May/ June Music and Musicians Thread

[Wafflenose]

Welcome, everyone. I can't believe we need a new thread already, but I'm delighted that they now seem so popular!

I'm Waffle, I'm a music teacher and I have two daughters - Goo (10) who plays the recorder, flute, piccolo (a bit) and started the piano a month ago, and Rara (8) who isn't as musically inclined but plays the cello and recorder. She is plodding (very) slowly towards Grade 3 on both.

We're going on holiday this weekend, so will have to have a good read when I get back. For now, I'll wind the thread up and let it do its stuff.

Non music question here, sorry!

Misti would you be able to explain to me briefly the higher education university system in France and the cost of it? I am thinking that if by chance we do stay in the EU DS may as well look at all his options including studying in the EU, France being the closest option (besides Scotland Wales and Ireland of course).

Fleur have you got about a week? actually I may not be the best person to ask, as we're not quite there yet, so I probably only have a partial view. I'll do it briefly here but if you want more info just PM me.

The post-bac system is more complex and more flexible than the UK university system, so this is a very simplified view, but academically-inclined students typically choose between

• two year courses that lead either into employment or further study eg BTS usually at a lycee or a course at an IUT (like an old polytechnic but in its original meaning ie a technical college not a substandard would-be university) - both these would require a pass in a bac general or techno, so three half decent A levels would suffice
• a 3 year university course at "fac" (uni) - only entry requirement is a pass grade in your bac
• a "classe préparatoire" based in a lycee for students attempting the entrance exams to elite HE establishments, these are selective and recruit "sur dossier" ie based on continuous assessment marks and teachers' comments in Y12 and 13.
• a specialist school - examples being an engineering school, or Sciences Po, which recruit either "sur dossier" or by a very tough entrance exam (Sciences Po pass rate is about 10% and only very ambitious candidates even bother applying in the first place - but there is a different route for international candidates).

Cost varies, university (fac) is just a few hundred euros a year usually, but some of the specialist establishments are more expensive, sciences Po for eg is going to be means tested in future, fees will rise to maybe €3-4k a year. Private will be more expensive still, but probably still cheaper than a UK uni.

Thank you Misti that is an eye opener, I think talks about EU made me think more about all the opportunities EU can give us as a family including studying maybe cheaper abroad. I wonder if you can get a student loan here and study abroad. I assume not but it is still cheaper to finance DS through uni in France by what you said than England. No doubt I'll PM you but after the 23rd June as there may not be anything to talk about after this date. But feel free to PM me if you have more info, maybe from British students in France if you have a community there as I know you DD is French (from a citizenship point of view) so th rules may be different.

Fleur at the moment I think you would qualify for a student loan/grants/ benefits in the host country, on the same basis as a home student. Does your DS have dual nationality?

DD had her last but one piano lesson before the holidays today. For her next long piece, she was offered a choice between a Liszt rhapsody (to which she said thanks but no thanks) and two Schubert impromptus, op 90 nos 3 and 4. She's opted for the last of those. That'll keep her busy during the holidays .

I love those 2 Schubert impromptu!

Misti good point DS does have EU passport, expired but it can be renewed. DD doesn't have dual citizenship, I got bored by the time I had her so I didn't see the point of having two passports but I can apply for it if needed.

Off to YouTube the Schubert impromptus.

I am through with Goo and exams. I never felt that this one was a good idea, but I was overruled by her, DH and mostly by the teacher. After a week of barely going near the flute, I told her that she needs to really. She agreed, and asked me to do some aural with her - all good. She has done Grade 6 aural before, but still needed reassurance about every tiny little thing. I then had to test her on scales, and she lost her temper. Apparently they are awful (they're not - tiny slips) and she is going to fail the exam because she's going to fail the scales! She then went to walk off, so I asked if she was planning to practise the pieces at all this week. So she grudgingly did one, declared it terrible, and didn't have an answer when I asked her what she thought she should do about that. I offered to pull her out because it's affecting her attitude, and she yelled, "Why would you pull me out unless you thought I was going to fail?!" Goo has done 11 music exams, and her lowest result was a merit. I have tutored pupils through 300-400, and can safely say she is on course for a merit or more. I'm just sick of the drama. She won't be doing any more exams unless she asks to do them herself. This will be her 5th consecutive session of taking a music exam (and there were two last term). She still wants to play and have fun, but 90% of her time with the new teacher (5 months) has been spent on exam stuff.

Thanks for letting me rant.

Wafflenose You described my DS when he was going to do his exam ... The drama is so wearing ...

I remembered she was the same before theory exam, I think she is just...anxious. I would let her be, help her if you can but dont expect too much. I think its a preteen symptom too. It will get better. There will be no exam for sure until at least November so there will be a lovely break in between

I think greenleave is right waffle, it's a mix of hormones and anxiety. It does sound like she needs a break from exams though.

Fleur you don't need to have a passport, citizenship exists quite separately from the documents that prove it. DD doesn't have a french passport yet and we probably won't even bother until her british passport has nearly run out, she's 15, she doesn't need two passports at once!

I've googled the Schubert impromptu now btw and although the score doesn't look particularly frightening, it's bloomin' fast and there's an awful lot of it! She's already made a start on it and the first page is easy to play slowly - at speed will be another matter entirely .

Waffle I feel your pain! she is very young to have done so many exams and if she's getting stressed then I think you could safely cancel the exam and tell her you're fed up with the drama!
However, I have to suspect she's not stressed. She knows she knows it. She will pass the exam. She possibly does like the drama! Maybe pretend there is no exam and don't get drawn - if she has any concerns she should talk to her teacher and let you have a break! I think you have all the stress - both in worrying about your own students and worrying about your DDs!

Misti In my experience it's not hard to play just fast enough to sound nice. And the last part is more or less a repeat of the beginning. In fact there are lots of repeated patterns. It's immensely satisfying to play. :)

Waffle I agree with Green, I think this is just how she copes with anxiety, she sets her mind (and yours) on low expectations (I am going to fail, I know I will) so she can cope with a potential fail even if she is prepared. I have all this to come as DD is quite similar but on a lower scale as she is just 8. I am sure that is where we are heading.

Misti good luck to your DD with Schubert. The only way I could prove EU citizenship is with a passport as DCs are born here, I believe my embassy would issue a birth certificate or something in order to apply for the passport but can't remember what the document is. I did it 15 years ago for DS, I think it was a birth certificate. If so indeed I don't need another document for him.

I am starting to believe DD may be grade 5 by next March. There are some things she did with Fur Elise, Beethoven sonatina, bartok that have technically left me baffled. And is not just me being proud, her teacher is also amazed how her technique is coming on. Now waiting for the new syllabus to be issued to see if she could play anything.

Thanks, and you are all right! On any other thread, I'm sure we'd have had loads of people wading in telling me we're putting far too much pressure on her, but no, she does that all by herself!

YES to a mix of hormones and anxiety, to enjoying drama, to setting her mind on low expectations... and possibly knowing she will be fine really! She's complicated, and the younger one is even more so at the moment. Well, in some respects Rara is straightforward because all she does is read and draw, but she has issues surrounding speech and repeating herself (along the lines of selective mutism), does a good line in being all misunderstood, and is also secretive. I've got my work cut out here.

Greenleave amazing results for theory, good luck with the real thing!

Wafflenose it is perhaps nerves taking its toll - my dd was doing ok all the way through, all of a sudden her sound became horrible, she is pressing the bow too hard, it is not straight - all sorts of a beginner mistakes! It is just a matter of wait and see if they can pull themselves together on a day....

Fleurdelise, Ds Mentioned something about some changes in Germany making it more attention for UK students,. Can't quite remember as didn't pay too much attention.
Dd1 said her exam was OK, whatever that means. Dd2 has hers in 2 weeks. Her piano exam will be next term, dd1 exam term after that, brass exam term after that...you get the gist....
Dd2 can be tearful if there Is a chance that she can't do things perfectly and will say she is rubbish at everything.

Can anyone advise please... Dd's teacher suggested a lesson just straight before the exam (1 hour). She is missing school this day anyway. Alternatively we can do the lesson late evening before.... Not sure what would be the best strategy? It is a good idea to warm up with the teacher just before the exam but on the other hand I am worried she may be tired... What would you do?

Not expert in music exam, but would not want 1 hour lesson just before exam. Would be a nervous wreck by the end of it.

No, 10 minute warm up is fine, 1 hour lesson far too much, even for the night before in my opinion.

Just came back from hearing some amazing Jazz and a fantastic singer, who regularly sings at Ronnies.
I have a weekend of jazz and I'm lapping it up, dd is jealous as she is at school and can't join us atm
Off to that there London on Saturday, really looking forward to it.
Then South of France. woooh my NewLife is beginning, and I've had a few lagers after the interval when my help was no longer required

Dd has a Jazz gig in a popular Manchester music venue coming up, local comp, but not much more. She's asking her dad if he'll put her on at one of his gigs and he's saying nooooooooo
Really looking forward to the holidays now.

Thank you your expertise ladies, I think you are right, it is too risky to have such a long lesson before the exam... Will speak to teacher about it....
xxx

Theory.
Bought few books as a supplement to ABRSM books and they arrived yesterday
This series looks great-theory/ qestions/answers
www.amazon.co.uk/Theory-Time-Grade-David-Turnbull/dp/0711997454/ref=pd_sim_14_4?ie=UTF8&dpID=51qzcDHwlsL&dpSrc=sims&preST=AC_UL160_SR115%2C160&refRID=MY0CTV4WN0T7DME0AR2B

This looks fantastic esp for younger children as there are plenty of pictures, puzzles, etc, clear layout and relatively big font (the orchestra section is ...yummy :)!). Can be bought 1-5 grades in one book or separately, answers are sold separately.

www.amazon.co.uk/Rachel-Billings/e/B003VNH58S/ref=dp_byline_cont_book_1

Only thanks - I have bought the grade 5 Turnbull one - reckon there are three of us in this house who will use it!