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Brexit

Westminstenders: Magical Thinking

973 replies

RedToothBrush · 24/05/2020 19:39

This week has seen reports of the government editing footage of Johnson to avoid embarrassing questions about the early government response.

We've been asked to accept that the rules were different to what we were told to excuse the law breaking behaviour of a senior government advisor. As Johnson said he was being a responsible father (as if Johnson knows what this is) and it wasn't as if he was visiting a lover (this Johnson would know all about). Let's be honest Johnson is the master of brazening out controversy.

We also have the ERG complaining they were lied to by Gove about the new Withdrawal Agreement and the border in the Irish Sea which surprises precisely no one else.

They appear to be a little upset by the Cummings debarkable too.

Westminstenders: Magical Thinking
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Peregrina · 26/05/2020 13:00

I have just been out and saw that people are very much obeying the social distance rules - a bit too much in some cases by standing about 10 metres apart in the supermarket queue. Maybe this is not because we can now choose which laws to obey but because it still seems like common sense until we have control of the situation?

pointythings · 26/05/2020 13:05

JeSuisPoulet I would imagine it will be done by where the flight is coming from, not the nationality of the people on it.

smallaxe · 26/05/2020 13:07

You couldn't make that one up could you?

AuldAlliance · 26/05/2020 13:10

Fintan O'Toole sums it up perfectly. As usual.

Have found florist that delivers and soap is also a v good idea.
Thanks for suggestions and to those who sent supportive wishes.

dontcallmelen · 26/05/2020 13:12

Auld maybe some nice hand creams or lovely nightwear/dressing gown.

yoikes · 26/05/2020 13:19

I was going to suggest handcream and soap too auld
Also lipgloss/lipsalve. Hospitals are hot as Satan's armpit.

We were able to view my aunts funeral via livestream earlier....very moving service. Shortest catholic funeral I've ever been to!

I'm staying away from news/sm today. It's just too depressing.

DGRossetti · 26/05/2020 13:26

Just wondering if those who applied for Irish passports may be allowed in to Greece? Could this be a secret "perk" of being a Remainer?

I would hope that any restrictions are evidence based, and that the origin of the traveller, rather than their nationality will be the factor.

However there may the possibility that the Irish government would give undertakings to cover the cost of any Irish citizens requiring quarantine, which would tick a box on the form. We would need to be aware of what the UKs stance on such matters would be. (With a potential complication that it could differ by devolved governments Hmm).

All of which needs to be viewed through the prism of the UK as a third country ...

dontcallmelen · 26/05/2020 13:33

yoikes yy stay away from news/SM especially today 💐

AuldAlliance · 26/05/2020 13:33

yoikes hope the service gave you some small comfort.

Lipsalve and hand cream gone on the list.

I was wondering about the passport issue. I have a UK and will soon (when such things are operational again) have a French one, too. Does that make me harder to track, if I cross one border with one and another with t'other?

MockersxxxxxxxSocialDistancing · 26/05/2020 13:34

R4 WATO has covered the blog edit. "I wrote explicitly about Coronavirus" is now "I linked to another article about Coronavirus."

And an opthalmologist has rubbished BJ's claims about permanent eyesight damage, but confirms temporary conjunctivitis is a symptom.

SabrinaThwaite · 26/05/2020 13:51

List of Tory MPs coming out gains Cummings Tweeted by Sam Coates.

Mark Harper, former whip, has been added.

Westminstenders: Magical Thinking
AuldAlliance · 26/05/2020 13:53

Are there 2 Jason McCartneys?

AuldAlliance · 26/05/2020 13:55

And 2 Tim Loughtons?

Odd list...perhaps based on a system not unlike that used by the gvmt to count PPE gloves?

TheABC · 26/05/2020 14:00

Looks like a cut and paste without scrutiny, @AuldAlliance.

So, 18 Tories that we know of. Not enough to change Johnson's mind.

AuldAlliance · 26/05/2020 14:04

There are other (some non-WM) Tories being less direct, but still clear.
Here, for instance
twitter.com/DAJCameron/status/1265220415896662017

mrslaughan · 26/05/2020 14:11

DH and I were talking about the Tory MP's who have come out against and we wondered what's Raab response was . (This was after the Scottish MP resigned as minister - who had been described as someone to watch for the future. DH interpretation of it, is that he had decided that BJ isn't impt for his future)
Raabs statement is interesting- as considered so important by Boris) - it's very much sitting on the fence, doing what is expected, without saying it's all fine.

DGRossetti · 26/05/2020 14:17

I was wondering about the passport issue. I have a UK and will soon (when such things are operational again) have a French one, too. Does that make me harder to track, if I cross one border with one and another with t'other?

US policy is that if you hold a US passport that is the one you must use to enter the US. I suspect the UK will apply the same policy, and enforce it on outgoing passengers too (don't be surprised to see and offence created of using the "wrong" passport to leave or enter the UK in the near future if it doesn't already exist).

This matters, of course, since what passport you enter a country on determines your status in that country. I believe the US rule is to stop US citizens trying to claim the protection of any second citizenship they hold, and the UKs reasoning would be the same.

That leaves a grey area of people with dual nationality, who have never left (and therefore never entered) the UK on any passport.

Back in the day, I know one friend who despite having a UK passport always travelled on his Irish one. The "logic" being that Irish citizens were of no use to any terrorists, whereas US and UK citizens were.

Lots of fun ahead. Firstly as to how any rules about UK passports would be translated into Irish/UK passport holders who have rights that are fuck all to do with the EU.

Emilyontmoor · 26/05/2020 14:22

Interestingly even the extreme Brexit wing appear not to be actually defending Cummings anymore. Posts are on the lines, perhaps he is too clever to lose, he’s only human, it’s a witch hunt. I detect Trump like manipulation , he is surely not so inarticulate normally, he isn’t that stupid but designed to appear as “one of us” to his target audience hence “he’s only human”. And I have never heard that slight Durham twang before?

DGRossetti · 26/05/2020 14:22

.

Westminstenders: Magical Thinking
OhLookHeKickedTheBall · 26/05/2020 14:26

@donaldtusk
This is apparently Cummings and his Brexit friends’ rule: that they leave when they should stay.
He's at it again Grin

DGRossetti · 26/05/2020 14:32

Interestingly even the extreme Brexit wing appear not to be actually defending Cummings anymore.

Is there a debate being framed somewhere that if you keep Cummings you loose Brexit ?

Peregrina · 26/05/2020 14:35

I think that was the problem DGR - the focus on Cummings meant they weren't getting on with Brexit. Although 'Getting on with Brexit' for them means doing nothing so we crash out.

hanahsaunt · 26/05/2020 14:41

Needless to say my utterly sycophantic MP thinks DC is just fine and, in fact, would have let me drive there too had I only asked ...

Dear HA

I have received hundreds of emails over the weekend expressing a range of opinions over Dominic Cummings’ lockdown movements. I do understand that everyone has had to make huge sacrifices to keep to the rules and many of you have been separated from loved ones, some of whom have been ill or, very sadly, passed away during this period. I can totally understand why you may feel angry or frustrated.

I am sorry I can’t reply to individual points, but I would like to set out my position. Most importantly, the rules must apply to everyone equally, so I have tried to consider this issue as if it were a constituent who had asked my advice. If they had got in touch with me with the same concern and situation that they and their spouse had coronavirus symptoms and were concerned for the welfare of a young child if they stayed at home, I would ask them a series of questions:

• Can you not self-isolate at home?

• If you moved to another location, would you be able to travel there without using public transport and without stopping en route?

• On arrival would they be able to self-isolate in a separate dwelling for 14 days without any physical interaction with another household?

If the answer to all these questions was reasonable and did not risk the spread of the virus, then I would have no objection to the decision to travel if they felt as a parent that it was in the best interests of their family. From what I have heard, I believe that these were the circumstances of the Cummings’ household.

A number of people have raised the question about the Cummings’ visit to Barnard Castle. Dominic Cummings made this journey after he had fully recovered from the virus and after he had taken medical advice on April 11th, which determined that it was safe for him to travel and go back to work. It was perfectly allowable to make this journey and specifically as, having had the virus, he could not be at risk of spreading it. The rules are designed to stop the spread of Covid and our current understanding is that there was no risk in this instance.

The country still faces a huge challenge ahead. We need to ease the lockdown without risking a second wave and more health impacts and loss of life and we need to reboot the economy and save as many businesses and jobs as we can. It is time to move on from this so we can all pull together to rebuild both our economy and our lives.

Kind regards,

Kevin Hollinrake MP

pussycatinboots · 26/05/2020 14:42

DGR I showed the eye test chart to DH - He said I need to book him in with Specsavers or let him go for a drive Grin
Well said, Donald Tusk!