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Brexit

Westminstenders: A test of logistic planning

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 02/04/2020 15:32

We are witnessing a demonstration in Government crisis management.

For the past week journalists have asked the same questions and politicians have said they've already done it / are doing it in the near future. But as time wears on, the inability to produce the answers or demonstrate results is proving illusive.

This will have consequences.

It is a demonstration in how planning has proved to be lacking in certain areas.

With Brexit in mind, the lack of vision, coordination with business and wider capability and capacity this does not bode well.

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MockersxxxxxxxSocialDistancing · 05/04/2020 08:55

Good prog on R4 last night, with the superb Anne Applebaum talking about govts in Poland, Hungary and Israel seeking to portray the opposition as Pro-Virus.

Coming to a front page near you very soon.

lonelyplanetmum · 05/04/2020 09:09

Conservative Party opinion poll ratings have soared to 50%,

The article below explains the rallying behind the flag and wanting protection in times of crisis etc.

It's what happens afterwards I don't get. You'd think there'd be a shift to more compassion, community consciousness, wanting to pull together. However the article seems to suggest that afterwards is fertile ground for Faragist types.

I was only saying to DD1 on our allowed walk yesterday that Farage has gone from being the QT poster boy and daily headline to being invisible now.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/02/democratic-leaders-win-surge-of-approval-during-covid-19-crisis

Sostenueto · 05/04/2020 09:15

This from Sunday Times.........The owners of the ExCeL centre in east London are charging the NHS millions of pounds in rent to use it as a temporary hospital for coronavirus patients.

The ExCeL, owned by the Abu Dhabi National Exhibitions Company (Adnec), is charging the health service £2m-£3m a month, according to industry sources.

prettybird · 05/04/2020 09:42

It's certainly one way for them to make money while all exhibitions have been cancelled and they wouldn't have been able to rent it out anyway.... Hmm

mrslaughan · 05/04/2020 09:45

Mockers..... maybe Keir is ahead of the curve with his statement across all social media's about wanting the government to be successful in its war against the virus? I thought it was a really interesting start when I saw it first thing, but now thinking maybe he is pre-emoting that particular move?

DrBlackbird · 05/04/2020 09:54

Lonelyplanet interesting article. It would be the economic fall out that creates the potential for far right surges. Job losses and a global recession / depression.

People looking for someone to blame creates the opportunity for far right politicians to come out of the shadows and blame [insert target here]... for people's economic woes. So, migrants? Liberals? Liberal politicians? Journalists? Environmentalists? Greta?

For sure we have not heard the last from the likes of Farage et al. As a pp upthread pointed out how it took two WW's for the compassion and colllaboration to come about, which was in short supply after WWI.

MockersxxxxxxxSocialDistancing · 05/04/2020 10:32

Starmer could run rings round Johnson in his sleep, except there's no more Parliament forever until further notice.

RedToothBrush · 05/04/2020 10:40

It's gobsmacking to read about medics in the US having pay cuts atm.

The problem is that because hospitals are not for profit they are facing a cash crisis as not enough people are having accidents which lead to them going to A and E due to lockdowns and the bread and butter elective surgeries have been axed.

Covid-19 isn't profitable enough for them.

There are even medics who are being furlonged or positions cut by hospitals because they work in the wrong area of healthcare and there is no longer a demand for their services.

Meanwhile the healthcare owners sit on fortunes.

The whole health insurance model boggles my mind at the best of times.

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JeSuisPoulet · 05/04/2020 10:51

Phew - skim catch up read! Issues with computer access sorted.

Have been having an interesting "discussion" on FB with a man who is army medical. He was adamant that no one could show that not joining the EU scheme for equipment had made any difference. I said about mortality, his response; prove it!
Really? All I could say in the end (spotting his army of strawmen) was that there really was nothing stopping us from having the same results as Germany, if only our govt had funded the NHS properly and heeded the warnings. It is a clear display of mismanagement by our govt.

Re the exit strategy - this is why I got so frustrated about the lack of testing, or rather when they decided to ditch contact tracing and not start clusters. It's not easy to stop a virus coming up from behind (I'm sure there's a Monty Python comedy in there somewhere). Worryingly not one of the exit strategies I've heard so far has even mentioned viral load.

RedToothBrush · 05/04/2020 11:09

Worryingly not one of the exit strategies I've heard so far has even mentioned viral load.

There is a PPE shortage. The government don't want to mention viral load because it highlights how their slow response on PPE will directly contribute to deaths of NHS staff who are otherwise healthy.

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ListeningQuietly · 05/04/2020 11:28

This article is interesting
and why focusing on the 'daily number' is a distraction
www.theguardian.com/world/2020/apr/04/why-what-we-think-we-know-about-the-uks-coronavirus-death-toll-is-wrong

Merkel's idea has legs ...
I will release lockdown when the doubling rate is at ten days
It was at 4 days when she said it
its at eight days now

That is also a clearly measurable number on which to bring lockdowns back if they are needed cos folks are dumb

BigChocFrenzy · 05/04/2020 11:33

I read that Merkel - on public health advice - has now tightened the target to doubling every 13-14 days

Possibly this was after the German death rate has gone above 1%, with so many older people infected now

  • she warned this would happen, but it has increased public support for a tougher & longer lockdown, to over 55% in recent poll

We've also seen a few care homes ravaged, despite all precautions

BigChocFrenzy · 05/04/2020 11:39

Germany now testing 100,000 per day, but will only reach 100,000 confirmed cases today, maybe tomorrow

Extrapolating over the country means it's likely that still only a small % have been infected
So the vast majority are still vulnerable

Obviously no country can stay in lockdown forever, but it's going to take until mass vaccination to get really back to "normal"
Until then, some retrictions and maybe repeated waves of lockdowns over winte especially

  • Christmas is going to be a real problem in all Western countries I dread to think of the spike in January
ListeningQuietly · 05/04/2020 11:40

BigChoc
Fair enough, but I really like the fact that its a clear, measurable number that will allow Lockdown to be eased in time and tightened back up as needed.

I'm looking forward to seeing who Keir will have as his front bench to be releasing constructive but pointed press briefings against some of the flip flopping of the Government.

DGRossetti · 05/04/2020 11:42

Extrapolating over the country means it's likely that still only a small % have been infected

Odd - all of the UK has definitely had it. Or so I keep reading ...

DGRossetti · 05/04/2020 11:44

Obviously no country can stay in lockdown forever, but it's going to take until mass vaccination to get really back to "normal"

Just worth bearing in mind not all viruses have vaccines. At the moment there's no reason to think C-19 will be one of them. But by the same token, it should be a line in someones planning somewhere. (And if it isn't then they are an incompetent moron wasting eveybodys time and money by pretending they are "planning" ...)

TheABC · 05/04/2020 11:56

I don't think the high street will survive a Christmas lock-down. Instead of bricks and mortar with a web presence, it will be online retail, plus (much smaller) physical stores. The Argos model X 1000. Not a cheery thought if you are a commercial landlord. The same will apply to offices. Entertainment and socializing is supposed to fill the gap, but you are left asking how if people are forbidden to mix.

This next year is going to radically change our societies - and that's just for the affluent ones at the top of the GDP leaderboard. As Pakistan's president said yesterday, "the choice for poorer people will be Coronavirus or starvation."

MockersxxxxxxxSocialDistancing · 05/04/2020 12:34

Wanted, new Chief Medical Officer for Scotland. Must be prepared to live in Edinburgh and fucking stay there.

www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2020/apr/05/scotland-chief-medical-officer-seen-flouting-lockdown-advice-catherine-calderwood

Peregrina · 05/04/2020 12:43

We got locked down in France and were worried about our first and only home being secure. The answer to that was "tough". If we'd not been able to get a flight back, I was thinking of sending a key to someone nearby just to keep an eye on it.

But then, we have the Royal Family who have decamped en masse to their second or third homes.

Barrique · 05/04/2020 12:47

There is a PPE shortage.

Despite having a degree in PPE, our Health Minister seems unable to find any.

Tanith · 05/04/2020 12:53

“ The whole health insurance model boggles my mind at the best of times.”

Years ago, DH worked for an insurance company and pointed out that they exist to make money for their shareholders.
To do that, they will use any loophole they can to avoid paying out.

We in Early Years have found this out in the last month: many of us paid for loss of earnings cover in the event of forced closure by the Government.
The insurance companies are refusing to pay out because COVID-19 didn’t exist when the policies were underwritten.

No insurance health system will ever have the patients’ interests at the heart of their policies.

prettybird · 05/04/2020 13:12

Calderwood has formally apologised.

https://www.kingdomfm.co.uk/news/local-news/chief-medical-officer-visits-second-home-in-fife-despite-travel-ban/

I hope she doesn't step down: talking with both friends and neighbours who are doctors, they say that she is highly visible and well respected. Even before the Covid crisis, she'd made a point of getting around the NHS and meeting people on the front-line.

RedToothBrush · 05/04/2020 13:18

She should have been fined.

Police unimpressed.

Westminstenders: A test of logistic planning
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MockersxxxxxxxSocialDistancing · 05/04/2020 13:21

Despite having a degree in PPE, our Health Minister seems unable to find any.

A First. Better than BJ.

Looks like rubbish supply teacher Mr Hancock says unless the bad boys at the back stop messing about, he's going to keep us all in. Good kids at the front wondering if it's time for a riot to get a proper teacher instead.

prettybird · 05/04/2020 13:51

Calderwood has been given a warning by the police - and rightly so.

...now, what about the reporters that followed her and took the pictures? Hmm

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