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Brexit

Westminstenders: Constitutional History

959 replies

RedToothBrush · 18/09/2019 14:57

The Supreme Court case continues
(ruling possible Friday but likely Monday)

The new NI proposal is bollocks and Johnson didn't get why until it was discussed in Europe.

There was a press conference in Luxembourg which looks good for Johnson.

Johnsons approval ratings are up.

And we are making no obvious progress to anything but no deal...

OP posts:
Thread gallery
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prettybird · 18/09/2019 15:45

Reading the UK Supreme Court blog (link again here ukscblog.com/ ), is it my imagination or are the posts summarising the case being presented against the prorogation more sympathetic that the ones about the government's defence of the prorogation?

Or is it just that Cherry's (in particular) and Miller's cases are simpler, more obvious and common sense - but that that doesn't necessarily mean that the prorogation in itself is illegal?

Lisette1940 · 18/09/2019 15:48

Pmk

Myriade · 18/09/2019 15:50

PMK.

I dont quite get how Johnson approvals are up when people are also saying that they dont have an issue with the FoM, they think No Deal is scary and that the government hndling of Brexit is shit.

Something doesnt add up there.

Myriade · 18/09/2019 15:51

I think the very good worry now is that the EU is going to say NO to anything (bar Revoke because they wont be able to say NO) beause the UK has been so carp at dealing with it that they have decided they dont want an unwilling partner anymore.
And who can blame them?

Myriade · 18/09/2019 15:52

Sorry it should have been the very BIG worry, not good....

DGRossetti · 18/09/2019 15:58

I dont quite get how Johnson approvals are up when people are also saying that they dont have an issue with the FoM, they think No Deal is scary and that the government hndling of Brexit is shit.

Being told something doesn't make that something true ...

Anyway, without sight of (a) the polling questions in full and (b) the polling methodology, you may as well as the stars.

Once again, a decent press would have those two issues covered before spouting off.

Remember the one mantra politicians (used to) use to dispel poll-fever:

The only poll that matters, is the election

Incidentally, I wonder if team Corbyn are trying very very carefully to align for a hung parliament ? In a way the Tories aren't and can't ?

DGRossetti · 18/09/2019 16:02

Congratulations, Nicola

Scotland's First Minister Nicola Sturgeon has been given an award by the German media for being "the voice of reason" in the Brexit crisis.…

Also

www.euronews.com/2019/09/18/scotland-s-nicola-sturgeon-gets-award-for-being-voice-of-reason-on-brexit

Belindabelle · 18/09/2019 16:05

Was that a little bit of Abraham Lincoln to finish.

I don't know how Aidan feels but I need a lie down after that.

MockersthefeMANist · 18/09/2019 16:06

...If BJ is the "father of lies," the lies are bound to be illegitimate.

kingsassassin · 18/09/2019 16:11

A interesting article from Prospect Magazine a week or so ago (obviously now completely out of date.. but...)
www.prospectmagazine.co.uk/politics/labour-delays-this-election-for-too-long-at-its-peril-brexit-corbyn

I think Labour could end up finding itself in trouble because of the "optics". They're being out-remained (for perfectly sensible reasons) by the Lib Dems, and out-Brexited by both the conservatives and BXP.

yolofish · 18/09/2019 16:14

pmk, thanks all

FMFL · 18/09/2019 16:17

PMK with thanks

NotaRealLawyer · 18/09/2019 16:19

A bit worried re Aidan ONeill's speech about kitchens catching fire Hmm must check that dodgy wiring,

averylongtimeago · 18/09/2019 16:23

Haven't got a cat, but thanks for the threads!

Westminstenders: Constitutional History
PerkingFaintly · 18/09/2019 16:24

PMK

tobee · 18/09/2019 16:24

Pmk here too! And thanks to the keepers of the flame! 🔥

Grin
pumkinspicetime · 18/09/2019 16:24

Our gentleman is aging.
Why is BJ still running an election campaign at the same time as negotiating the most complex UK issue for decades?

Westminstenders: Constitutional History
Peregrina · 18/09/2019 16:28

PMK.

chomalungma · 18/09/2019 16:30

If Boris Johnson came to my work or if I met him trying to get a photo op, I would give him a piece of my mind.

Start off nicely and draw him in. Then bring all my guns to bear.

Thing is - there is so much stuff to talk about. Austerity, the lies of the referendum, not listening to all people, the effect on the NHS, education, social care. Proroguation, Operation Yellowhammer etc.

DGRossetti · 18/09/2019 16:31

Totally OT, but discussing Supreme Courts the world over (well, US/UK) I was surprised to discover/realise I never knew that the verb "to bork" as in to "fuck up" comes directly from the last US Supreme Court nominee to be rejected, 32 years ago ... Robert Bork.

(Loosely connected to judges names yesterday Grin)

pigeononthegate · 18/09/2019 16:34

PMK (with cat)

Westminstenders: Constitutional History
tobee · 18/09/2019 16:44

Be just as well if Johnson didn't come anywhere near me. Because I'd blow it all by tripping over my tongue while frothing at the mouth! Sad

DGRossetti · 18/09/2019 16:46

For legal junkies,

from

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Impeachment_in_the_United_Kingdom

The procedure has, over time, become rarely used and some legal authorities (such as Halsbury's Laws of England) consider it to be probably obsolete. The principles of "responsible government" require that the Prime Minister and other executive officers answer to Parliament, rather than to the Sovereign. Thus the Commons can remove such an officer through a motion of no confidence without a long, drawn-out impeachment. However, it is argued by some that the remedy of impeachment remains as part of British constitutional law, and that legislation would be required to abolish it. Furthermore, impeachment as a means of punishment for wrongdoing, as distinct from being a means of removing a minister, remains a valid reason for accepting that it continues to be available, at least in theory.

(contd)

is it too abstruse to wonder if SCOTUK will consider this, and note that prorogation removes parliaments ability to impeach, whcih may - or may not - have any bearing on the outcome of the case ?

It would be interesting to know how far SCOTUK would consider:

The Joint Committee on Parliamentary Privilege in 1999 noted the previous recommendations to formally abandon the power impeachment, and stated that "The circumstances in which impeachment has taken place are now so remote from the present that the procedure may be considered obsolete".[7]Notwithstanding, on August 25, 2004, Plaid Cymru MP Adam Price announced his intention to move for the impeachment of Tony Blair for his role in involving Britain in the 2003 invasion of Iraq. He asked the Leader of the House of Commons Peter Hain whether he would confirm that the power to impeach was still available, reminding Hain that as President of the Young Liberals he had supported the attempted impeachment of Murray. Hain responded by quoting the 1999 Joint Committee's report, and the advice of the Clerk of the House of Commons that impeachment "effectively died with the advent of full responsible Parliamentary government"

as generally you need an explicit vote in the commons to pass (or repeal) a law, not just some bloke saying that's what he thinks.

Somewhere, in China, there are classes of schoolchildren learning exactly what their ancestors meant when they wished the people of Britain to "live in interesting times ..."

borntobequiet · 18/09/2019 16:55

PMK with many thanks once again, incapable of critical thought as my brain seems to have shut down from contemplating the improbability of anything ever being normal again.

NoWordForFluffy · 18/09/2019 16:57

PMK. Thanks, Red.

I missed most of this afternoon's hearing due to having to be on the phone. Shame, as I was impressed with what I heard (especially the house on fire analogy!).