Westministenders: This is not the Brexit we voted for

[ListeningQuietly]

UK Shellfish industry destroyed because our inshore waters are not clean enough
Welsh Ports on their knees because the Land Bridge has found another route
Horticulture seed producers lost all of their mainland EU customers

Antique dealers lost access to their suppliers
Small businesses being told (by UK Govt) to relocate to the EU to avoid red tape
Brits in the EU discovering that stopping Free Movement applies to them too
Northern Ireland in Unionist flames because there is a border between them and Great Britain, but not the Republic
And the UK has still not taken control of its borders

Brexit is shaping up as predicted, but none of those who voted for it seem to have what they wanted

I've sworn allegiance to her Majesty
unlike those born here

I get the feeling that the organisers of the funeral are VERY twitchy about Northern Ireland.

I have too LQ....and I have nothing against them.
What I have a problem with is the Fantasy that the Monarch will save us - maybe that was true in history, but it's not now.

To me and many of us they’re just a dumbed down government mouthpiece, yet to my swivel eyed 80yo df they’re a bunch of wishy washy liberal woke merchants.

The BBC has managed to pull off the amazing achievement of actually being both of the above simultaneously. Wishy washy liberal woke merchants by definition aren’t able to engage with the real world in any meaningful way, having trained themselves to think in slogans and avoid uncomfortable debate, so they know and do nothing to counteract the propagandising of senior managers and so called journalists who rarely ask the right questions as they’ve lost the habit of thinking for themselves.

I’m not sure what the Royals have actually done wrong this time DGR

Well either they have decreed that all their subjects are required to take part in this cringeworthy pityfest over an old man dying.

or

they have allowed the current UK government to undertake that task in their name.

Whichever, it doesn't endear them to me. And it's hardly like they had far to fall in the first place.

What's even more hypocritical is I really can't see the man that was the Duke of Edinburgh having being at all happy with this. It's probably the last thing he would have wanted.

Risky on your part - MNHQ can see perfectly well that it wasn't me who contacted them yesterday.

Just a little word of warning that MNHQ aren't really that big on facts. Many years ago I was accused of something in another thread (time has dimmed my memory). I was accused on that thread of reporting another poster and getting their post pulled which started a bit of a pile onto me. I contacted MNHQ who confirmed to me that it wasn't me that had the thread pulled, but felt it wouldn't be "in the spirit of the site" to post a correcting in the thread itself.

Their site. Their rules. But worth remembering.

"in the spirit of the site"

I think that must be one of their standard phrases.
Some threads have absolute pile ons but they stand without deletions.

Oh stop complaining about the coverage you lot. It's sad Prince Philip died, he was good in The Crown.

The BBC coverage merely shows that their senior management are far more interested in appeasing Tory MPs
than they are in entertaining and informing licence fee payers
or giving the Royal household a nice bit of distraction at this time.

There is a lot of discretion in the Forth Bridge / London Bridge documents
but sadly the types making media / council decisions are the forelock tugger types
who Philip so loved to take the piss out of ....

It has to be admitted that Prince Philip's passing has been timely for Boris Johnson. The devil looks after his own. Much better to pontificate about the late D of E on the steps of Downing Street than troubling himself sorting out the Northern Ireland problem which his Brexit has most strongly influenced.

Although I despair at how the BBC have fallen from being once widely respected, to their current tabloid outfit.

Like the badge says:

@DGRossetti

I’m not sure what the Royals have actually done wrong this time DGR

Well either they have decreed that all their subjects are required to take part in this cringeworthy pityfest over an old man dying.

or

they have allowed the current UK government to undertake that task in their name.

Whichever, it doesn't endear them to me. And it's hardly like they had far to fall in the first place.

What's even more hypocritical is I really can't see the man that was the Duke of Edinburgh having being at all happy with this. It's probably the last thing he would have wanted.

I'm sorry but if the Queen's husband of 70+ years dies it is surely immediately obvious to most people that this is a significant national event. If it is not so in the view of any individual then I heartily encourage their use of the "off" button.

I do agree on is that Prince Philip himself would likely have regarded a lot of the last 48 hours coverage as unecessary fuss.

I'm sorry but if the Queen's husband of 70+ years dies it is surely immediately obvious to most people that this is a significant national event.

Why?

A good synopsis of current issues in NI by AP:
apnews.com/article/united-kingdom-northern-ireland-violence-coronavirus-pandemic-london-15fad727d466a125d952c9dcff82213d

It is very possible that Johnson isn't bothering with a statement because -
(1) he is assuming that most British voters will be sure it's the Republicans at it again and basically, who cares about them...
(2) he knows he won't be listened to by the Loyalists or the DUP and will lose face among the more kneejerk elements of his own voters in GB if he is seen to criticise Unionists. There is a part of the Tory Party that is forever Unionist (people like Kate Hoey but on the other side of the HoC).
(3) street violence is useful as an expression of grievance against the EU; it might make the EU think twice about pressing too hard on the extension of the grace period if the minority population were to be firebombed, harassed, etc. as a result of a EU hard line.

I certainly employed the off button on Friday night, and have now complained to the BBC about the mawkish comments on their website.

"His passing leaves a void in the Queen's life" from Prince Andrew - of course it does you prat but do you need to tell us that? Princess Anne's comments are a bit more sensible, as befits a woman who does appear to have her head screwed on.

You know I don't mind the coverage in theory.

Its when it was obsessional brain washing levels of BBC1 and BBC2 followed by endless 'specials' etc etc.

The number of people in the UK who think 8 days of national mourning for any event I think is not that big. Its just not reflective of the modern world and trying to enforce it on a public which is disinterested is going to result in a backlash and shitty comments. Regardless of whether thats 'apprioprate' or 'in keeping with protocol'.

The result is complaint to the BBC. Which are completely unsurprising.

The media are there to serve the public / reflect the public / act in the interests of the public. The moment they cease to do this, they alienate and annoy.

Likewise the Royal Family - which relies on public support enabled and facilitated by the media - need to be careful and aware that they must listen to this sentiment or they too will become obselete.

Basically the balance of marking a event of national importance with the lifestyle/interest of the modern public is off and is as noteworthy as the actual Death of the Duke because it reflects what the Royal Family must do and where their future lies. Basically its reflective of change and how the Royals must adapt to thrive.

In general terms the passing of the Duke is definitely reflective of the change in politics thats been going on for the last 5 years or so internationally. Most of our political turmoil is about the end of the post war settlement and liberal consensus and a generational shift. The Duke and the Queen almost personify that. And its very apparent in the whole Harry debacle.

I can't say I'm surprised by any of it, but god its tedious and the whole mourning thing smacks of the 1950s to me. I think many ardent Royalists will also agree to a point too. I don't think its 'anti-royal' or even disrespectful to reflect on it and to point out the bleeding obvious even given the timing. In fact if you are pro-royal, I think theres a bloody good case to respectfully point out how damaging the blanket wall to wall coverage actually is.

We already know that there are massive generational issues going on and a lack of anyone in politics trying to address that. Instead its actively being exploited and is sowing division within the UK.

The Royals really have a role to play in addressing that. And that even has relevance to what is going on in NI in its own way. They should be the ones pulling out the stops to 'heal that divide' and being outside (whilst simulataneously inside) politics because thats the modern role of the Royals. If they are seen to 'side' with the current government (even if thats unintentional) then they also risk being tarred with the same brush. Ironically the Royal can not be non-political, not least because their continuing existance (and public funding) very much is a political issue. They need to pull their weight and be seen to be pulling their weight in adding value to the country and its cohension.

/rant

westcountrybylines.co.uk/former-finnish-pm-nails-brexitdisaster-in-one-tweet/

The beeb would have had plans for philip's demise, there's no real possibility they would have revisited them in the light of covid - would just have triggered them - hence missing the mood.

I do have concerns about general bbc bashing - thats giving the murdoch/tory factions ammunition.

My consumption of bbc output is 'line of duty', occasional newsnight and lots of R4. Neither of the latter can be fairly accused of giving the government an end to end soft ride. Today's toadying is well balanced by PM and the World at one. Multiple brexit / business / fact checking programs have exposed gov incompetence and 'how to vaccinate the world' has been magnificent on all aspects of the government handling of covid.

As for the website - murdoch et al got it emasculated on the grounds of 'unfair competition' - it has to keep up with the mail online or get hung out to dry.

Frankie
Philip was "Forth Bridge"
Charles is "Menai Bridge"
the Queen is "London Bridge"
the latter at least is rehearsed every year (the Queen has been known to watch and critique when they did not realise she was in London)
All are updated every year
and reissued to Government bodies
in my work I have the right to read them but CBA

@FrankieStein402

The beeb would have had plans for philip's demise, there's no real possibility they would have revisited them in the light of covid - would just have triggered them - hence missing the mood.

I do have concerns about general bbc bashing - thats giving the murdoch/tory factions ammunition.

My consumption of bbc output is 'line of duty', occasional newsnight and lots of R4. Neither of the latter can be fairly accused of giving the government an end to end soft ride. Today's toadying is well balanced by PM and the World at one. Multiple brexit / business / fact checking programs have exposed gov incompetence and 'how to vaccinate the world' has been magnificent on all aspects of the government handling of covid.

As for the website - murdoch et al got it emasculated on the grounds of 'unfair competition' - it has to keep up with the mail online or get hung out to dry.

Radio 4 has, unfortunately, given the government and entirely free ride. Particularly in they headline programmes in the morning and evening.

Newsnight has very tentatively suggested that they may not have been perfect, but that's about as far as they have gone. And they have a minimal audience anyway (unfortunately).

What's bugging me now is Government adverts telling businesses to enquire about help for trading with Canada and Japan. Yep, tell the cheese merchant to trade with Japan.

At least the sycophantic twaddle about the nation's grandfather will be laid to rest by the end of the week.

What material difference will 8 days of national mourning make to anybody? Noone is getting time off work, shops and services will resume tomorrow as planned and others will open as normal. About the only real world consquence that I'm aware of is some football matches being rearranged so they don't start at 3pm next Saturday. Other than flags at half mast will anyone notice this is going on? I doubt it personally.

Radio 4 has, unfortunately, given the government and entirely free ride. Particularly in they headline programmes in the morning and evening.

I'm sorry I have to disagree, PM in particular takes a very sceptical view of government claims. Eddie Mair can be withering.
'More or less' regularly fact checks government claims. 'Brexit a love story' covered all the lies as well as media bias. We cannot expect the bbc to be an opposition but can expect them to report facts which R4 at least does.

'rehearsal' is not relevant - the 'committee' will not have sat down in the last 12 months and taken a view on how forth bridge should be amended to cater for a national mood traumatised by a pandemic.

I can't say I'm surprised by any of it, but god its tedious and the whole mourning thing smacks of the 1950s to me. I think many ardent Royalists will also agree to a point too. I don't think its 'anti-royal' or even disrespectful to reflect on it and to point out the bleeding obvious even given the timing. In fact if you are pro-royal, I think theres a bloody good case to respectfully point out how damaging the blanket wall to wall coverage actually is.

We already know that there are massive generational issues going on and a lack of anyone in politics trying to address that. Instead its actively being exploited and is sowing division within the UK.

The Royals really have a role to play in addressing that. And that even has relevance to what is going on in NI in its own way. They should be the ones pulling out the stops to 'heal that divide' and being outside (whilst simulataneously inside) politics because thats the modern role of the Royals. If they are seen to 'side' with the current government (even if thats unintentional) then they also risk being tarred with the same brush. Ironically the Royal can not be non-political, not least because their continuing existance (and public funding) very much is a political issue. They need to pull their weight and be seen to be pulling their weight in adding value to the country and its cohension.

The sad thing is that the courtier class very likely believe that the nine or whatever days of mourning and all the talk of the nation's grandfather is adding value to the country and its cohesion, and apparently the only person who might have had the good sense to throw cold water all over that tosh is the deceased.

Louise - I think the issue is - that he was 99 - I personally find it hard to "mourn" someone who has had such a good and long life. But then culturally I do have a very different approach to death - I do find the "English" (I can't comment on Wales and Scotland, but know the way the Irish I know view death and mourning is much more similar to NZ than the English) approach to death and mourning..... "different". But I think it would be very different if the country hadn't been living under the cloud of Covid for a year. Lots of families have been shattered by early deaths, and then there are families (like Kate Garraway) whose loved ones survived- but are changed and the future is uncertain. Then there are families like my friends where her life is irretrievably changed due to long Covid and the permanent heart and lung damage she has as a 40 year old.

Also I don't think things are helped by rolling out Prince Andrew to give comment to the press - which is then played over and over. Honestly just shows how out of touch the institution is......

The only other Royal who might step up to throw cold water over the tosh is Princess Anne. Not Edward or William and we have already seen Andrew's stunning contribution. I don't really see how they can be 'seen to be pulling their weight'. Come the first lockdown last year William and Kate and family immediately bunked off to Norfolk. The Royalists declared in aggrieved tones "but it's their home." To which the answer was "how come your children are at a day school in London then?" Then we heard about Kate was home educating the two older ones. Yes, I am quite sure she was, but it's much easier with a nanny and extensive grounds to play in. That all sounds a long way from Prince Philip wanting city children to have access to playing fields. I was going to say, not Charles, but he has said that he wants to slim down the Monarchy, which sounds like a step in the right direction.

Weather wise the anti - lockdown Gods do not seem to be smiling today. We woke up to snow here in Oxfordshire, after drizzly rain yesterday.