To think that Boris May be what we need...

[shewhocan]

Ok. Here me out. I do not like anything about the man and am aghast that he appears to be our best offering on leadership. BUT:

1. Theresa May was always open to criticism that she wasn't a true brexiteer. Boris has nailed his colours to the mast from an early stage (albeit entirely for his own personal reasons). If he can't get a deal, perhaps finally Brexiteers will realise we are on a hiding too nothing.

1. If/ when it becomes clear that we are heading for No Deal (which given we will have two months post the summer break, we must be as a matter of practicality), parliament could still take over and force a delay or new referendum.

1. (And this is the one I believe in the most) as we head to No deal, Corbyn will call a Vote of no confidence in the government. The Tories don't have a majority without he DUPn they won't back a No Deal with a hard Irish border, so we end up in an election.

My bigger worry is that Corbyn will remain Labour leader and thus the remain vote will be split between labour, Lib Dem's and green/ independent, so we could still find ourselves with a Tory government and/ or hopeless deadlock...

What do you think ?

At some stage though, I think we are going to have to compromise over Brexit - the situation where we tell either one half of the population or the other that they can get lost, is just not tenable.

Compromise does not mean 'Get behind Brexit'. Compromise would probably mean what many expected it to mean as a Norway + type agreement. What is most important? Trashing the NHS so that we can have trade deals with the US, or accepting Freedom of Movement to have a Norway style agreement? And so on. These are all the sorts of issues which should have been thrashed out long before Theresa May drew her red lines. Which ultimately matters most? May decided with her backstop to try to protect NI/GFA and keep the UK together. Gove for one, doesn't care about that. Johnson? Who knows, it's all a game to him, as long as he becomes PM then everyone else can 'go whistle'.

Remainers have already compromised to some extent, their 'life plans' have already been massively 'dented' and it is unlikely that this will be restored, even if the UK revokes.
Of course 'leavers' and 'Brexiteers' will ultimately compromise because their 'demands' are so diverse and often at opposite positions from other 'leavers/Brexiteers' that there is not much common ground between them.

Trashing the NHS so that we can have trade deals with the US, or accepting Freedom of Movement to have a Norway style agreement

I just can’t see that happening because the one thing that every Leaver I know, and those who still post on here, have in common is the fact their vote boils down to immigration.

I’m not saying every Leaver voter is racist but all this ‘freedom’ and ‘soverignity’ really means we want our country to be more ‘British’ and we don’t want foreigners interfering, or ideally, living here because they think we are such a great nation that we don’t need anyone else here.

if thee answer is Boris, then as a society we have gone badly, badly wrong

We have.

No deal, Corbyn will call a Vote of no confidence in the government

I doubt this is likely. Labour are shitting themselves as much as the tories at rhe thought of a ge and Corbyn does not wish to be pm and deal with brexit.

You also have to remember Boris is very clear, he doesn't wish no deal, he just wishes the threat of it and the threat of not paying the 39 billion as a way to force the eu to give further concessions.

It's likely going to be a scarey time for a lot of people. This thread alone shows the magnitude of the misunderstanding that still exists. The error on no deal alone, never mind the error on thdesire for a general election shows this.

I don't understand if people feel strongly about it, why theydont spend half an hour actually taking the time to understand it.

{and those who still post on here, have in common is the fact their vote boils down to immigration.}

They are going to be so disappointed.

They are going to be so disappointed.

I know, which is why this whole fiasco is so pointless.

In the last week alone I’ve heard 2 people saying that they can’t wait for the Indians and Pakistanis to go home.

And the real irony is, aside from the fact that could never have had anything to do with the EU, in both cases the people they were referring to are actually British.

I quite warm to RoryS but his belief that we all need to compromise over Brexit is cloud cuckoo land..... as can be seen on the multitude of threads across MN let alone the internet, it aint ever never going to happen.

It's not so much compromise that is agreed as an understanding that whatever happens now we have all lost.

We can't get back three years of growth, or the factories that are closing, or the European Medicines Agency or the Banking Agency. We can't get back the jobs in pharma that have moved to Amsterdam or the finance and insurance jobs that have moved to Paris or Frankfurt or Dublin.

We won't get back a Britain that is open for business and open to other cultures for another generation, there is too much water under the bridge. My best friend was here this weekend with her cousin, married to a Briton of Middle Eastern origin. He used to play football in the park in summer with friends from the same ethic group. They can't do that any more; youths chuck bottles at them.

So even if we revoke, remainers lose. Everyone loses.

As for no deal, anyone who hasn't yet understood that no deal is lose-lose hasn't been paying attention or is (sorry) not terribly bright.

So even if we no deal, leavers lose. Everyone loses.

It's not compromise that we need but an understanding that we are all losers from this process. I think we need to learn from Ireland about how you get a positive outcome from a process in which all parties give up something they hold dear.

Everyone loses.

Except your Jacob Rees-Mogg's who have already made millions from the decline in the £.

If Boris is our best shot, I've finally succumbed to the Event Horizon.

I thought you were suggesting Boris should marry Theresa and take her surname. Wasn't sure how that would've helped.

Mistigri

Yours is a good post but no one is compromising or reaching an understanding.
If we stay in the EU, leavers will never accept that.... i once suggested that we stay and put billions aside to address inequality... leavers popped up and said that was bribery!!! and vote must be respected.
If we leave, remainers wont accept that either and the loses you've correctly noted will continue, placating the far right will mean further demands... probably ending up with enforced deportations.

I think we are destined to stay a divided and angry nation for the foreseeable future... whatever happens and whoever is PM.

My best friend was here this weekend with her cousin, married to a Briton of Middle Eastern origin. He used to play football in the park in summer with friends from the same ethic group. They can't do that any more; youths chuck bottles at them.

This is an example of what I’m seeing now too.

Those who still unswerving support Brexit are doing so because of immigration and this process has given those that are racist a free pass to do things like the above example.

It’s sickening and I really can’t see what the answer is now.

‘take back control’ actually meant ‘make our country British again’

Sorry if this has been posted already. But please watch it.
I just find it modifying that anyone could consider it even slightly ok for this horrendous man to be good enough to lead our country:

https://mobile.twitter.com/owenjones84/status/1137800246216601603

Mortifying.

I think the statement with most truth is that we have all lost.

If anyone seriously thinks that Boris Johnson could ever be a suitable person to be our Prime Minister, they should watch this bicycle crash of an interview with Eddie Mair from 2013. By the interview's close, "You're a nasty piece of work, aren't you?" was one of Mair's more generous reflections on Johnson's integrity.

www.theguardian.com/politics/2013/mar/24/boris-johnson-interview-eddie-mair