Spring 22 music thread

[thirdfiddle]

Roll up roll up for a new term of music parenting! This is a long meandering series of threads for all things musical. Please do say hi if you're new or lurking.
Delighted to see on the last thread that musical things are up and running again in the new term despite some covid nerves. Here's hoping for a smooth normal as possible run.

I'd agree that by Grade 7 she probably does need a longer lesson, either 45 mins or an hour. Ds has an hour. I think 45 mins would be ample but he spends a lot of time also chatting to his teacher about all sort s of other musical related things such as conducting (his piano teacher is an experienced choral conductor and has been helping ds with technique, and playing around with ideas for composition etc. I don't mind this as it adds to ds's all round musical education and he is older (18).

Grade 7 at 12 is fantastic though. Perhaps she just need sto slow down a little, do you think she maybe took the exam slightly too early?

Has she ever tried out for NYMT? It's too late for this year (unless you play horn or bassoon) but I highly reccommend.

Yes, you may be right

I think she is very good at getting things to a pass standard (and usually a merit standard too - she was unlucky with this one I think) very fast, and very bad at then polishing them to the point at which she would get a distinction.

Some of this is probably age and maturity, and some not-very-musical parenting (I don't know when and how to help her to make things better). Add to that lockdown - where she didn't see her flute teacher in person for a very long time as she was learning at a Saturday Centre that wasn't open even when in-person lessons were allowed, and a tendency to massively overcommit herself because she loves to do EVERYTHING, and you've not got a recipe for excellence on one instrument.

Lots to think about, anyhow!

and you've not got a recipe for excellence on one instrument.

I've got a friend who is a talented flautist and teacher. But she makes much of her living not from playing flute but from the plethora of other wind instruments she learned, some formally (2nd study picc etc) and some self taught. She plays for a very prestigious theatre company and also in lots of musical theatre pit bands.

So the excellence in one instrument needed to say be a player with a classical orchestra isn't always as useful as the versatility of being able to play reeds/sax for a musical theatre show.

And your dd is really young so has lots of time to mature.

Also, what are we aiming for here? A career as a professional musician, or just enjoying playing at a good enough standard to enjoy it?

DS wants to use his singing prowess to get a choral scholarship to Oxbridge. We shall see!

I don't have any idea what she's aiming for - she likes to get into orchestras and choirs that make her happy and she wants to make her teacher happy by getting decent marks. Beyond that, I have no idea! But I wonder whether being a 'jack of all trades and master of none' means she won't be able to do any of the things she thinks about doing.

@comefromaway I have mentioned NYMT - she does play bassoon, but not well enough yet - she hasn't got time this summer anyway but she'll probably try out next year - think she'd love it!

@minisnowballs I was meaning us, and me, in general I guess. I worry about him not reaching his potential, and I guess learning to apply oneself for discernible reward is an end in itself, but I'm not sure how much to push it. If he did nothing but hardcore practice two hours a day he could be amazing, but if he doesn't want to be a professional pianist, is it worth it?

@herbaceous it sounds like he's amazing anyway- is singing his first love though - two hours of piano on top of all that singing sounds like loads to me, but I'm aware there are children who would want to do that much. Mine sure isn't one of them!

Great he knows he wants a choral scholarship - sounds like he's working towards that fantastically!

He will stop being a chorister at the end of this term (😭), so I'm fretting about that too! Amazing voice (has already done loads of professional recordings etc), but will have no formal outlet for it. And, of course, it will break within the next year or two.

I think that trying to get the metronome to be part of practice is really important if you can manage it.

My piano teacher used to keep hers in another room and when you screwed up the timing badly enough would say 'I'm going to go and get the metronome' and then bring it through like a symbol of your failure! God knows why it didn't live in the room she taught in. Anyway, the reason for telling you about my weird piano teacher is that the metronome was always a punishment and I didn't see it as helpful. Incidentally my counting was awful!

Anyway- with my kids I try to use it more frequently - once they're reasonably fluent in a piece we play along for the first few bars to check the tempo or working through any tricky bits we do it with the metronome and maybe just slow it down.

Anyway, the upshot is, try to avoid keeping it in another room and then processing through holding it aloft with a look of disappointment!

You can get metronome watches that vibrate if your child is struggling with a metronome. I have an old-fashioned clockwork metronome and it can be difficult to hear the ticks when you're playing the piano loudly, especially when it's set to a slow speed.

Those agog will be thrilled to know that at the weekend DS did 30 mins concentrated practice, hands apart, then slowly, of the tricky bits of the Debussy. Played it through again tonight, and loads better. He plays it so rubato, metronome would not be helpful!

Debussy and metronomes really aren't a good pairing- the music actually had directions that it should be fluid re timing! DD is currently working on finishing off learning Debussy's Fille aux cheveux de lin and it's more about keeping the flow of the piece moving whereas for things like Bach for example though it's more helpful.

I think this whole metronome conversation started really as a discussion about how to help practice sessions, and it's clear that they have their place. I'd argue that place isn't in another room, but equally not for every piece or every part of a practice. It's really just one thing that they can do, along with working on short sections, playing them very slowly and focussing on fingering / breath patterns for wind etc. I also think that scales are pretty helpful and doing a couple each time is probably better than a last minute pre exam cram!

Well done herbaceous

Today we have heard a flute practice involving
a) scales - shocker... I bought the book so she knows what to work through - she likes a structure so that's good.
b)Playing through pieces but then picking a two-line difficult bit to work on - which improved! and then isolating trills and working on them
c) shrieky piccolo (you can't have everything and she does seem to really love the piccolo).

Will try to remember this one when we inevitably have a stressful one again soon.

There's something to be said for playing even Debussy with a metronome occasionally. Ensures you are doing the rubato for musical reasons and not as a crutch to get you round tricky corners.

This is also true! DD definitely not fluent on her piece yet so falling into that trap- I think that it's helpful for part of most practice.

Lots of music happening for dd at the moment - concerts and recitals galore!

I wanted to come on to say best of luck to any dcs sitting gcse or a-level music exams. Hope they go well.

That sounds good QueenMabby. We have had the very depressing news that DD2's school will no longer offer inschool GCSE music (a covid casualty) for her year, because no-one wants to do it.

She is really cross, and wants to consider lots of other education options. We are not so sure. We have always liked the school very much - and the rest of the music is actually very good, so she has just been unlucky in her year group.

Given she'll probably have two grade 8s at least by the time she actually takes any GCSEs and already has the theory, we're wondering what to do as it may be she doesn't really need it.

On the plus side, it has concentrated her mind. She's much more passionate about music now she can't do it!

@minisnowballs That's awful a school can't even offer gcse music. How have they put so many kids off it. From a low base our school is gradually building up thankfully. Hopefully the variety of music in the rest of the school means this is just a blip. Can she do a level without gcse?
We don't have as many events this term as last term but still got a few things. DD finally getting to perform with JD orchestra for first time this year, will be good to be allowed in the building and see what they have been up to.

@minisnowballs that’s not good that they won’t run it. DD is 1 of 2 pupils doing A level at her state school. The music GCSE was beneficial to the A level in terms of building on the composition done at GCSE as well as the wider understanding of music. DD’s off to study at a conservatoire in September so perhaps I’m biased but if music is what she wants to do further it might be good to look at other options.

I think we will have at least one higher music class and usually around 6-8 take advanced higher. Plus music tech classes. It's a large school so that is one benefit, most subjects are able to run. Although the standards are not yet that high, they are getting better. It's partly because you only have to be about grade 5 for higher now, instead of grade 6/7 in previous years. This was a deliberate move to increase participation, which it has done. Now, hopefully they can lift aspirations as well.

This is a big school (eight form entry, all girls!) - they had a missing teacher after Covid and allocated all the music teacher time to the older years. DD2s year therefore had supply teachers who just showed them power points. Unsurprisingly no-one picked it.

They may be able to offer it after school, which is something - but it looks like they'll have several children who are sub grade 1, and DD2 (who has taken grade 7 on her first instrument and obviously has the theory). That's a tricky gap to bridge.

I suspect there won't be a cohort for A-Level with no GCSE, but other local sixth forms may accept her without the GCSE. She's 12, so this just feels like a ridiculous thing to even be thinking about.

@minisnowballs - that's such a shame for your dd. And in such a big school too. Music is really suffering.

There's about 150 in DD's year. She's in year 8 and they take some options for next year (not gcse ones) and she reckons there will only be one class of pupils taking music in year 9. Fortunately there's quite a few post grade 5 students so hopefully there'll be a decent number taking gcse in due course. Dd will definitely take it but probably not to A-level.

It is sad. What is weird is, if she moves, she won't necessarily have access to as much good 'other' music as she does now. At her current school she has excellent cello and singing teachers in school (far better than you might expect in a state comprehensive, and very encouraging), and a chamber choir as well as a really good afterschool senior choir option. She can take aural classes at lunchtimes if she wants, and theory. She also has Lamda (loves musical theatre), all of which make her happy.

The alternative is that could move to local state school with music 'scholarships' which grant school places- but may well find that she only has one orchestra (as opposed to a post-grade five instrumental group, flute group and concert band as well as two choirs). The average standard, while higher than the GCSE group mentioned, would still be grade 3-4 at her age, even among the 'scholars' - though there are some outliers.

But she would be able to take the GCSE. It's a tough one. Of course we could send her to an independent school but I'm not really sure of the value there.