Westminstenders: Constitutional History

[RedToothBrush]

The Supreme Court case continues
(ruling possible Friday but likely Monday)

The new NI proposal is bollocks and Johnson didn't get why until it was discussed in Europe.

There was a press conference in Luxembourg which looks good for Johnson.

Johnsons approval ratings are up.

And we are making no obvious progress to anything but no deal...

re the "to forgive is divine"

Yes, it's quite a common quote,
but I've never come across such a suckup who made the much further step of calling the forgiver "very close to divine"

Just JRM doing his upper class eccentric act, but I suspect that is wearing thin now,
again because he is now in govt and responsible for what happens, rather than mocking those who are

Louise - I think people were lied to by the Government and quite a lot did realise this. The Minister for Information was Duff Cooper - he had teams of people going round spreading moral boosting propaganda. They were nicknamed Cooper's Duffs. Not exactly flattering, was it?

DGR that is exactly what I said to my Labour voting friend; JC will end up having to put right all of the faults that become apparent after Brexit. Tories will say that had they been in charge Brexit would have been amazing. Schools, hospitals, councils and military will be funded, just in time for the Tories to come back in and starve them all again. NHS is going to die under Brexit and the irony is people will vote Tory because I suspect it will happen on Labour's watch. I'm so bored of the cycle.

LouiseCollins28

Was that a very circumspect way of saying someone might be offended ? Or that you were offended ? (Not that it makes a jot of difference).

A big reason why Corbyn has always been against No Deal or even a hard Brexit:

There's always been a high chance that he would have to cope with the aftermath,
even if not directly afterwards,
then a couple of years down the line at the next GE, after the Tories have been destroyed by Brexit

He knows it would be damn near impossible to recreate the NHS or much of the welfare state, once destroyed
Doing much at all would be v difficult if the economy has crashed and the UK is say dependent on the IMF

So there's a Tory incentive for a no-deal/hard Brexit just to spike any chances of a Labour uptick once it's happened.

Phew, for a second there I thought something stupid was happening.

I'm ignoring the polls, to be honest. All that matters is how people actually vote.

I don't know if people have been following recent local Council elections but there have been massive swings to LDs by 20-35% in most held over the past few weeks...

Louise For an alternative view, have you read "The Many Not the Few" by veteran Leaver R North ?

He is very much on the right, used to have a defence blog which was very supportive of the military and is certainly no peacenik,
but his book debunked the heroic myth of how ordinary people regarded WW2 while it was actually happening

DGR Both.
I could of course have worded it more strongly, I chose not to. I thought my attempt at an explanation was clear.

No Bigchoc I haven't read that one. Just having a look online now, thank you.

Oh well, that's a shame then.

Hiroshima by John Hersey should be required reading. However, it's so extraordinary thinking of people living and dying through that, and barely having a clue what was going on, so hard to begin to get 2019 heads around the fact that it's not fictional.

Instead we are letting the world see how this lot treat the weakest in the world www.thelondoneconomic.com/news/video-britain-first-thugs-pelted-with-rocks-when-they-went-to-calais-to-tell-migrants-not-to-cross-channel/20/09/?fbclid=IwAR3IUhqzEUwFSHfgWPEVBFInm0j3Nwt6YsNeettIeVpBRrYfm-jA2dAGLyI. Lovely.

I guess they won't be able to fuel the boats once the petrol shortages start; happy Brexit Britain First!

I'm more concerned about the potential for violence from the Britain First "patrols" along the UK coast

I suspect some won't be satisfied with just informing the authorities if they suspect a boat is carrying migrants,
but will take the law into their own hands and try to arrest them or even push them out to sea again

I doubt if the police or coastguards welcome vigilante "help"

And yet again @LouiseCollins28 you show your blinkered POV - because it is not only people from the UK that gave their lives..... the effect it had on NZ society was huge, and for what? To keep Britain great? It's the same attitude leavers have - everyone has to give and give to keep Britain great....thing they don't seem to have grasped is the rest of the world has moved on.

The end of WW2 saw more than the loss of the remnants of empire, it saw, as @mrslaughan implies about NZ and I have read about my home country Canada, the stepping back of the "white" commonwealth countries that had previously been viewed almost as dependable vassals. It led to greater efforts to forge their own independent viewpoints and to sever final ties with the UK. I can't speak for other countries, but it was the first steps on the path to Canada's repatriation of its constitution, which was until 1982 an Act of the UK Parliament, not our own document at all.

I remember when I was an English teacher back in the 70s and one of my mature students (a fairly high-up banker, I recall) saying that when he was in Hamburg after the war, British soliders came into the factory where he was based and crated up all the surviving machinery to ship back to Britain. He thought it was great that we'd cleared out the factory so that the new equipment bought with Marshall Plan money could be quickly installed, while we took the old crap away for them.

mrslaughan I'm sorry if I have given offence. I've misrepresented myself if anything. I should perhaps have written "governments" not "government" but I didn't think of my post as UK centric or exclusive at all, certainly wasn't intended that way. I made no mention of anyone's nationality and all losses in a war a tragedy.

Lots of misinformation of commission and omission during the war. Silence on the crime wave, and the resulting road deaths that killed more than the Luftwaffe. Silence on the V2's, and the fact that false intel fed to double agent Garbo led them to land south of the centres of power and flatten Croydon instead.

Silence on how much of a Nazi the Duke of Windsor was. If anyone deserved a firing squad for treason, it was him. And not forgetting the silence on the death camps, apart from one oblique reference by Churchill to 'a new dark age.' Those lobbying for action to bomb the ovens were dismissed in some cases as 'whining Jews.'

Recommended by me and others before on these threads:

Travellers in the Third Reich.

It give you a flavour of just how many people went along with Nazism. Not all, to be fair, there are some sterling examples of people who didn't.

My grandmother's diaries, describing her travels (honeymoon?) with my grandfather around Germany in 1938 are interesting too - there's a definite sense of an oncoming storm. They were Australians who never got back to Australia - my mum ended up being born in Scotland in 1940 as my grandfather was an architect working on war-related projects (specifically, the Rolls-Royce factory at Hillingdon).

My DH GM was British and an orphan, DH GF was in the NZ airforce during the war. She kept meticulous diaries all her life. The ones during the war are harrowing. As she talks about the people that they lost...... it's what makes me so furious about the glorification of the war (or any war) as their was a huge cost on a generation that is completely whitewashed.

Hillington, not Hillingdon (for an Weegies reading this )

HOUSE !!!

Police check
Schools check
Hospital check
Military check

What’s left ??? Fire service?