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Fasting / 5:2 diet

Talk about intermittent fasting and 5:2, including what’s worked for others. Mumsnet hasn't checked the qualifications of anyone posting here. You may wish to speak to a medical professional before starting any diet.

5:2 Diet Thread Part Six! Now's the time to de-lurk and chat with us..

984 replies

GreenEggsAndNichts · 25/10/2012 12:49

The continuing thread for those of us following either the 5:2 diet or the alternate-day fasting diet. Both are two versions of Intermittent Fasting, which you can read more about here.

The 5:2 diet was featured on Horizon in August, and essentially requires you to fast for 2 non-consecutive days per week. The other 5 days, you can eat what you like. Alternate-day fasting is just how it sounds; you fast every other day. By "fasting", we mean that we keep our calorie consumption very low, around 500 calories on average, on those days.

Here is a list of the links we've gathered so far about this diet. I hope I haven't left many out, but we've filled several threads by now. Please share if you find something particularly useful, and we'll add it for the next thread.

First things first, here are links to some of our previous threads: most recent one before that another one.

Another thread which breadandwine has started is a good resource for some of the links and tips that get lost in these big threads. In addition to sharing links, we try to condense some of our top tips for fasting there. Keep in mind, we all do this differently, so these are just tips, not rules.

frenchfancy has a recipe thread over here, please post any low-calorie recipes there so they don't get lost in these bigger threads!

Here is the link to the BBC article regarding Michael Mosley's findings, which was featured on Horizon.

is a link to the first part of the aforementioned Horizon, subsequent parts of that episode are linked on that page.

A blog post here gives some of the scientific explanation for why this way of eating helps you to not only lose weight, but improve your all-around health.

A Telegraph article which comments on the diet and gives a brief overview.

A study discussed here gives commentary specifically addressing the effect of this diet on obese people (both men and women), with regard to both health and weight loss. ("After 8 weeks of treatment, participants had an average 12.5 lbs reduction in body weight and a 4 cm decrease in waist circumference. Total fat mass declined by about 12 lbs while lean body mass remained relatively constant.) it also mentions "Plasma adiponectin, a protein hormone that is elevated in obesity and associated with heart disease, dropped by 30%. As did LDL cholesterol (25%) and triglycerides (32%).")

Important link if you are currently your ideal BMI: this appears to suggest the benefits for women at a lower BMI might not be seeing the same health benefits that are found on men at their ideal BMI.

And for those already fasting, here is a link to 100 snacks under 100 calories. We tend to favour lots of hot drinks during the day (count your milk if you use it!)

Another food link, here is a link to the BBC Good Food site, with a list of low-calorie soups.

We mentioned BMR and TDEE often. Total Daily Energy Expenditure (TDEE) quantifies the number of calories you burn in a day. This measure is best estimated by scaling your Basal Metabolic Rate to your level of activity. TDEE is critical in tailoring your nutrition plan to desired fitness goals. Here is a link to a calculator to help you figure out how many calories you should be eating in a day.

A BIG THANK YOU to all who have been contributing, btw. Most of us are learning this way of eating as we go along. All of the links above have been posted by others in our previous threads, and they've been very helpful. Sorry if I haven't given credit where it's due, but it was just enough of a job getting them all in one post this afternoon. Wink

Come join us, and tell us about your experiences with this diet!

OP posts:
MakeHayNotStraw · 12/11/2012 10:59

Yayyyy for the weight losses! Nice one Flowers

breadandwine I meant to say thanks for the pancake tip - I'll give them a go with just flour and water.

ferfuxake · 12/11/2012 12:43

Hi all. I'm giving this WOE a go, starting with a fast day today. I would love to lose 10lbs by Christmas. Totally unrealistic? Need to lose 1.5 - 2 stone in total.

Am hoping to hold out to eat until this evening and then to have a quorn and veg stir fry. Does that sound OK?

Also a quick question: is sugar free chewing gum allowed? I find it stops me from thinking about food too much...

GreenEggsAndNichts · 12/11/2012 12:50

ferfuxake as long as it doesn't have calories, it should be fine. I picked some up, myself, but seem to have misplaced it. Confused Shall stick with my coffee today. Your plan to hold out for dinner is a good one. Or I should say, that's what I do!

Really well done AfterEights and other losers. TOTM here so shall weigh in again once it's over..

OP posts:
TalkinPeace2 · 12/11/2012 13:04

6:1 - the health benefits remain even when weight loss is no longer the issue.
So long as there is one decent (say 20 hour) fast per week, the body will stay in repair mode.
Alternatively, once you are lean (I'll not use thin / slim) then relax a bit more on your non fast days and stick with 5:2 :-)

lilacbluebell · 12/11/2012 13:30

grrr, fast day and DH has had a bacon sandwich while I was at work, which I can still smell. Thanks for helping H x, plus tonights family is meal one of my favourite comfort foods (I made it for last night, but with being out we didn't eat it so it's left for tonight). It's calling me but I'm not listening!

TellMeLater · 12/11/2012 13:45

TIP2 can you direct me towards the research that supports your suggestion that health benefits remain for 6:1 - dh is losing too much weight and doesn't want to reduce down to 6:1 in case he dilutes the health benefits.

TalkinPeace2 · 12/11/2012 13:49

tellmelater
it is touched on in the articles about people who have been doing IF for many, many years (including my yoga teacher's teacher!)
They do full intermittent fasts, without any weight loss part of it, just for the health benefits....

Laska42 · 12/11/2012 13:54

Hi all ...Well I made 22.5 hours fasting !! I tried for 24 through to 3pm today but its just so cold and damp here today I had to have some miso soup to warm me up and thats just lead to me eating my egg salad (but yesterday was 500 cals and today probably not much more as I only have white fish, salsa and broccoli planned for later and then will go another 16hrs .. .

This is notthe 'recommended' WOE, (if there is one! ) just my playing around with itand experimenting with timings , now im contemplating going down to 6:1 ..But at the moment (2nd weekof doing this) I feel this Sunday /Monday fast thing is definately working for me. This week though ill probably do another Wednesday also ,as I cant really this Thurs ..

Strange ..how such simple food: h/b egg , cue red pepper, tomato a couple of olives and lettuce tastes so good and satisfying after nearly a day without anything.... Smile

Size10underallthisflab · 12/11/2012 14:31

Hello! Delurking to join this thread if I may. Smile I've been doing the 5:2 for 3 weeks now and have lost 11lbs!

A) Fasting since Oct 22nd
B) 2 fasts a week
C) I fast for 2 consecutive days - normally Mon/Tues ( from last meal Sun to breakfast on Weds )
D) Benefits - definately the weight loss. I've piled on the pounds since having the kids
C) None really although it would be a lie if I didn't say I find the afternoons quite hard especially when I'm giving the kids tea.

I generally factor in a cup or two of coffee in my calorie count then just eat one decent meal in the evening. I'd struggle going to bed hungry. I work 3 nights a week in a supermarket joy and find myself checking the calories of things as I go around sticking labels out. It's quite fascinating! Grin I have a BMI of 25.33 and my first goal is to get to 23.10. I have a stone to go. If I could reach that goal by Christmas then I'd be delighted. I'm vegetarian so eating healthily and watching my calories should be easy if I can fight my cravings for the 3 C's - crisps, cheese and chocolate! I do find after doing my two fast days I don't want to eat as much on my normal days so that's got to be a good thing! Smile

TellMeLater · 12/11/2012 14:56

Tip2 i had hoped you would have more robust evidence than people inferring that the benefits remained - how do they know they are still getting the health benefits - dementia, Alzheimer's, cancer prevention - how would one person know that about themselves? Did they even get their bloods tested at regular intervals, analyse the effects of 5:2 vs 6:1 even in the short term - because that's the kind of thing I'm looking for otherwise i struggle to be convinced that 6:1, will work as well as 5:2 from a health perspective.

I know the studies are thin on the ground but I suspect there is a decline in benefits as fasting frequency declines but it seems that the point at which benefits tail off is yet unknown. This was also suggested when Dr Mosley found the benefits of his 3 day fast diminished quite quickly but no investigation into when it happened and how best to keep the benefits at max levels.

babbas · 12/11/2012 14:57

Isn't it hard when it's TOTM ! I'm sure my period will be early this month as I've got a plotting headache and am struggling with today's fast. Not actual hunger but more head hunger. Grrrr.

TalkinPeace2 · 12/11/2012 15:04

tellmelater
as we all know the evidence is going to follow the anecdote.
I read LOTS of science stuff - the fact that so many thousands of people are playing with IF after the TV programme has caught researchers utterly on the hop.
The multiple of anecdote is not evidence
but the evidence will start to flood in soon on widespread testing of IF by the general population, rather than just health geeks

we ARE the lab rats :-)

I've been on an unrelated cohort study for many years - its only a matter of time till they pick up on it!

TellMeLater · 12/11/2012 17:13

TIP2 It's just when you said this to another poster further up the thread.

"6:1 - the health benefits remain even when weight loss is no longer the issue.
So long as there is one decent (say 20 hour) fast per week, the body will stay in repair mode."

It sounded like you knew this for a fact when you didn't - no one does and I just think it's a bit misleading to suggest this without any back up for what you say. Telling someone that dropping to one fast a week won't alter their health benefits is wrong - we don't know what effect it will have - the information isn't out there yet.

Trills · 12/11/2012 17:21

Can I join the "not really doing it properly but still doing it a bit" bench?

Went to the gym at lunchtime - it's the only chance I'll get this week. Not very conducive to fasting. Had soup (planned) then two slices of bread as well (less planned), because I was reeeeeeally hungry. Will not be able to skip dinner, so I'll be 2x bread and butter up on my intended food, but gym will sort of counteract that.

welshmill · 12/11/2012 17:26

Tellmelater a while ago I posted a link to a study done on mice which involved a 16 hour fast followed by an 8 hour feeding window which in mice at least had beneficial effects on their health. The mice didn't eat less than their control groups, although they did lose some bodyweight. Breadandwine very kindly put it in the links section. It would be great if the scientists in question were to try this with human guinea pigs as I for one would be very interested to see if this might be the answer to keeping the health benefits without really losing any more weight (not that I'm anywhere near that yet!).

babbas · 12/11/2012 17:39

Oh dear. Having a really bad day. Massive headache and tummy ache. Starving and can't stop crying. So fed up that fasts seem to be getting harder and harder. Would be less fed up
If I'd lost more than 1lb in 9/10 weeks of 4:3. Trying hard to cling onto unseen health benefits but just feeling so low and emotional today. I know it's TOTM hormone induced but I just find fasts are getting harder physically and mentally.

babbas · 12/11/2012 17:43

Oh dear. Having a really bad day. Massive headache and tummy ache. Starving and can't stop crying. So fed up that fasts seem to be getting harder and harder. Would be less fed up
If I'd lost more than 1lb in 9/10 weeks of 4:3. Trying hard to cling onto unseen health benefits but just feeling so low and emotional today. I know it's TOTM hormone induced but I just find fasts are getting harder physically and mentally.

GreenEggsAndNichts · 12/11/2012 18:06

babbas why not move to 5:2 and see if it helps? There is no reason to torture yourself with this if you aren't seeing the results you'd like to from it. I know others may say otherwise, because there are other health benefits, but if you're doing it for weight loss, it's not working with your current method. If I were you, I'd give it a break this week, maybe go down to 5:2 or 6:1, and see if things don't change.

You've been eating your TDEE on non-fast days, right?

OP posts:
babbas · 12/11/2012 18:58

Greeneggs thanks for your reply. I have decided to move to 5:2 upon your advice. 4:3 is not working and i think I eat my tdee but just don't know for sure if I'm over or under. Also, I think I need a break from everything. It's my birthday next week and I'm feeling low with my total failure to turn my life around. I have 20lb to lose and when I embarked on healthy lifestyle in sept I thought i didn't realise I'd lose nothing. I'm going to do 5:2 this week and just relax about it all. Again thank you for your reply. I'll report back next week.

Piebaldrider · 12/11/2012 19:03

babbasI agree with Greeneggs drop to 5.2 at least for a while and give yourself a break. I firmly believe that if something isn't working then change it or mix it up a bit and see what happens. You may well not be eating enough and your body has gone into starvation mode. Why not stay off the scales for a bit and or try using a measure or clothes size as an indicator of how much actual fat you are losing. I cant recall if you are exercising at all but taking a little exercise increases your feel good factor . Aknowledgeing that TOTM is making you emmotional is good and now you know its only annoying hormones bringing you down and you will get past it quickly.

frenchfancy · 12/11/2012 19:11

Babbas I agree with the others.

If you have been doin 4:3 for 9 weeks and have only lost 1lb then something is wrong. Either:

  1. You are over eating on your feed days - but this is unlikely as you are doing 4:3 so you would have to be almost double your TDEE to have no loss.

  2. You are not sticking to 500 cals on your fast - which I don't think from what you have said is true.

  3. You are not eating enough and your body has gone into starvation - I think this is likely given your mood.

OR

  1. There is an underlying health issue, perhaps Thyroid.

My suggestion would be to keep a food diary for a week (on 5:2). I know for many it defeats the point of this WOE but I think it may be the only way to find out what is wrong. Post your figures here if you are brave enough - we'll be kind I promise.

If a food diary doesn't show up anything obvious then I think a trip to the GP is in order - but for this the food diary will be very useful.

babbas · 12/11/2012 19:27

Thanks pie and french. I exercise 5 days a week with shredding and walking or tae bo. I do stick to the 500 cals but think I may be undereating calories during the week. Have had bloods done and nothing wrong. I am staying off the scales and will do what another posted up thread and measure myself. To mix things up last week I cut back on the exercise to 3 days and tried eating more. Nothing works. I felt really healthy the first month fasting but recently I feel unwell. I feel I'm not eating enough on fast days and not eating properly on non fast days either. The feeling of wellness may have been in my head but I wish I could recapture it. I feel sluggish, moody Fatigued and like a failure some days. I wonder if anyone else in this big experiment feels the same ?

Skinnyeye · 12/11/2012 19:33

Hi Losers, Gainers and Stay the Samers. Fast day for me and as usual kept all my calories for dinner. Tucking into a veg stir-fry with proper noodles - none of that superglue stuff for me. Grin Switching to 4:3 this week and attempting a weekend fast for the first time as I have been returning to old habits at weekends and gaining what I have lost during the week. Gonna tough it out for another stone and then go back to 2 fasts as I know I can maintain weight on 5:2

healstorturepeople · 12/11/2012 19:38

I have decided to do alternate day fasting until Christmas. Today was my second fast day. I am worried I am doing too much exercise for the amount of calories. Today I had 600 calories but did 3 hours exercise (90 minutes pretty gentle and 90 minutes moderate gym). I really want to boost my weight loss so don't want to miss the gym on fast days. Do you think this is too much though?

I had a bad day food wise as had nothing in the house so no fruit or veg. A small bowl of porridge at about 8.30am - 200 calories. A slim fast shake at about 1pm - 230 calories. A 2 egg omelate at 7.15pm- 170 calories. Also vitamin suplement and plenty of water, green tea and no sugar squash.

Grateful for any thoughts.

firemansamsmam · 12/11/2012 19:46

I have a question for the experts on here...

I have done 3 fasts now over the last week or so, the first two I started after lunch at 2pm, then continued until 2pm the next day. I read the Sunday Times article that said one of the experts in the field does it that way. I stuck to 500 calories and that included breakfast, lunch and dinner the first time, then the second time to get a 16 hour fast in, I skipped breakfast.

As I did 24 hours straight, after 2pm I then reverted to normal eating, so I didn't have another lunch, but had a pack of popcorn to carry me through to a normal evening meal.

I felt like I was cheating, so today when I woke up I fasted all day and was planning to fast till tomorrow morning. But doesn't that mean that I am effectively fasting 31 hours instead of 24? I.e. 7pm on Sunday night to 7am on Tuesday morning?

Does it matter when you start your 24 hours? As I started at 7pm last night does that mean that I have now done my 24 hours and can have a bloody biscuit???

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