5:2 Diet Thread! Number 8, fast away fast away fast away all!

[GreenEggsAndNichts]

The continuing thread for those of us following either the 5:2 diet or the alternate-day fasting diet. Both are two versions of Intermittent Fasting, which you can read more about here.

The 5:2 diet was featured on Horizon in August 2012, and essentially requires you to fast for 2 non-consecutive days per week. The other 5 days, you can eat what you like. Alternate-day fasting is just how it sounds; you fast every other day. By "fasting", we mean that we keep our calorie consumption very low, around 500 calories on average, on those days.

I know a number of people lurk on this thread, as this is currently quite popular. Please just jump in and post if you're new- we won't bite. Well, maybe on a fast day. You'll find a lot of support here.

Here is a list of links to get you started with this way of eating. Please let us know if you find a new article or some other information online:

First things first, here are links to some of our previous threads: most recent one before that another one etc!

Another thread which breadandwine has started is a good resource for some of the links and tips that get lost in these big threads. In addition to sharing links, we try to condense some of our top tips for fasting there. Keep in mind, we all do this differently, so these are just tips, not rules.

frenchfancy has a recipe thread over here, please post any low-calorie recipes there so they don't get lost in these bigger threads!

Here is the link to the BBC article regarding Michael Mosley's findings, which was featured on Horizon.

Here is where I would link to the aforementioned Horizon programme, but it appears as if the BBC have finally noticed it on YouTube and have taken it down. Here is a link to the programme's page on iPlayer, which features a couple of clips, and might have updates eventually. Let us know if you find another site hosting it.

A blog post here gives some of the scientific explanation for why this way of eating helps you to not only lose weight, but improve your all-around health.

A Telegraph article which comments on the diet and gives a brief overview.

A study discussed here gives commentary specifically addressing the effect of this diet on obese people (both men and women), with regard to both health and weight loss. ("After 8 weeks of treatment, participants had an average 12.5 lbs reduction in body weight and a 4 cm decrease in waist circumference. Total fat mass declined by about 12 lbs while lean body mass remained relatively constant.) it also mentions "Plasma adiponectin, a protein hormone that is elevated in obesity and associated with heart disease, dropped by 30%. As did LDL cholesterol (25%) and triglycerides (32%).")

Important link if you are currently your ideal BMI: this appears to suggest the benefits for women at a lower BMI might not be seeing the same health benefits that are found on men at their ideal BMI.

And for those already fasting, here is a link to 100 snacks under 100 calories. We tend to favour lots of hot drinks during the day (count your milk if you use it!)

Another food link, here is a link to the BBC Good Food site, with a list of low-calorie soups.

We mentioned BMR and TDEE often. Total Daily Energy Expenditure (TDEE) quantifies the number of calories you burn in a day. This measure is best estimated by scaling your Basal Metabolic Rate to your level of activity. TDEE is critical in tailoring your nutrition plan to desired fitness goals. Here is a link to a calculator to help you figure out how many calories you should be eating in a day. (This is a new calculator to previous threads, this one seems to give me approximately the same results the last one did, but without the virus warnings on my browser!)

A BIG THANK YOU to all who have been contributing, btw. Most of us are learning this way of eating as we go along. All of the links above have been posted by others in our previous threads, and they've been very helpful. Sorry if I haven't given credit where it's due, but it was just enough of a job getting all the links re-copied and back into one post.

Come join us, and tell us about your experiences with this diet!

and thanks of course to everyone else who replied!

Hello to Rosina Copper, that was one of my favourite books!

So today I've tried to be really good and do a proper fast day. If I can just get my head properly around it all and get a set of meals sorted so that I know what I can eat on a fast day, I should be ok.

Bit of background - I'm 5'2", and at 10 stone 4 pounds currently weigh more than I ever have done. 18 months ago I weighed 8 stone 9 thanks to WW, but as I was bf twins while I was following their diet, it was easy to lose the baby weight, because I got double the daily points allowance (had extra for feeding each baby). So although losing the weight was relatively easy, keeping it off obviously hasn't been! I've dabbled with most of the diets going - and of course they all work (while you are following their rules) but what appeals to me about this WOE is that it totally makes sense in using it as a way to reduce weekly calorie intake and that perhaps it isn't so hard to say 'no' to a Twirl today, if I know I can have one tomorrow, if I still want one. I've had a couple of false starts with this since the MM programme, though, and just need to get my head properly around fast days I think, which is where threads like this and hearing success stories is just what I need.

I also thought that if I make what I'm doing public, I'm more likely to stick to it!

So, having read up on the Genesis diet, I had 300ml of milk and used it in coffees to get me through the morning (this meant I didn't get a 16 hour fast, though). At lunch I had a pitta bread. Then I made some biscuits for the school fair and had a couple of those (for quality control purposes!)That's it, apart from some sugar free chewing gum. So tomorrow, I'll have to try to get plenty of fruit and veg in, because I've eaten nothing with fibre in it today! Or shouldn't that be a problem?

Bordercollielover - clearly one of mine too, but I rarely come across others who feel the same!

So I blew the diet and got totally and utterly slaughtered instead. Does that mean if I fast tomorrow it doesn't matter?

FlojoHoHoHo -! Drink a litre of water and go to bed that used to be my way of cancelling it out :D

Rosina people often have 100 cals worth of skimmed milk for tea or coffee through thge day then 400 cal for dinner or split the cals in to a lunch and breakfast of 200 cals and eat something like soup or eggs. However I appear to have lost 2 lb this week by eating gingerbread so whatever works!

Also Rosina it seems to work well if people avoid bread on a fast day for foods that are more filling, this is prob good for having a flat tummy the next day too, although you can have bread - I don't think there are rules about how you should use the cals its just worth experimenting with what works for you.

If you only use 100 cals for your hot drinks then you can eat a normal balanced meal at dinner - roast dinners have come up a few times as satisfiying when the food is weighed and cals worked out on My fitness Pal.

I count the calories used in tea and coffee but don't really count it as breaking the fast. No way can I start the day without a cup of tea swiftly followed by a strong coffee.

Have got back into the bad habit of snacking constantly on feed days rather than having proper meals. Never mind. Last fast day tomorrow for a week!!! Argh....

Hello - just a quick message from a lurker to say this thread and all the links are really helpful and interesting. I am only doing 2 fast days through christmas week as an experiment and to minimise Christmas gain (usually on slimming world).

Was really surprised how I got through yesterday without feeling very hungry - although I did feel really lethargic and almost jet lagged in the evening. Not sure what to do today now - trying to re trigger my hunger by eating bigger than usual portions.

Will try again next Thursday and see how I get on. Might come back to this woe after I have finished breast feeding.

Good luck to you all with it

Hi Rosina welcome!

I have to have milk in tea - and can't start the day without large quantities of it - and I've lost 22lb so really it is a small thing to worry about - just find the pattern of fasting that works for you.

It really does get very easy after a few months - it's not a "diet" as such - so you can never "fall off the wagon" with a treat, we are basically learning to adjust what we eat to either lose weight or stay at a stable weight. It's a bit like learning to drive and getting the hang of accelerator control, learning to ease off and slow down. It takes a while but then becomes second nature - my ex SIL asked me if I was still fasting and I realised that I didn't think of it as 'fasting' anymore - just some days I don't eat much to compensate for the days when I do - I really do feel like I have control over my weight now (finally!) and happily ate Christmas cake this week with not the slightest feeling of guilt

Yo Ho ho all, well i've finished work for the break and starting my serious Christmas cooking today , (wot ?! haven't made a cake yet? Ee're not having one this year but DH doing a pannetone instead and ill be making h/m mince pies (h/m mincemeat too !!) Yea I love mince pies but haven't eaten more than half of one for years as always felt so bad doing so because WW telling me JUST how fattening they are ! So THOSE are going to be my Christmas treat..(I can live without all the other snack

So my plan is to eat light from now until Christmas eve evening when it all starts round here ...miss lunch today and possibly tomorrow and fast again Sunday/Monday during the day)

'Official' Friday WI shows STS in weight for me today but that's from a loss earlier this week .. hovering just above the 10st .which is utterley brilliant considering I was almost a stone and a half heavier when I started this in August . Hopefully this time next week ill be roughly the same weight but this is a WOE so ill be back fasting on the 27th (and no doubt with relief..)

I never thought when I started this that id actually prefer my fasting days.. I'm not obsessive ,I love my food and cooking and eating so its not about the not eating so much but its the feeling of energy and clarity you feel (oh yes ,and all the lovely new frocks )

Well call me a media tart but I've just emailed the media person .. if it is for Dr Ms website its got to be good , and If not well , yes I may be making some journos life easier . but I think the message about the benefits of this WOE does need to be spread ..

Cyclistist - (where are you Bro?) said a while ago that 5:2 its a bit like a cult or a political movement .. I agree Come Comrades (or fellow Evangelists) Now is the time to free more people from the tyranny of New Year miracle diets! (clenched fist emotion!)

Right off to cook up a Christmas calorific storm.. but i wont be eating until this evening

Hello! Just weighed in again and I've now lost 4-5lbs. I'm going to go with 4 and put my starting weight at 12.7 although it fluctuated. So 4lb loss in 2 weeks!
I have fasted more than 2 days per week, I have just gone with fasting any day I don't have plans with friends, so I think I have done 5/6? I haven'tstuck to 500 though, about 600-700. I am really so pleased to have discovered this, it is so easy and is working!

I'm currently trying to recover from my second bout of flu since starting fasting in August and i mean proper flu with raised temp and aches and pains. My Mum is convinced that fasting twice a week has lowered my resistance to infection. She might be right, there was some suggestion that the reason why people didn't live longer years ago, despite fasting through food shortage was that it did lower your resistance to infection and infection was what people mostly died from back them - thing is I can't remember where I heard that from - I'm sure it was a podcast, I'd like to listen to it again.

Will probably go see my GP after Christmas and ask about getting my bloods done, I haven't had a flu since 1996 and then I get it twice within 3 months of starting fasting - it may be a coincidence but it's something that I need to give more thought to.

Snowkey.. sorry to hear you are ill. but just for the record (but of course this can no way be counted as evidence either way ) i've never felt healthier.. haven't had one cold so far since starting this and there's been tons of nasty viruses going around at work. Maybe you've just been unlucky .

Snowkey
I would have to disagree with your Mum. The winter cold that is going round is a stinker and is indiscriminate in who it hits. Stay warm and hydrated.

Weighed in today.
No loss, no gain. But hey! I've lost the stone I planned to this term. I'm at a healthy weight that I could contentedly maintain for the rest of my life. I'm really looking forward to Christmas. But am also looking forward to fasting again in the New Year.
And that is why this WOE works.
Because we all seem to actively look forward to the restriction days
rather than dread the grind of week after week of banned foods.

Erik
If you can manage at least one strictly to 500 its linked to the metabolic chemical changes that will do you extra good when weight loss is just a memory.

Nettee
there are a couple of others doing breast feeding and fasting
the main thing is to stay healthy so you and littl'un both thrive

Flojo
Getting slaughtered is fine, so long as you give your liver a PROPER rest a couple of days a week (proper = total = no booze)

Snowkey sorry your feeling ill. I remember at one point a lot of people on here had colds but not so much lately, maybe your body will settle down if it is linked with fasting. We have had a couple of bugs in our hosehold (3 children under 7 ) but I only got very slight symptoms for one of those really. Feeling pretty good in general (knocks wood) x

If my risk of infection has increased as a result of fasting it will become more apparent, in the meantime this study may suggest it has some effect.

jem.rupress.org/content/103/1/109.full.pdf

Have heard back from the media contact .. It is for Dr Mosley's Fast Diet website..

Snowkey
That paper is from 1955 ; it talks of making mice fast for 36 hours
FFS - that's like making a person for with no food for ten days [hmmm]
no wonder the poor little buggers got sick
later in the paper they inject virus into the mouse lung and then deprive it of food for 48 hours - and in that time the mice lost between 10 and 20 % of their bodyweight.
But in the conclusion it shows that letting them eat sensibly had no negative impact on recovery.

Or to put it another way, do not starve yourself when ill.

Sorry I can't remember her name and don't have time to check back at the mo but the blogger who was on here a while back (probably thread 7) reference a study, I think in a nursing home, where there were significantly lower rates of hospitisation and lower (but not significantly lower) rates of death death amongst the ADF group (the fasting calories were higher than 500 though - possibly 900?)

Laska

I'm a bit confused. Does Dr MM have a Fast Diet website already or is it currently being constructed?

its being constructed .. will be up when the new book is out in January

Thanks. I've pre-ordered his book and hopefully some of our questions will be answered within.

I'm currently laid low with flu but I completely missed the horrid D&V bug that touched everyone I know a month ago - so who knows?

I tend to not get colds but this year generally have had a few, I personally think its America I'm allergic to

Bought in my favorite fasting soup for today - I normally have half that and sons eggs or whatever but each half is only 170kcal so in going to spoil myself and have the whole ruddy lot as my fast day food - cant wait!