5:2 Diet Thread! Number 9, welcoming the new year...

[GreenEggsAndNichts]

The continuing thread for those of us following either the 5:2 diet or the alternate-day fasting diet. Both are two versions of Intermittent Fasting, which you can read more about here.

The 5:2 diet was featured on Horizon in August 2012, and essentially requires you to fast for 2 non-consecutive days per week. The other 5 days, you can eat what you like. Alternate-day fasting is just how it sounds; you fast every other day. By "fasting", we mean that we keep our calorie consumption very low, around 500 calories on average, on those days.

I know a number of people lurk on this thread, as this is currently quite popular. Please just jump in and post if you're new- we won't bite. Well, maybe on a fast day. You'll find a lot of support here.

Here is a list of links to get you started with this way of eating. Please let us know if you find a new article or some other information online:

First things first, here are links to some of our previous threads: most recent one before that another one etc!

Another thread which breadandwine has started is a good resource for some of the links and tips that get lost in these big threads. In addition to sharing links, we try to condense some of our top tips for fasting there. Keep in mind, we all do this differently, so these are just tips, not rules. This might be a good place to catch up with us if you're feeling a bit lost!

frenchfancy has a recipe thread over here, please post any low-calorie recipes there so they don't get lost in these bigger threads!

Here is the link to the BBC article regarding Michael Mosley's findings, which was featured on Horizon.

B&W has found a new link to the aforementioned Horizon programme here. If you're keen to see it, watch it soon, because BBC has been quick to find these copies and shut them down online. We're hoping they'll re-play it again soon. I know these threads are popular, maybe they'll read my request.

A blog post here gives some of the scientific explanation for why this way of eating helps you to not only lose weight, but improve your all-around health.

A Telegraph article which comments on the diet and gives a brief overview.

A study discussed here gives commentary specifically addressing the effect of this diet on obese people (both men and women), with regard to both health and weight loss. ("After 8 weeks of treatment, participants had an average 12.5 lbs reduction in body weight and a 4 cm decrease in waist circumference. Total fat mass declined by about 12 lbs while lean body mass remained relatively constant.) it also mentions "Plasma adiponectin, a protein hormone that is elevated in obesity and associated with heart disease, dropped by 30%. As did LDL cholesterol (25%) and triglycerides (32%).")

Important link if you are currently your ideal BMI: this appears to suggest the benefits for women at a lower BMI might not be seeing the same health benefits that are found on men at their ideal BMI.

And for those already fasting, here is a link to 100 snacks under 100 calories. We tend to favour lots of hot drinks during the day (count your milk if you use it!)

Another food link, here is a link to the BBC Good Food site, with a list of low-calorie soups.

We mentioned BMR and TDEE often. Total Daily Energy Expenditure (TDEE) quantifies the number of calories you burn in a day. This measure is best estimated by scaling your Basal Metabolic Rate to your level of activity. TDEE is critical in tailoring your nutrition plan to desired fitness goals. Here is a link to a calculator to help you figure out how many calories you should be eating in a day. (This is a new calculator to previous threads, this one seems to give me approximately the same results the last one did, but without the virus warnings on my browser!)

A BIG THANK YOU to all who have been contributing, btw. Most of us are learning this way of eating as we go along. All of the links above have been posted by others in our previous threads, and they've been very helpful. Sorry if I haven't given credit where it's due, but it was just enough of a job getting all the links re-copied and back into one post.

Come join us, and tell us about your experiences with this diet!

Hi NLaurak!
I have about 6-7 stones to lose (I have lost 7st about 10 yrs ago, gradually its all gone back on again...) I would recommend that you watch the Horizon programme vimeo.com/50912488 if you haven't already, it really tells you all you need to know & you get to see it "in action" as Dr Michael Mosley tries it for 5 weeks. I think this is a longer-term eating plan, I don't think you should expect a quick weight loss, if you read through the threads you will see that a loss of around 1lbs to 1.5lbs per week can be achieved. I'm hoping that I'll be able to keep it off this time! As you probably know, you'll likely drop quite a bit in the first week (mostly fluid) then a steady loss! I've ordered the book now just in case it might help motivate me... although I don't particularly feel that I need motivation yet... the first fast day is hard but it does seem to get better.
Best of luck!! Joey

Hi Guys, I just "came out" as doing this way of doing this eating to a friend of mine. She saw an article on the 5:2 diet in a newspaper (daily mail I think or the Mail on Sunday or whoever it was that had it recently) and mentioned it to me on the phone.

I started telling her about the Horizon documentary and then gradually slipped in that I had tried it and then did it for the last few months.

I hadn't mentioned it to her before as I was afraid it would sound crackers to someone who hadn't read about it, or seen the documentary. She doesn't live near me so hasn't seen me since I started doing it (so wouldn't have noticed the weight loss).

She is interested in it herself now, so I told her to read the rest of the article and that I would talk to her again about it when she had more time. I hope Horizon do an update, or even show the old programme again, as I could tell people about it without sounding insane if I bring it up.

Anyway I was very pleased that when I weighed myself Monday I seemed to be down 2 pounds from the previous week (even though it included 2 lunches out). That is 18 pounds down since I started last August. I am almost at my original goal weight (9 stones, or 126 pounds was my goal), just a pound to go. I might revise my goal down slighly, by about 3-4 pounds or so, as I would like to be a little slimmer. I suppose I am older now than I was when I was last at 9 stone, so I would have a bigger percentage of body fat now, and I cannot exercise now at all, so this would be a factor as well.

I had an old pair of trousers that I had planned to be able to fit back into (just for measure, they are not valuable at all) and they don't quite fit so I might lose an extra few pounds and see. I won't go too much under 9 stone though as I don't think it will suit me. I am 5" 4.

Once I reach a goal I am happy with I plan to do doing 6:1 or thereabouts for maintenance.

Rosemary well done you! For the Horizon film, read the post above yours.

There are also 2 other links to the programme on the Tips and Links thread - as well as the one referenced by Joey.

Talking of the T&L thread, I've just posted the following over there - thought it worth repeating here:

This 4 minute film by Dr Lustig (he of 'Sugar: The bitter truth' film and book) gives 4 tips for making your home safe for your children.

In summary, here they are:

Nr.1 ? Get rid of every sugared beverage in the house ? that includes fuit juice.
Nr.2 ? We need to keep insulin down ? by eating fibre. If you eat your carbohydrate with fibre, you will lessen the insulin response. Look at the side of the package, you need 3g of fibre or more
Nr.3 ? Wait 20 minutes for second portions. It takes that long for the body to realise it?s had enough to eat.
Nr.4 ? Buy your screen time with activity ? if you?re outside for half an hour, you can have 30 minutes of TV; if you spend an hour out on your bike, you can have an hour of video games (Good luck with that one - but it can be done!)

The film is here. Well worth watching.

Good luck to all the newbies bye the way. I would have thought it impossible for me to lose a pound or so a week before this, and wouldn't have thought I could stick to the "fasts" at all. I had lost weight years ago doing low GI diet but found it too restrictive, and felt hungry a lot of the time, and ended up giving up on it while I was on a holiday, and never went back to it (though did develop a porridge habit from it, which was good as it is very filling ).

I then gradually put up weight then over the years, but eventually managed through calorie restriction, and making some changes, to lose 2 stones or so over 2 years. But then I got stuck for a year and a half at a weight I felt was overweight for me (though at the higher end of normal BMI). Then I saw the Horizon documentary and decided to try it to shift the rest of the weight.

I HATE calorie counting, but only having to do it 2 days a week is not bad, and there are not many calories to count up so that makes it easier .

I have found some of the fasts hard, some very hard, others easy enough, but overall I don't feel like I am on a diet. Other than on fast days, I don't feel hungry or restricted, and never ever feel deprived, as I tell myself on a fast day that I can eat what I want the next day. On this WOE I can eat out, or eat at people's houses without feeling awkward, and fit fasts around this. I did lose the weight fairly consistently which probably helped to keep me motivated.

I'm not going crazy on the normal eating days, contrary to what some nutritionists/health-writers might have us believe Overall my diet is better than it was, though it was probably better than average before. I am cooking a lot from scratch, not eating a lot of snacks, and even when I buy ready-made stuff I look more closely at the labels. The 5:2 WOE got me more interested in experimenting a bit with my diet and I decided to give up eggs and dairy for a while to see if it improves my health (I was already a vegetarian) - Hi five to BreadandWine . I wouldn't have thought I could possibly be seperated from my precious cheese but so far so good.

Anyway I just wanted to say thanks to everyone for their posts on the various threads as it has been like a sort of support group for me reading all the messages and getting the tips as I didn't know anyone in real life doing it.

Thanks Breadandwine I will pass on that link to the friend of mine. I still hope they replay (or update) on the TV though as it would reach a wider audience.

Those 4 tips look good.

Hi back to all you oldies! It's true Laska we need to hang together as we may be at different stages in our WOE from the newbies, with different issues to address. And in my case, the only people who know I'm on this are my MN group. Don't want to have a lot of naysayers running this down as another harebrained scheme!

Hi Posters old and new, I think I am middle aged!

Did anyone hear about the burgers with horse meat in - another argument to give processed food a miss! we don't eat those but do have richmond sausages sometimes and they are very strange and pink.

Prob had 1000 cals today (fasting ) I made flapjacks and they burned - obv I couldnt give the burned bits to the children so .... Trying to make sure I at least do 16 hours before next meal.

Actually that was a good rule we figured out a while ago - baking and fasting don't mix - too much spoon liking temptation!

Feeling stuck in the middle: I'm not a newbie because I've been doing this WOE since 4 Sept, but not an oldie either because I only found this thread a few weeks ago.

I know what you mean about not telling too many people I see everyday I'm doing this WOE. So many knee jerk reactions based on nothing more than guesswork, I can't be doing with it. Back home my mum knows (because she knows I'd never try anything like this without doing hours of research first), that's it.

Here in China everyone knows as otherwise they shove food in my face and get offended when I won't eat it. To start with I think they all thought I was just the weirdo British girl but lately they've been noticing it works and asking me how to do it.

Not very keen on this whole oldie - newbie thing - it comes across as unintentionally slightly cliquey and it's not something I have ever encountered before on a thread on Mumsnet before. Whether we have been on this thread or or this diet from August or since January we all have valid knowledge to share about our experiences in nutrition, 5:2 and health. No one is an expert, we're all just plodding along trying to figure out the best way to achieve optimum health.

Don't wish to get anyone's back up

I with you snowkey but at the same recognise this is probably the last thread on MN where any dividing of the ranks will have been intentional, I've never known a tread to expand with people so quickly and be so welcoming. I joined on the first thread but don't get to post that often but certainly don't feel part of any clique.

Anyway, I think the point was just to encourage people who've been posting a while to carry on doing so as its helpful not just for newbies but all of us. And I love that even when a question is asked for the umpteenth time, nobody is told to go back and read the thread!

Last blast day for a while today, my mum and dad are having the DC next week so I can get some time catching up with my friends in London, before flying back to LA. I'll probably try to restrict food intake and thankfully have a few night at the theatre booked so won't b able to drink much, but on the whole I won't worry too much and will get back on it the following week.

Love that about this WOE

Watched Supersize vs Superskinny last night. What really struck me was the difference in peoples so called "normal" diet. We say on here to fast 2 days and eat "normally" for 5. I am starting to agree with some of the sceptics that for many people that simply won't work, because their "normal" is so ridiculously big.

The other thing that struck me was that Dr C was so insistent that the skinny guy had breakfast as it was really important for him to gain weight. But we are all told eating breakfast helps you lose weight. Slightly inconsistent me thinks.

Snowkey would you mind posting your egg curry recipe on the rece thread? Sounds delish

The gap between last meal of a feast day and first fast meal should be 16 hours? Have I got this right? Does that mean nothing at all? So yesterday was a feast day for me. I had crackers n smoked salmon at 8:30pm. So I can't eat anything until 1pmish? But I can have tea with milk?

Hi America - no never thought the slide into slight cliqueiness was ever intentional, I just wanted to make an observation from the outside.

Will post my curry sauce and then additions can be added. Tis a bit of bung this in, taste and bung bit more in and cook till dh gets home....but will attempt to provide quantities and times.

Just never heard of it with egg, and I bloody love eggs so any excuse to eat more always good!

lottie I think I'm right in saying most of us don't count tea or coffee as breaking the fast but we do count the calories used in the milk. The more I read, and the more people write about their experiences, the more convinced I am a full 24hr fast would be best for the health benefits, but for me personally I can't cope without my morning cup of tea but also manège a fast day much better when I leave it as late as possible to eat.

Ok, help please! At mum and dad's, we're fasting today, just looked through their fridge to plan for today...either miso or a pre prepared soup for lunch at 140cal, I always put aside 50cal for milk so have 300cal to play with at dinner and have the following things:

Chicken (100g 190kcal)
Broccoli (100g 34kcal)
Feta (30g 85kcal)
Chicory (100g 23kcal)
Eggs (65-78kcal)

Any thoughts? Also got quite a few fresh herbs in...

Ah, we'll if you make a curry sauce - through in some coconut milk, top with boiled eggs. Other methods involve deep frying boiled eggs. Love egg curry - I think it's probably home style Southern Indian food (my preference) rather than British Indian restaurant style.

lottie63 you don't have to wait until 1pm ifyou don't want to. The main thing is to stick to 500 kcal or less on your 'fast' days. Some of us are trying to get in 16 to 20 hour fasts on the 'fast' days too but it's not compulsory.

Does anyone have the link for Dr MM new website handy?

thefastdiet.co.uk/

I'm on fast day 5. actually looking forward to it today. how weird is that!

Thanks frenchfancy

America that food list is looking like a tasty salad - make is a warm one with lightly cooked broccoli & fennel - it will bring the flavours our - maybe some capers, garlic and chilli to give it a little zing. Basil would work too.

Ok, experiment over. Im going back to 400 kcal of biscuits plus milk in tea for fast days from Saturday.

I had been playing around with what I eat and how much to see what happened. The result: days where I eat 'proper' food (instead of dry biscuits) and stay inside the 500 kcal I get too hungry and want to give up ; days where I reduce the number of calories (in the hope of working my way up to a 24 hour fast) I don't get hungry but I do get very irritable and want to stuff my face with cream cakes (if I could find any in this seemingly dairy-free country) ; days where I stick to what I've been doing all along: no hunger, no irritability .

Ah well, at least now I know!

Morning all, just wanted to say I got the Hairy Dieters cookery book for Christmas, it's got some really nice low calorie meals and the calories for each are shown too. A good idea on fast days as it keeps you busy preparing it and guilt free eating it!