mindfulness to ensure that when you leave you have a positive attitude towards employment.

Is the money worth waiting till the last day or could you jump ship early?

Hello

Hope you're all well.

Sorry to butt in again with a question, but here goes...
It's about diet drinks - do they ruin the health effects of a fast? A friend of mine said your body responds as if they are sugar, so even if they don't contain calories the fast won't "work" as well. Does anyone know of any scientific evidence (or otherwise) of this?

(I do 6:1 for health reasons. On the fast day I try to go all day - till at least 6pm - eating nothing, but do have some diet soft drinks as well as black coffee/mint tea).

Many thanks in advance.

I used to have the occasional diet coke when I was in my serious 5:2 mode and I lost weight OK - but they were an occasional treat rather than a regular thing. My regular thing became Miso soup - it's not that you have to go without calories while fasting, it's that you have a very major reduction in calories during that period.

Thanks Castrus - that's useful.
I try to go for as long as possible (up to 24 hours) without consuming anything much at all (energy-wise) because I thought it likely you'd get the biggest health effects that way (though I admit I don't have hard evidence for this!). I guess the sugarfree drinks wouldn't affect weight loss (am not doing it for weight) but I wondered whether they'd affect the purported health benefits. Perhaps some of these things are guesswork!

Thanks again.

I see what you mean, TiP, and yes it's a bit hard at the moment and doubtless will get harder as time goes on. The package they're offering isn't worth me leaving me before December but it's not a huge amount and I've no intention of not working for anymore than a week or two, ideally. Also mindful of doing a costly postgraduate course either next year or the year after.

clock Diet drinks are very controversial - tip and I tussle discuss like civilised ladies regularly over this.

My advice:
Avoid diet drinks unless you really enjoy them. Otherwise restrict to max 330 ml daily
Her opinion: Satan's Whizz

There are 2 areas of scientific concern:

Insulin Spikes
A minority of people experience these with diet drinks, so they don't get the benefit of lower insulin and they also feel hungrier;
Others find say a Coke Zero replaces a pudding.
If you belong to the latter group, abstain.

Chemical toxicity
There have been countless animal studies (e.g. USA FDA and EU commission) which only show harmful effects at the equivalent of 40 cans per day.

Humans can't be force-fed 40 cans, so there are only epidemiological studies, where it's impossible to isolate diet drinks from associated unhealthy habits from those who mainline them.

So, no hard scientific evidence of any toxic effects.
Any increase in risk is over decades and is too small to show up statistically so far.

Oops, typo:
if you belong to the latter former group, abstain

bigchoc
TBH my big problem with diet fizzy drinks is hat they train people's palates to expect a steady stream of "sweet" rather than meal times and breaks - which is much healthier way of being

Sorry SED, that's rubbish news. Hope the next few months give you time to work out what you want to do post redundancy so you can hit the ground running at Christmas.

FD tomorrow, far too much indulgence this weekend after seeing 129lbs on the scales on Friday! A day late but starting no sugar September tomorrow too

Apart from naturally occurring sugars in fruit. My diet is restricted enough already and without fruit I have to give up smoothies!

Thank you BigChoc - that's very useful indeed. I'm guessing that an insulin rush might counteract health effects of a fast (although wouldn't know how to tell if I get them...). Might try to stop them anyway.

Good point about training palates TiP

Very impressed with this talk of giving up sugars - sounds tough. Hope it goes well.

I rarely eat desert because I honestly don't have that much of a sweet tooth, I'm not "being good" or restrained - I just don't fancy most of them. What I can't resist is a meringue - the huge ones - with chocolate or raspberry rippled though them. I also love candy floss - but I don't take sugar in drinks and I rarely eat chocolate or other confectionary . Weird I know but I just go with it now and every now and then have the sugar rush of pure indulgence

TiP has been bad failed sorry emoticon
DH working in London today so supper was Manhattan then spag bol then lemon drizzle cake and now cider

BUT
other than alcohol I can utterly take or leave sugar
DD bakes amazing cakes (and its DS belated birthday cake) so I always have a bit

Tip Sometimes you've just got to go with the orgy
My rule: don't spoil a blissful experience by feeling guilty.

Sounds delicious TiP (correct emoticon).

Oh god is alcohol like sugar, then?
I could perhaps do no sugar at a push, but no beer sounds rather horrible...

Excellent rule, BigChoc

No guilt.
I'm a stone lighter than I was 2 years ago when I started fasting and I only just got back to the gym : I can get back down to happy / fighting weight in about 3 weeks (especially as BodyBalance is back at my gym.

looking forward to the sushi meet up later this year