"I told you so...." (pt. 94)

[MockerstheFeManist]

Bridgend plant to close.

All you Welsh Brexit voters, happy now? The days of the internal combustion engine are drawing to a close. The future is electricity and hydrogen fuel cells. The investment will go where the markets are largest and most stable.

Brexit is a lot like climate change: You cannot attribute any single economic event exclusively to it, but it means there will be more of them more often and they will be more severe.

Nissan and Toyota workers, be very afraid.

Clav always has to go out when she gets pulled up.

Deffo scraping the barrel, and of course if brexit benefits have not been felt because we haven't left the EU, these investments can't be used to demonstrate that leaving will be a success.

And strangely hasn't replied with reasons why the government hasn't been investing in the NHS and the Northern Powerhouse projects, that they could have been doing all along.

And strangely hasn't replied with reasons why the government hasn't been investing in the NHS and the Northern Powerhouse projects, that they could have been doing all along

What, you mean not investing like this:

www.gov.uk/government/news/prime-minister-strengthens-northern-powerhouse-with-joint-ministerial-appointment

I would prefer to see some real investment. E.g. money actually spent of the same order as that already spent on HS2 to improve the trans-pennine links.

Thankfully I think some voters are at least beginning to rumble that this is what is required.

My point is that it should have been happening at least 3 years ago, or rather 25 years ago. As usual, too little too late and the money is not getting 'onto the ground'.

The government was investing in the Northern Powerhouse 3 years ago, governments have invested in the NHS over the last 25 years, however, the NHS model has not moved with the times, it’s outdated and almost not fit for purpose so no amount of money will ever be enough. (that’s a whole other thread) but you cannot say there has been no investment in these two areas.

Plus lots of additional government backed investment here:

www.gov.uk/government/publications/innovate-uk-funded-projects

And leaving the EU is going to improve matters how exactly?

And leaving the EU is going to improve matters how exactly?

1tis I am not discussing whether leaving will improve matters or not (bit of a swerve).

I am responding to your earlier posts where you mention a lack of investment by the government/s and I have provided you with links that show that not to be the case.

Interesting how many investments have fallen short.

I am responding to your earlier posts where you mention a lack of investment by the government/s and I have provided you with links that show that not to be the case

Just appointing people doesn’t solve the problems though does it?

The issue here is that the problems aren't going to be solved by leaving the EU and in many cases doing that is going to make them worse.

What is the logic behind thinking leaving the EU is going to help here?

The amount invested in northern rail is nothing compared to the vanity project of HS2.

Yes, the NHS does need an overhaul, and ideally a proper commission to examine what we need and what we are prepared to pay, rather than privatising by stealth. Spending three years consumed by Brexit has contributed exactly what to this discussion?

@time4chocolate
Where does your link show the increase in investment following our decision to leave? It's a long list of projects starting in 2004, so it's a list of government investments that would normally happen, rather than something to help alleviate the inevitable economic pain of brexit.

Jason
I wasn't discussing the increase in investment since the leave vote. I was referring to a previous poster's comments along the lines of, and I'm paraphrasing, the government haven't been and should have have been investing in projects years ago (somewhere between 3 and 25 years ago) My links were to show that there has been investment in this time inc the NHS and Northern Powerhouse.

time you are still studiously avoiding discussing how you think the EU is going to make a difference here?

Bear no I'm not avoiding I'm trying to stay within the OPs original post(ish). Otherwise, as experience has shown, everything just goes circular and I get a bit bored

TBH I'm not even sure I'm quite getting your last point but it's been a long week so it might just be me.

Time

The amount of investment is not commensurate with that required, be it education, transport, social care or the NHS... which in real terms has seen dramatic cuts in funding since 2010, the recent spending increases will not make up the difference.
Its just plain lazy to say the NHS isn't working.
Historically, the NHS is under funded by about 1% to 2% per year compared to european average, that adds up to billions of pounds over time.

Meanwhile, corporation tax has been slashed.......to the lowest in g20, more cuts to come.

There has been modest investment, but the Northern Powerhouse is quite frankly a joke. If a quarter of the money already spent on HS2 without a metre of track being laid, had been committed and spent we would already be able to see improvements.

The 'Northern Powerhouse' concept itself is flawed - it ought to be called the South Pennine Powerhouse, which might just bring home to southern England that there is an awful lot of country north of Leeds - Manchester -Liverpool.

tme, nice try but you’re just avoiding the question.

Whether its about the Northern powerhouse, the NHS or job replacement in general.

It’s not difficult to see that I’m asking how Leaving the EU is going to improve these areas?

Jas/Peregrina. My point was that there has been investment in the North and in the NHS. I certainly don't think the NP is a joke and it may be lazy to say the NHS isn't working but it's also plainly true (and there are a multitude of reasons for this).

I hardly think the investment in the north compares to that of the south east.

Time

If you don't invest in the best systems in the world, they will fail... & the NHS isn't the best but we are where we are, reform cannot take place when we have less of all med staff and beds per 100,000 head of population, compared to euro HC systems.

We need to address that first and foremost.... especially as we have such poor preventative medicine, obesity, dental care, diabetes etc

Obv this is all a bit off topic but the relative point here is all brexits leave us worse off, so less money to spend across all sectors, including industrial RnD.

Peregrina I never said it did because it quite clearly doesn’t.

Jas I disagree, first and foremost reform needs to start by removing the NHS from politics completely (but that's a whole other discussion).

time you might be right but to believe it’s going to happen is hopelessly naive.

start by removing the NHS from politics completely

NHS funding is part of 'politics' as are all public services.

Healthcare free at the point of use and funded by taxes always is.