Advice please - am I kidding myself? Marathon

[bbcessex]

Hi all

The nub of my question is this - I am v overweight and improving my fitness - my running is a super-slow shuffle - am I fooling myself to think I could do the Edinburgh marathon in May?

The long story...

I've recently got back into fitness following an 7-8 year break. During that time I put on loads of weight and became very sedentary outside of work.

A few months ago, I finally got in the right headspace to make a change and joined 90 day online fitness & nutrition programme which has been great.

Over the last three months, I've lost 2 stone and become much fitter. I am still 2.5 stone overweight, which as a 5'4 woman is significant.
My resting heart rate has gone from 75 to 62, which I'm delighted about.

My daughter has a chronic disability and I would like to raise money for his charity and also raise the profile. I work in a sector where I could get quite a bit of corporate funding, provided I was doing something genuinely difficult.

Hence I signed up for the Edinburgh marathon late at night this week whilst in hospital with my daughter - pretty much in an emotional state, and now I'm not sure if it's achievable.

The Edinburgh marathon has a time limit of 6.30 hrs - I've just got up to running 10k on this fitness programme and my time was 1hr38 mins .

Is it even possible to improve enough to get round in about 6 hours?

I personally think a half marathon would be doable, a full one... sounds like a tall order.

Well done in getting in the road back to fitness. A marathon is a massive commitment.
I’ve run a dozen half’s, I’ve entered several marathons but never done them because I have found the training too much.
You need to run at least 3-4 times a week with long runs on the weekend.
And all through the Winter for a Spring Marathon.
I don’t want to put you off, you might well be more determined than I am especially if you are raising money for a charity close to your heart.
Maybe do a half? Still a big chalet and a respectable distance

Challenge

I hate to be negative but I think your pace may be a problem.

I did the Edinburgh marathon this year after moving up from a half and found that my pace suffered as I was concentrating on being able to do the distance.

I would suggest changing your application to the half which is still an amazing accomplishment and Edinburgh is flat with fantastic support.

Don’t let your weight bother you as I did see plenty of overweight people doing the half and some doing the marathon although none were obese which at 2.5 stone overweight, you shouldn’t be.

Whichever one you do, good luck, it’d sn amazing experience!

May I suggest looking at some of Julie Creffield's postings?
She has a group she's helping train for spring marathons, and her target audience is plus size women. I don't think she would say it's impossible, just a lot of work. The main fb group is free.

www.facebook.com/groups/toofattorun
toofattorun.co.uk/

I ran a half in October, and haven't run since cos I jiggered my knee but it does take up a daft amount of time in training, and you have to have a plan - 10k you can wing. Anything longer needs thinking about and proper gear. (I still got a classic runner's toenail even though my shoes are the right fit...)

Best of luck!

I’m going to suggest a different approach. I’m certain you can do this. I have run many marathons and also ultra marathons. Even for my 100 mile races I never run more than 3 days a week, and two of those are less than an hour.
I think you will actually be faster if you take walk breaks from the very start of every run. This will also greatly reduce your risk of injury. You can work on improving your walk pace too. Again, less risk of injury than suddenly trying torun fast and you really need to avoid all injuries before May.
I’d suggest you look at the Jeff Galloway website. He’s the king of the run walk run method. Checkout his beginner marathon plan. It’s free. The site shows you how to calculate your ratio of run to walk. His “ marathon, you can do it” book would be well worth a read too.
You can do this if you really want to and you’ve certainly got the motivation. Congrats on your journey so far. Look forward to reading your post marathon report.

Slightly the voice of doom here, but running long distances when still you have not built up to it brings a real risk of injury.

But if you really want to do it, then give it a shot. You will need to decide on your novice marathon runners plan soon, and begin it (if a typical 16 week plan) no later than the first week in February. Put that date in your diary now.

Also start working out how you are going to fit in training. I agree with Migrant2 and would say that you should run no more than 3 or 4 days a week - in early weeks, all will be shortish easy/steady runs. Then one run a week becoames a 'challenge' (fast intervals, hills etc) and one becomes the long run. By around the second half of the plan, you will need to plan to make sure you have time to do these.

Also do one general fitness session a week, either a class or a complementary sport.

And do look into planning to run/walk the event. Lots of people take walking breaks, and you'll get round better if you plan (and practice) these, rather than just having to slow down when it all gets too much

See how far it gets you? It's fitting in long training runs that will be hard with commitments. Lots of slow runners don't make cut off times. Jeff Galloway intervals will reduce the chances of injury which often occurs when you increase distance or pace too quickly. I would also suggest you really focus on your running form to start with - a book like Chi Running for example. Good luck whatever you decide and wherever your fitness journey takes you.

The issue will be time to get the long runs in - and not getting them in will make you more likely to get injured.

When I did my first half getting the long runs in was a big commitment- needed 3 hours for a few of them which is a big chunk of the day around family commitments.

I took the view I couldn't do a full marathon until the kids were much older, or my training runs would be less long so looking at a target time under 5 hours purely for logistical reasons.

Also watch out for injury and keep an eye on your shoes' mileage - being female makes you more at risk of injury - and the less weight you carry the easier it is.

I would take it a bit slower and start with a half marathon (which is still a huge achievement!). It sounds like you've done amazing so far though with your weight loss and getting back into healthier habits, I'd maybe try a half in 2020 and then a full marathon in 2021; still an impressive timescale for anyone. Have you done couch to 5k etc yet? An excellent starting point, I would invest in some proper running shoes to help protect your knees and feet though, I love running but my left knee is in tatters from not wearing the right shoes and not warning up properly.

I think you can do it too. Jeff Galloway Run Walk Run is the way to go. he has a 6 month beginners ‘get round’ programme. You only run 3 times a week - 2x half hours plus a long run. Long runs start at 5k and build up.

I did exactly the same as you with the London marathon. I’m not particularly overweight - but I am far less fit than you sound! I think I will be around 6 hrs.

You entered for a reason. Do it. Try run walking - it’s really manageable

I think you'll struggle, OP. If it takes you 1h 38 to run 10k, you're not going to run a marathon in less than 6 hours in just 6 months' time. Even with walking intervals. The step up from 10k to a half is manageable, but a half to a full is a much greater challenge.

For context, when I did my first marathon I could run 10k in 43 minutes; a half in 1:39. I totally underestimated the challenge of a full marathon, and thought I'd finish in around 3:30. I'd been running for 7 or 8 years and regularly ran halves.
But the marathon still nearly broke me, and I shuffled in at 3:50. I've got much faster since then, but I'd utterly failed to realise the difference between running 20 miles in training and racing 26 on the day. Now I know that the old adage that the marathon begins at 20 miles is really true!

That's not to say a 2020 marathon is out- just do an autumn one instead of a spring one. That way you could do the Edinburgh half in May, get all your long runs in over the summer (much easier as it's lighter in the mornings and evenings) and then do the 26.2 in September or October.

Good luck with it! I'm sure you'll feel better and better as you get fitter. And there's nothing quite like crossing the marathon finish line

Just for a bit of context, I put your 10k time into a standard race time predictor. These things tend to massively underestimate marathon times, and tell people they'll finish quicker than they actually do. And taking that into account, a 1:38 10k comes out with a predicted marathon time of 8h 9mins.
A 6h marathon is more like a 1:18 10k, it claims.

With that in mind, I'd seriously look at autumn marathons, and swap to the half for May.

www.runnersworld.com/uk/training/a761681/rws-race-time-predictor/

Thank you so much to everyone for taking the time to respond. I really, really appreciate it.

Lots of great information in here. I have applied to join the 'Fat Girls Run' group on FB, and will check the run/walk and other links on here - thank you.

I did actually do the London Marathon 10 years ago, when I was: a: 40, and b: 4 stones slimmer. It's a complete haze and was a very different life, but I do understand the effort needed just to get to the start point.

I got round in 6:28, which was I was
really disappointed with (was aiming for 5:55)

I also only trained by running... I didn't do any strength, core or other exercise, which I would know to do this time.

the reason I 'need' to do a full marathon this time is the fund raising. I wouldn't get very much sponsorship for a half marathon, and my work are very aware of my daughter's illness, so it's kind of the right time to raise the profile.

I guess I need to know if I'm mentally committed to it - which i might not be, as I possibly wouldn't be questioning myself if I was. Not sure.

Thanks again for all the input; I didn't even realise MN had an 'exercise' section and I do now, so will be keeping an eye out.

Sorry @Runningonempty84 - I didn't see your posts before I posted mine :-).

Yes, completely agree, if my 10k time is still 1hr 38 (think it would be a bit less know) then that does NOT bode well for any form of marathon.

I think I'll see how I get on with a running between now and Christmas - combined with the aim of fat loss and strength training, I'm hoping to 'organically' get a bit quicker by virtue of less body to drag around.

OP I would donate as much for a half marathon as I would for a full marathon, especially if it was someone I knew had been working really hard towards it. I know you want to raise as much money as possible, but it sounds like pressure and stress that you don't need right now. How about some sort of raffle or something to bolster it? Most businesses will donate prizes, and the ones we have done at work have raised hundreds- the odd ticket here and there really adds up.

With my coach hat on I'll say that you could possibly do it but I don't think that you should. Even if you do a run/walk strategy, you are still asking a lot of your body in a relatively short space of time. Your injury risk would be quite high and it might just turn into a miserable experience for you. I think you'd be better deferring for a year and spending the interim 18 months getting yourself fitter and stronger.

I note that you are 50 - and therefore presumably at some stage of menopause? If so, you will likely find it hard to lose weight through running alone. I'd suggest you maybe do a couple of easy run/walks a week and gradually build the distance of one of those, but then focus on weights and HIIT type training for the rest of the time. This will get you stronger, fitter and improve your body composition so that in a year's time you are ready to start marathon training.

I would highly recommend aiming for a half to start with. I run a similar pace, PB for a 10k is 1h19 ish. I did a half in 3h 17m (last one across the finish line but hey I finished!). DH did a marathon last year. He averaged a 10 minute mile during his training and it took him over 6 hours to do his marathon. He looked quite broken at the half way mark. Try a half and see how you go. Follow a proper training programme. That’s doable.

Hi @bbcessex. I did the London marathon in 6 hours, 10 mins with absolutely no training so of course you can do it by May! I have never been a runner, I'm fit (ish) from walking everywhere and having small kids but that was the extent of my training.

6.5 hours is a power walk, so any running you do on top is a bonus! Do it!

I was 35 btw.

I think you can do it. Build up your mileage gradually to around 20 miles per week and then follow a proper training plan pretty much to the letter. I also think the Jeff Galloway run-walk method might suit you. Good luck!

The problem with the "just follow a training plan" advice though, @Egghead68, is the risk of injury due to the OPs pace. Most "slow" training plans are for 4h plus. Not six - and there's a reason for that.
When you're that steady, long runs of 20+ miles are likely to mean an absolute minimum of 4h plus on foot - and that's assuming 12-min mile pace, which is far faster than the OPs current pace.
When you're out for that length of time, the risk of injury outweighs the training benefit, and you end up in a position where you're highly likely to injure yourself, highly likely not to be able to complete the training programme, and highly likely to struggle on race day.
I think building fitness for life is far more important than doing a marathon the body isn't ready for. There are lots of marathons, and waiting just 6 months more would be infinitely more sensible than just jumping straight from 0 to 26.2.

See how the weight loss and general training goes though, OP - who knows, you might make massive strides between now and Christmas, and might be ready after all. I reckon if you can get that 10k to under 1h 10 by January, you could be in with a chance of a sub 6 marathon in May...?

Well I've done 2 marathons in 5:15 and 5:30 starting from no fitness at all (not even regular walking) just following a training plan on a treadmill, so I know it can be done.

The risk of injury is minimised if you (a) get proper running shoes with advice from a specialist shop and (b) build up the weekly mileage very gradually (no more than 10% increase a week).

OP I have been following this thread as someone who's recently done their first Half (and been injured for the six weeks or so after!) I'd dearly love to do a marathon if I thought I could stand up to the training without doing myself a real injury. I've done a lot of reading whilst I've been laid up, and spending a very long time at the same pace (and therefore repeating the same motion over and over again) is a sure way to cause an injury. I think this is very similar to the point runningonempty is making.

What also struck me about your post is that you said you have already done a marathon which you completed 30 minutes slower than you are aiming for, when you were ten years younger and 4 stones lighter. Blimey OP! I can't imagine running a Half 30 minutes quicker when I'm ten years older.

What you are trying to achieve next year will be an enormous challenge and I really think the wise thing would be to aim for a Half in the spring and the full marathon in the autumn, all being well. I do wish you luck though!

Thank for all the comments and suggestions everyone - extremely helpful.

I've joined the 'Too fat to run' Facebook group , which is fab, thank you for the recommendation.

I've also started to look into the Jeff Galloway run/walk system, which I think is perfect for me.

I've just done a 5k this morning, coming in at 41 mins, versus 49 mins 5 weeks ago, which I'm really pleased about.

I don't have to make a firm decision about the Edinburgh marathon until after Christmas, so I think I will continue with the diet, exercise & running and see how I get on.

Thanks all 🙏

24 May 2020? Yeah of course you can do that. Ordinary people do these things. There are lots of training programmes online & you are starting from being able to do 10km already. Plan a trajectory & get on with it.

tbh, there will be folk who fail on the day. No shame in that. The only losers are those who didn't get off the sofa...