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Brexit

Westministenders: The start of our fourth year of fun

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 24/06/2019 10:47

Do you remember when politics was boring?

This week we have had a Tory MP recalled, a Tory MP caught on film appearing to assault a protester and our likely Tory prime minister caught on tape having a serious row with his girlfriend which resulted in the police being called.

This is a government with a majority of 3 (with the DUP).

There are apparently 100 MPs who are not on board with no deal, but its not clear how far they will go to try and stop this. We do have Dominic Grieve stating that if Johnson is elected leader he will not become PM as he will not have the confidence of the house and can not go to the Queen to say he has. He has recently said he would resign the Tory Whip if necessary, which he has not previously said. The government has only to lose 2 more MPs for it to lose its majority...

It is important to remember that until Johnson goes to the Queen, May remains PM and retains the powers of the office. Could he become leader but not PM?

This crisis would most likely lead to a GE. The only real question would be over the timing over this. Would it be immediate or strung out over the summer? At this point this does look highly likely before October.

If the Tory moderates get their way, then the ERG hardliners hit back and do the same thing even with the looming threat of the Brexit Party or a Remain surge.

Its hard to see how we AVOID Brenda from Bristol being tracked down for a rent-a-quote. And there is a strong possibility of another Tory Leadership Election before the year is out, under several scenarios.

Meanwhile the EU Brexit Team has largely broken up, with most of its lead players having new personal priorities with internal EU elections. Our biggest ally in Tusk will no longer be there to protect us, so EU politics post 31st October could look quite different, and less favourable, to the UK.

Whilst the talk around parliament from seems to indicate that the UK will look for another extension (and this includes from Camp Johnson), this is very inward looking. At some point there needs to be a wakeup call that the EU want us out, and will be prepared to force us to no deal whether we like it or not.

Equally the idea that we could have a PV is also dependant now on EU good will, as we've faffed about for so long with Tory Brats. And relies on the EU still being keen on another referendum. Will this come to a head with the EU saying no and shattering the hopes of the other side of the house?

At this point, what happens with the Withdrawal Agreement? The idea that the withdrawal agreement is dead isn't quite as clear cut as you might think. If its a choice in parliament on the very last day of No Deal v the Withdrawal Agreement what will they do? Will they recognise the moment? Certainly I think there are a few opposition MPs who HAVE started to notice this is a possibility this time around. Its still largely unspoken though. No one wants to acknowledge political reality.

We still haven't hit the wall of reality. We avoided in March. But its still there and no going away.

I think there are two things we can count on over the next few weeks; more outrage and chaos and a slow dawning of the realisation that May was dreadful, but it really could be worse.

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tobee · 26/06/2019 14:59

Just turned on the telly to see an old episode of Rumpole of the Bailey.

Leo McKern was an early UKIP supporter and appeared in a 1997 party political broadcast. Shock

DGRossetti · 26/06/2019 15:23

The notion of sovereignty and taking back control is commonly put about by Leavers. Which precise powers and policies would better off determined by Westminster alone is a perfectly sensible query.

The problem with the sovereignty business is it invariably arrives back at the situation that these are powers the UK has entered into agreement - by treaty - with other countries to apply in the prescribed manner. Moreover, when (or if) you dig further you discover it was the UKs idea in the first place. So these are powers that have been "stolen" from the UK.

Even further digging then shows that when Leavers think they have magicked up a power the UK has agreed to limit within the EU as having been responsible for some terrible decision in the UK, it invariably turns out that the decision in hand was a purely UK one and not required or even affected by the UKs membership of the EU. Bananas and passports spring to mind. Even metrication - which you'd have thought was an EU-led decision forced on the UK turned out to be the UKs idea all in it's own. Even Europeans I worked with were surprised at how far the UK had taken it (see also "smoking ban").

It seems there is some sort of complex in Leaver narratives - "look what the nasty EU made us do !!!!!"

If we are to look at binary distinctions in humans, rather than pissing around with gender, genitals, and hairstyles, maybe we should see if there are two types of h. sapiens. One that gets how clubs work, and one that doesn't.

TatianaLarina · 26/06/2019 15:53

I entirely agree DG.

Motheroffourdragons · 26/06/2019 15:54

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ on behalf of the poster.

TatianaLarina · 26/06/2019 16:02

The great thing about Boj’s plan is that even Baldrick could see they won’t work.

He’s our best bet for a GE. But the we have to take our chances with the Brexit party.

TatianaLarina · 26/06/2019 16:02

plans pural ^

DGRossetti · 26/06/2019 16:07

Leo McKern

Well known Australian ....

tobee · 26/06/2019 16:24

Yes indeed DG.

DGRossetti · 26/06/2019 16:25

Meanwhile, like an express train passing the local service on the way back, another thread has prompted me to cite Tony Benns 5 tests of power.

What Power Have You Got?
Where Did You Get It From?
In whose interests do you exercise it?
To Whom are you Accountable?
How do we get rid of you?

Which are a good measure if "Sovereignty" is being discussed ?

MotherOfSoupDragons · 26/06/2019 17:19

All nostalgic for Tony Benn now.

NoWordForFluffy · 26/06/2019 17:21

Jealous of @bellinisurge having a personal toad. 🐸

I have a personal toad. It's living (oddly, maybe) in our strawberry patch!

tobee · 26/06/2019 17:25

Sounds good Fluffy. Can it do tasks? Can it solve Brexit?

HesterThrale · 26/06/2019 17:29

Sometimes this 'Long and Winding Toad' feels like the 'The Toad to Ruin'.

NoWordForFluffy · 26/06/2019 17:31

Sounds good Fluffy. Can it do tasks? Can it solve Brexit?

I forgot to find out. I shall endeavour to see if it's of any use whatsoever (bar eating snails and slugs!).

bellinisurge · 26/06/2019 17:44

The long and winding toad.
Have we had that one yet?Grin

bellinisurge · 26/06/2019 17:44

Nooooo @HesterThrale , beat me to it.Grin

cambozoly · 26/06/2019 17:55

nostalgic for Tony Benn now

Yes me too. I love this clip of him as an old man talking about the EU.

Ellie56 · 26/06/2019 18:06

Do you have to pay toad tax Fluffy? Grin

tobee · 26/06/2019 18:07

My mum once had a cuddle with Tony Benn. NB it was in a public place.

Grinchly · 26/06/2019 18:32

Is it Toadally devoted to you, Fluffy? Grin

Iambuffy · 26/06/2019 18:46

I was chatting to someone at the weekend.

She and her dh pay more in rent p/m for their 3 bed ex council house in a rough area than we do for our mortgaged detached 4 bed in a "naice" area.

She looks after the 2 pre school age DC. Free childcare hours don't kick in for some time so she can't make work pay.

He works ft for nmw on shifts.

They are really struggling.

I've given her the foodbank details and am collecting some second hand clothes for the DC tomorrow.

It's all just so depressing.

I'm looking into training as a debt advisor.

tobee · 26/06/2019 18:46
Grin
tobee · 26/06/2019 18:46

Sorry Grinto Grinchley

tobee · 26/06/2019 18:47

That made me look a right asshat otherwise

Iambuffy · 26/06/2019 18:50

tobee
🤣
I needed cheering up, thank you!