5:2 Diet Thread: Part Three. Come join us!

[GreenEggsAndNichts]

The continuing thread for those of us following either the 5:2 diet or the alternate-day fasting diet. Both are two versions of Intermittent Fasting, which you can read more about here.

The 5:2 diet was featured on Horizon recently, and essentially requires you to fast for 2 non-consecutive days per week. The other 5 days, you can eat what you like. Alternate-day fasting is just how it sounds; you fast every other day. By "fasting", we mean that we keep our calorie consumption very low, around 500 calories on average, on those days.

Here is a list of the links we've gathered so far about this diet. I hope I haven't left many out, but it was a 40 page thread! This is a good start for anyone, though:

First things first, here is a link to our previous thread, which we've outgrown. Lots of good support and ideas still to be found there.

Here is the link to the BBC article regarding Michael Mosley's findings, which was featured on Horizon.

is a link to the first part of the aforementioned Horizon, subsequent parts of that episode are linked on that page.

There is a Wiki article here which explains intermittent fasting and gives a short summary of some studies which have been done on it.

A blog post here gives some of the scientific explanation for why this way of eating helps you to not only lose weight, but improve your all-around health.

A Telegraph article which comments on the diet and gives a brief overview.

A study discussed here gives commentary specifically addressing the effect of this diet on obese people (both men and women), with regard to both health and weight loss. ("After 8 weeks of treatment, participants had an average 12.5 lbs reduction in body weight and a 4 cm decrease in waist circumference. Total fat mass declined by about 12 lbs while lean body mass remained relatively constant.) it also mentions "Plasma adiponectin, a protein hormone that is elevated in obesity and associated with heart disease, dropped by 30%. As did LDL cholesterol (25%) and triglycerides (32%).")

Important link if you are currently your ideal BMI: this appears to suggest the benefits for women at a lower BMI might not be seeing the same health benefits that are found on men at their ideal BMI.

And for those already fasting, here is a link to 100 snacks under 100 calories. :)

Another food link, here is a link to the BBC Goof Food site, with a list of low-calorie soups.

I will start a different thread just for recipe links, though, as there seems to be some demand for that.

A BIG THANK YOU to all who have been contributing, btw. Most of us are new to this diet. All of the links above have been posted by others in our previous thread, and they've been very helpful. Sorry if I haven't given credit where it's due, but it was just enough of a job getting them all in one post this afternoon.

Come join us, and tell us about your experiences with this diet!

God, that link is a bit bloody scary...

I might give it a miss until there's some more research published as it sounds like it's not a good idea at all for healthy weight women. Thanks for the link!

Greeneggs Kaloo
I do not like that link at all
Many of the slim women at my gym have effectively been intermittent fasting all their adult lives - otherwise known as skipping breakfast and lunch. Some of them are grandmothers.
I'd like to see a meta analysis of women with a BMI consistently under 22.5
as the big problem with all medical research is that it is dire at checking out the "H0" hypothesis.
Kaloo My bmi is 22.4. I have several friends with BMI under 22.5 who are doing versions of fasting to the insulin / alzheimers reasons only.

Case in point : I was involved with a medical study into back pain - they were brave and recruited 200 people with no history of back pain. They broke the data block early to tell us that most of the H0 group did yoga ....

I have been involved in a cohort study for 14 years and have had mine and DHs and the children's bodies studied extensively, particularly with regard to allergies and athsma. Hence I avoid those boards on MN!!

Talkin yes well, I agree to a certain extent. I don't have any personal experience with doing this WOE at a normal BMI, though, and as she was asking about that specifically, I thought she'd be interested in the possibility that it might not work as well for her as it does for overweight women. It wasn't my intent to frighten her away from it.

I was within the normal range of BMI to start, 24.4 (11st 4lb, 5' 8") five weeks later I am BMI 22.8 weight 10st 10lb.

I am aiming for 10st 4lb which is BMI 21.89, almost slap bang in the middle of 'normal' (which is the weight corresponding to most of my smart clothes )

I'm a normal BMI - been doing this a week and lost 2lbs, but think a lot of it is because it's encouraged me to generally eat less. I'm now BMI 20.7, to be honest not paying attention to the weight thing as I'm also training for a mammouth bike ride which should mean increase in lean muscle which weighs more. But would like to see the end of my muffin tops and post-pregnancy jelly belly!

I'm no expert, but those who are more expert (the people on the programme for example, others such as Briffa) seem pretty clear that ANYONE with a history of EDs should not be doing fasting... I really don't think it would be good for the mental health of someone who has suffered from, or come close to anorexia or patterns of eating found in anorexia.

Many of us posting here are overweight. It may be that it is suitable for low weight people for the health benefits but if you're at risk of tipping over into obsessive denial or food phobia etc then it probably isn't worth it. IMHO.

First fast of the week for me almost over. Not too bad, feels good to have one under my belt so early on iyswim!

Have recognised the importance of not taking family (or other potential stress inducing) phonecalls the hour before my last/main meal. This is the time I am most likely to cave and eat/crave wine, choc, etc. Need to keep that time very busy or very calm, one or the other, they both work.

Am off to bed now, well done fellow fasters, keep it up all 5:2 and varients, I think this is a real breakthrough.

Well said wilfsell I totally agree. There are health benefits to this WOE, but as with anything, moderation is key. Too much calorie counting or fasting could have negative effects. Balance is the key. If you find yourself obsessing over food, it's not right for you. The thing I like is that I don't have to obsess, on eating days I eat what I feel like, which is grand

Mousey that is good to hear, as it sounds like you are fairly like me in terms of age and weight. Not that I'm training for a mammoth bike ride, but you know

wilfsell and LemonCurd I totally understand what you are saying, and it does make sense, but my way of thinking is that restricting 2 days a week is better than trying to lose weight by more drastic methods, like trying to restrict every day, or only eating certain things. What I like about this is that you only have to think about what you eat 2 days a week and can eat what you like the rest of the time, which is far more reasonable than most diets.

Hi everyone, may I join you?

DH is a scientist (genetics background) and we'd heard of some of this research last year. After the programme I got very keen but waited to discuss with GP as breast feeding. I got a grudging go ahead, as the baby is only having a morning and evening bf now, at 14 months old.

So, I started on Tuesday. My portion control has spiralled out of control lately, so I expected it to be really hard. It wasn't too bad. I fasted on Thursday and as well today. Im not having any of the nausea or headache problems. But I'm not very hungry on feed days. 3 healthy, smallish meals, no snacks, except perhaps fruit mid afternoon.

DH now thinks this is how the diet works; that your stomach shrinks so even when you are allowed to eat more, you don't. Also, the healthy things you eat on fast days help break sugar cravings. (I've given up sugar alongside 5:2, but not low carbing in general.)

I only want to weigh myself once a week, but I've lost loads of weight, I can feel it. I had a stone to lose to be at top end of bmi. I think I've lost half that in a week.

Any thoughts?

4th fast day, 1st one this week - really hungry and about to cave to evening snacking tendancies so going to bed!

Not a great fast day, have kept under the 500cals I'm pretty sure, but it's been consistent snacking throughout the day and (eeeeek) 153cals spent on beer. Oooops....4:3 this week again then to make up for it! Planning on fasting again on Tuesday and Friday...

Just weighed myself after my first week on this plan . Have lost 4 pounds . though I expect a fair bit of it was fluid as I was premenstrual last week and was weighing in even more that usual. Any way am very pleased this is working . I ve been doing 4:3 , will continue that for another week and then drop one fast day.
Feed day today, will celebrate with hot buttered toast and peanut butter.

Have put same 4lb back on. Fasting says are Mon and Weds.... Try again this week. Feeling a bit disheartened :-(

Lemoncurd, that is the bit I love, eating what I want on feed days. That is definitely the thing that keeps me going during a fast day, thinking 't'is only today, tomorrow I can eat what I like!' and yet I invariably don't eat all the crap I imagine i will.

Am brewing first cuppa, and then am going to the gym. Have a good day folks.

I am 10st after a weekend of eating and drinking - I started this about 5 weeks ago at 10st 9lbs so am very pleased.

I find my sugar cravings are much reduced. My portion sizes are smaller and am eating more veg.

Thina -don't be disheartened, the weight loss can be a very strange thing with this but you should see a downward trend after a few weeks.

Fasting day for me and good thing too after a weekend of much wine and stodge with a good sprinkling of sugar...I'm in need of some restraint.

Heavier today than I have been in a long long time...tis the carb overload from the weekend....so no boozing planned till Thursday -

My first official weigh in today after starting this 10 days ago and three fasts so far.... 0.5 kilo down. I am slightly disappointed if I am honest but having said that as I see this as long term it seems like a good start. Ideally I want to lose about 5-6 kilos.

I have been exercising lots too, 5 days of shredding, three fastish bike rides and three runs. Fasting tomorrow and think I need it!

Well weighed in today as regular. Have gained 0.75 of a pound compared with last week. Fasted Weds / Thurs / Sat last week & did go out for a curry last night, so maybe am still full.

Or as it is Week 7 has my body figured out what is going on & stopped losing? A full 7 weeks in and lost just under 4lb.

Will fast Mon / Weds and Sat this week.

good luck to all those fasting.

First fast day of week 2 for me. Not weighing til Thurs though as that's my usual weigh day so want to get back to that. Feeling a bit down, worrying its not going to work but need to keep focussed to get through the day.

Good luck to all the other
Monday fasters!

Recently theres been a lot of debate on here about losing lots of weight and not ?..
This is not meant to be patronising - I know it does seem so a bit , but I cant think of better words to write what I want to say so please don?t take it to be. It?s just my take on this way of eating WOE and people?s possible expectations

Lets face it, a lot (probably most of us) are doing this because we want to lose weight, possibly lots of weight. That includes me..

But I?m fortunate enough to be hopefully near the end of my weight loss journey, having been at it for some years and lost 3 stone over all . I?m Post menopausal, and today 10.12 for my 5'5 frame. So I do understand what its like to want to lose weight and lose it fast, and I do understand the desire to be ?really slim? for once in my life....I REALLY DO .

But I agree with those above who have pointed out that this fasting business is a DIFFERENT WOE and should be seen as such, and not just a tool for weight lose (as Dr Mosley and colleagues pointed out, weight loss is a welcome but possibly secondary result );but for its hopefully beneficial health benefits also. .. The chance to live a bit longer, reduce potential strokes, diabetes .ETC ,

Yes, it does help us lose weight and that?s great , but in the short time these threads have been here I?ve seen a few, like me, lose 8-10lbs and who haven?t yet lost much more,

BUT they are sticking to it , because it seems to work in other ways even if the lbs don?t seen to be going . Many of us have reported definite reductions in waist and tummy size (like me). Lots of people have commented on how they have discovered that their hunger is not such a frightening thing after all, we can cope - we don?t need to stuff ourselves at the first feeling of emptiness.. and it doesn?t build as we feared it might. Plenty of us have reported having much more energy, and over and over again people have said how, amazingly, they don?t feel the need to eat everything in sight on an eating day, and also that they have eaten stuff they NEVER would on another ?diet? and not only is there no guilt , but no great weight gain either.

But yes, some of us have struggled with how it makes us feel, headaches, loss of sleep , food anxiety etc etc ..but those here who have been around a while mostly seem to have reported that these do fade.

But we also know the science is fairly unresearched on humans, and none of us are experts The scientists havent even come to a conclusion.. We have some indications that maybe it works better for men than women ( aint that always the case!). Also that if you are at ones correct BMI (which can still mean you want to lose another stone!) ,it may not be so effective for weight loss, (which is frustrating if you just do want to be rid of that last stone - like me!).

Now pardon me for maybe being really patronising here..and let me assure you I do not mean to be, for ive struggled with this over the years myself.

I do think the problem is that Society (i,e the fashion and media industry) is geared to making us feel that we shouldn?t be just slim, but THIN!! , If you look (and it is out there,) recently a lot of the research shows we actually live a bit longer at a slightly higher BMI , than at a lower.

I agree at 5.5 I might look better in my clothes at 9st 7 rather than 10.12 but probably actually NOT that much better , not so much that many people rather than me would notice. And at what price? I don?t think id be noticeably fitter than I am now. But I would be struggling with what I can and cannot eat (having guilt and self-loathing attacks when I eat something ?forbidden?. Making my friends and family guilty and their life hell because I cant eat or do what they can? Maybe I will get there one day on this WOE and maybe I wont , (most likely not as I?m well over 50 and haven?t been that thin since feeding DS 22 years ago ) ,

But this WOE feels like it liberated me from having to feel guilty when I do eat, I?m FAR more relaxed around food (that is so called ?naughty? food that beforehand I?d never allow myself to eat with out massive guilt) .And everyone?s asking me what am I doing that I wasn?t doing before .

So I feel I really am going to stick with this now.. Also I?ve discovered something ?...A lot of my ?naturally slim friends . (i.e those really annoying people we all know who have never yo- yo?ed or don?t diet ) , have told me that they ?quite naturally? eat this kind of way .. up one day , down the next - and kind of thought that?s totally normal..

I?m certainly not into advocating total ?fat ?acceptance? (or fat un-acceptance either!) here, but I think its good if you (ME) can get to a ?healthy? weight for you because hopefully its going to help you live longer and be happy with your self ,

But that?s it, A Healthy weight.. I really agree, with those here who have said if you want to be thin really thin and are looking for this as a way of starving yourself , or if you?ve has eating disorder in the past that this is not the WOE for you..

OH sH*T I know I?m going to get lots of flack for this post , but I do feel strongly enough about it to post it anyway...(head down, Laska!)

With love and respect
Laska

Laska I can't find the original post you're responding to? Or are you having a discussion with yourself? I agree with what you're saying.

I think one issue, for those of us who have struggled with our weight (I might have been a normal weight for a period of my life, but that doesn't mean I wasn't struggling to maintain that) is that we don't always know the 'right' way to eat, and when we DO ask a health care professional, "eat breakfast" is almost always on the list. There is no idea of an extended break between meals, because we "need to eat small meals to keep our metabolism up" etc.

So, whilst some may naturally just not eat breakfast, or skip other meals, those of us who are wondering why we aren't losing, when we ask we're told to do pretty much the opposite of those people.

Now that I've said that, I'll repeat: this is working for me. Yes, it's only been a month and a bit, but then, I only heard about the concept a month ago. I could easily keep this up indefinitely.

oh and welcome to the thread, Disorderly :)

It's an eating day here, and I have a raging sore throat so am having a cup of fruit tea with honey. I hate fruit tea.

I have prepped a sourdough focaccia to bake today (anyone who's used sourdough knows it means proving for ages beforehand!), and given the state of my throat, am wondering if I have the ingreds for chicken soup around. No celery but think I have everything else.

Good luck today, fasters. :)

Perhaps I am just musing to myself Greeneggs its quite normal for me to go arounf muttering ! , But there do seem to have been a few people who seem to be having worries about not losing enough or who are at their healthy BMI , but still are concerned that they want to lost quite a few kgs more....

Im eating today!! yum yum yum ..

oh and i do sourdough too,, have a starter thats at least eight years old