May/ June Music and Musicians Thread

[Wafflenose]

Welcome, everyone. I can't believe we need a new thread already, but I'm delighted that they now seem so popular!

I'm Waffle, I'm a music teacher and I have two daughters - Goo (10) who plays the recorder, flute, piccolo (a bit) and started the piano a month ago, and Rara (8) who isn't as musically inclined but plays the cello and recorder. She is plodding (very) slowly towards Grade 3 on both.

We're going on holiday this weekend, so will have to have a good read when I get back. For now, I'll wind the thread up and let it do its stuff.

I am sure it can be done as obviously *musicathome"'s Ds has achieved it, I am still impressed with the progress though as piano is one of the hardest instruments.

So if DD would get to grade 5 clarinet by a stretch of imagination by next year I would be proud but I would think it was achievable due to her previous music experience with piano and clarinet is considerable easier coming from piano.

The other way around I think though, going from single line of music instruments to reading two lines of music with your hands doing something different which requires so much more coordination (with all respect to other instruments, I find it mind blowing to see DD and other pianists reading two lines of music and their hands flying around the keyboard doing different things) I find it so much more impressive.

That is why I think Goo and musicathome's Ds impress me so much and while I will be proud of any progress DD makes on her second instrument I think it would have been harder to achieve the other way around (first clarinet then piano).

With regards to musical ability DD seems to have it but I am not able to make a judgment myself other than seeing her singing all the time, seeing her commitment and love for music. But I do trust her piano teacher who believes she is very musical.

That doesn't mean she'll follow a musical career, God knows what she'll end up doing, she changes her mind everyday (now she'll apparently be an ice skater) but I hope music will always be part of her life.

Mistri and Green, I completely agree that progress of an older child with other instruments already at a higher level cannot be compared with progress made by a younger child on their first instrument.
My 12 year old started the piano when he was 11 and his sigh-reading and aural skill were already at Grade 6ish level and he had grade 5 theory.
To me having Grade 8 on an instrument, although very hard to get to and requiring lots of practice and hard work, simply means that you can play it very well and have mastered it. Maybe you do not even need to be musical to get there, just hard working. Similarly to say getting to level 10 swimming. Probably the real work is what happens beyond grade 8.
I never played an instrument when I was a child, but have now taken up the violin together with my youngest child (5 years old). It is never too late to start and it does give me pleasure when I master a piece, but it is hard work for me

Fleurdelise do not get me wrong I am very proud of my eldest DS getting to Grade 5 piano in less than a year and he did not practice very much; 3-4 times a week initially shorter spells building now to about 1h.

I have heard from other places that piano is the hardest instrument, etc. I am not sure I agree. Yes, there are two line to read at the same time, but then you sit down and press the keys; you have to be coordinated but this is so much true with other instruments. With brass and woodwind instruments you have to read one cleft, but you also need to control your breathing and posture. With cello (my 8 year old plays it) and violin (my 5 year old) your body and posture is very important. So I am not sure that piano is the hardest instrument to learn, but as there are music teachers on this thread. they will be best to comment on it.
To me, piano seems not so hard to get going, but a beautiful instrument to master.

I am sure it can be done as obviously *musicathome"'s Ds has achieved it, I am still impressed with the progress though as piano is one of the hardest instruments.

So if DD would get to grade 5 clarinet by a stretch of imagination by next year I would be proud but I would think it was achievable due to her previous music experience with piano and clarinet is considerable easier coming from piano.

Obviously the population of children who have the motivation to learn three instruments is small, so you're starting off with a small and self-selecting sample of children who are definitely "musical".

I'd add that what I said above is really mostly relevant to secondary school age learners - I think it would be hard for a much younger child to progress that quickly because to get to grade 5 in a year, or grade 8 in two years, a lot of the learning has to be done alone, at home. My DD doesn't need to learn her pieces with her teacher: pieces are set, she takes them home and learns them, and then lessons are spent working on dynamics and pedalling etc. I doubt many 8/9 year olds would be capable of that, however gifted (unless they had musician parents).

Of course I don't know all the instruments in the world and I may be wrong stating piano is the harder instrument but you do need posture (and a lot of it from what I can see in Dd's lessons) to play the piano. Since passing grade 3 piano a lot of Dd's lessons involve heavier tehnique and it does involve a lot of her body (her elbow, her back, her muscles behind playing forte passages, peddaling at the same time) so I wouldn't dismis it as a sitting down instrument.

Misti I am then very proud of DD, her lessons very much involve assigning pieces/passages to learn nowadays and then going over the tehnique and dynamics, polishing in lessons. But the initial learning is happening at home. I do need to sit by her though ( for support maybe) while she does her practice.

I find it hard to compare instruments, because the difficulties are different and it depends where you start from (a recorder player learning sax is going to find the early stages very easy once sound production is grasped).

I think piano's reputation for difficulty is that it's often a first instrument for rather young children for whom two hand coordination may be more complex. Plus, learning two clefs at once adds to the cognitive load for little ones. For older students though it has the massive advantage that you don't need to worry about sound production, so you can chuck yourself straight in the deep end of you want (DD's first pieces were all around grade 4/5). Other instruments present significant difficulties of sound production at the bottom and/or top end of their ranges which limits what's accessible to beginners. And playing a black note on the piano is as simple as pressing a black note, whereas playing passages with lots of sharps and flats on wind instruments isn't always straightforward.

Just a quick phew! as both DSs passed their exams. The cello was just short of a merit so DS2 might be a little bit miffed, though I think he's done very well. DS1 will take the percussion pass as good news since his teacher thought the exam was at least a month further away than the actual date and he wasn't quite ready. he already knows what went wrong so it's been a good learning experience, I think!

Hi Loose: such a great news, such a relief, I am wishing we will have the same, you can now sitting tight, drink your cold wine under the lovely summer heat and reading us all whining (screaming) about theory test and other practical tests. We have slightly more than a week left till the day then I hope I can join you watching others hahahahaha.

Between violin and piano then my daughter finds piano is much easier and relaxing, she cant make the screeching which I wanted to cover my ears everynight even now. Its getting (slowly) better however when she wants to relaxed then she sits on the piano. The violin is the challenge one to her. I am lucky in the sense that she loves being challenged (for now) so she wont give up. Hopefully that will prolong until the sounds get better( I read here that it will eventually better and I do see the progress as the sight reading has some sense of rythm these days too).

From what DD says she still thinks piano is easier but I think this is only because she is familiar and more advanced on it, but I can actually see the clarinet is easier, she doesn't say is hard, just that piano is easier.

Yes comparing instruments is hard unless you play all of them and I am sure all of them have their difficulties, it is just a personal perception that piano (and violin btw) is harder than other instruments.

Green DD asked for violin a while ago and I said no, the screeching was a deal breaker.

Fluer: you made a good decision, she started with violin because her whole class was doing violin in the school lesson (30mins at lunch and group lesson). Now there are only 4 of them left, the other 3 are still with the school lesson and havent even learning grades after 2 years( they might not want to though). The screeching is killing, many days I had a very bad day after work and with the little sister and I have to try (very) hard not to cover my ears to encourage her to carry on. Apparently she doesnt have an issue with the screeching sounds(which worry me alittle :))

Thanks Green - I am sure it will go well for you! There's still one more exam to go but I am not thinking about that!
DS2 did consider violin but we were worried about the screeching potential and a bit relieved when he decided on cello.
DS1 just got in looking like a drowned rat after the Heavens opened just as he left school! At least I had good news for him - he admits to being amazed he passed.

DS2 likes his violin. He never wants to practise but when he does start he actually practises for quite a long time without me pushing him. He doesn't make a screechy noise though which is a relieve, though maybe he does and I'm just used to it! I would like to get a bigger violin for him but the advice seems to be that it's not worth buying a 3/4.

Loose well done to both your DSs!

Never, thats great to hear, so I have some hope for my second child.

Loose: when is the last one?

Missed the news - Loose well done to the DC!

Green I don't know that it's a trait special to the second child! DS2 picks up tunes quite quickly but he has to work quite hard at the violin.

Fleurdelise, thank you. I bought that one, first without CD by mistake, Then I bought another one with CD. So enough is enough, she can practise her grade 4 again. She did grade 4 piano in February, so hopefully she will; be OK with listening to the grade 4 one. (exam is next week Tuesday... so not sure I would get the book in time, unless I pay extra for express delivery).

Thanks all! Last exam is July 15. Piano g3. Just wanted to wish everyone else good luck with exams and results!

one advantage with piano is that you can still get sound out of it even after not having played it for many years, while no way can I get any sound of my old brass instrument.....
Just asked dd. She finds with recorder it's easier to pick up new things, like sight reading she said. She does however like piano better....

Hi everyone. On hols but just heard....We've got a high merit here on the G5 violin! Miniprada a bit gutted at just missing out on the distinction but me and her dad (and her teacher) think g1 to G5 in under a year aged 9/10 is pretty fantastic! G5 theory and piano here we come! Xx

Well done Miniprada - pretty fantastic indeed! That is a wonderful achievement - hope you are all celebrating!

Congratulations miniprada, fabulous result in such a short time!

Thanks guys!