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Brexit

Westminstenders: The Schlong Extension

971 replies

RedToothBrush · 06/04/2019 13:18

If Macron gets his way we have less than a week. And he seems pretty gung ho - convincing Spain and Belgium, when his veto, alone, would be enough

^Everyone talking about the flextensionschlong extension needs to listen to Macron. If he has his way - it's not happening.
Icantreachthepretzels

What has Macron actually said though and what does he actually believe in?

Just after the first extension was given, Macron said that if nothing changed before the 12th that DID NOT necessarily mean no deal ON the 12th itself. He said it could be on a day of the EU's choosing. It was a hint at a stay of execution at least.

In the last 24 hours or so, the noises have been that France favours no deal but wants two weeks for the markets to prepare. That's consistent with Macron's previous comments.

So I think it's fairly reasonable to take this as your baseline minimum. That would put us exiting on around 26th. I don't think we can refuse this minimum simply because we need every possible day we can get.

Indeed Macron apparently said at the last EU summit that he was in favour of an unconditional offer to stay in until 7th May but Merkel disagree not wanting us to exit the day before the EU's day of unity (9th).

So I think its reasonable that staying in until the 7th is very possible, but if Merkel is unhappy for symbolic reasons I think shift to the following week would be a reasonable compromise to Macron. Or it could make the 26th more likely.

Now the question is just how wedded Macron is to a Hardline approach? We know its Tusk and Merkel pushing Flextension because they lived in Eastern Europe at they have personal reasons over it. We know that Merkel only ever raised her voice to Cameron once over a conversation involving putting up borders with free movement. It's her big thing. And for Macron domestically he's made loud noises about the UK going sooner rather than later. He did a big uturn on his initial comments in agreeing to the 12th / 22nd. So there is something of a collision course here one way or another. Someone has to back down. Who will it be?

My suspicion is that privately whilst Macron knows he has to be tough and favours a sharp exit for domestic reasons he also respects Merkel. How he values his relationship with Merkel might be a big consideration as to how far he is prepared to compromise as well as how many others share France's reservations. I think it notable that whilst France has the power of veto, it seems to be trying to get the support of some of the other 26 too. I think it unlikely France would go for a veto if it were in a minority of one simply because that wouldn't be great for EU unity if others think it a high risk to go for only a short extension. So how easy it is to change the minds of others is perhaps more important than France’s position alone. Whilst throwing his weight around might look attractive and tempting to getting a more French centred leading of the EU post Merkel and whilst he might want to crack on with a much more integrated EU, he's not going to starting from a good place if France is resented for its hardline over Brexit. I'd argue that realistically France needs to work with the other 26 to get any reforms and leadership it wants.

Thus any concessions given won't be because Macron has sympathy for the UK, but because it suits his long term agenda in the EU.

Its worth remembering the conclusions of the last summit, in this context, were also of the opinion that we were more or less incapable of looking after ourselves and almost a failed state that needed baby sitting. They clearly think May is incapable. They may well favour a long extension purely on this basis to let Tories, Tory because no deal and a government collapse at the same time might be something they consider to be exceptionally bad and destabilising. And therefore pose something of a security risk to the EU. (France would, perhaps, be most exposed to this in theory). Indeed Alberto Nardelli of BuzzFeed reported yesterday that many felt a short extension was very risky to the EU. That suggests Macron is somewhat on the back foot.

There is also the observation that transition under the WA isn't a whole lot different to an extension. The real only stumbling block is the EP. The term Flextension really only hides this. And No Deal will merely lead to the WA at some point

No Deal just has a dangerous chaos section in the middle.

The French are certainly not convinced of a long extension though (and Tusk has acknowledged this in his push for a long extension. He is taking the French position seriously and is seeking to persuade rather than dismissing as posturing). On the other hand, its also taken seriously by hardline Tories looking to drive a wedge. Jacob Rees-Mogg's tweet about being obstructive in the EU parliament was very firmly aimed at influencing Macron. Arguably this might well have the opposite affect as it goes, as Macron will be smart enough to see it for what it is.

The other consideration in all this is the make up of the European Parliament itself. There are 14 countries who get extra seats. I can't find the full list, but here's nine of them: Denmark, Croatia, Austria, Finland, Sweden, Ireland, Italy, France and Spain. Having more seats is an important thing. And might be influential on what happens.

In Ireland's case it's particularly difficult. Unlike the UK it DOES NOT have a list system.

Peter Foster @pmdfoster
I understand Ireland is a tricky case, because it doesn't have list system.

This means you can't elect four MEPs and then choose top 3 until UK leaves and IE takes fourth seat...becuase if you ran only a 3-seat election you would get different top 3, than if ran 4-seat

Schlong extension with guillotine is something of a practical issue that needs clarification for the Irish; it's not really viable if we aren't committed to staying in for a fixed amount of time, whatever that might be. Exiting at our time of choosing or just having elections and then never taking our seats it's going to stick. I can't see how it will. So that's the exit on 30th June ruled out. Our exit will be something the EU will want to control the date of in some way, even if there is a 'guillotine clause'.

Nick Gutteridge (Sun) thinks a long extension is the most likely option on the balance of probabilities. Peter Foster (Telegraph) is slightly more doubtful and hestitant after hearing the French line. Prior to this he stated: “No deal” risk receded (for now) soon as May indicated Monday night she was open to ‘flextension’ and EU elex. Alberto Nardelli (BuzzFeed) and Katya Adler (BBC) seem to be of a similar mind set to Foster. Gutteridge and Foster have generally been more reliable than British journalists.

The big but to all this is whether May triggers EP elections in the Privy Council before the summit to signal her commitment. If she fails to do it, thinking she can do it after the summit, she won't be taken seriously and I think there is real danger it will revert to the French line.

If nothing else, if I had £100 to bet on whether we are still in the EU next Saturday, I think I'd have to put it on yes we will be. I may be wrong, but despite EU anger and frustration there isn't much to suggest a hard and fast guillotine on the 12th itself.

Will May and the ERG except a long extension? May sounds like she already has. But this is May, and until she takes action, she can't be trusted. Gove is quoted as saying: “It does not matter what the length of the extension that may be offered is. It ends at the point we are out” which seems to be a considered moderate response. Mogg's comments read as a belligerent acceptance of a long extension rather than a total rejection of the idea completely.

So I think if we are offered a long extension, we'll go through all the usual Peter Griffin impersonations and Boris Johnson huffing and puffing that it's a bad thing but it will be sucked up.

Then theres the question of May. She said she'd stay until the next phase. But a date of the 22nd May was also touted. That's probably more what Brexiteers will have their eyes on, than an extension which they will tolerate. It gives them longer to prep for no deal after all. And that ultimately might not be against the interests of the EU either. It just continues the transfer of business to the EU after all.

OP posts:
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67chevvyimpala · 07/04/2019 17:54

I'm off to do some yoga in an effort to align my chakras or something

prettybird · 07/04/2019 17:54

Misti , let's just say I'd be happy if she had an epiphany and decided that her future was in a nunnery not going to happen Wink

She has a 23,000 majority, so unless there are swings on a scale of what happened in Scotland after the Indyref (and unfortunately, I don't think the EU Referendum has had the same effect in England as it is not as simple as "party lines" Confused), she is still a shoo-in for the next GE whenever that may be

It's one of the few things that Louise28 and I agree on Wink: she has a face like a well skelpt arse Shock That is nothing to do with how attractive she may or may not be and everything to do with the soor-faced expression she always has. Ugliness of spirit within, manifesting on the outside Hmm

TatianaLarina · 07/04/2019 17:55

Except I don’t think even Corbyn is a stupid as Clegg was in that situation. Clegg trusted the Tories. Corbyn does not. Or even if he might, Starmer won’t let him.

Motheroffourdragons · 07/04/2019 17:57

This reply has been deleted

This has been deleted by MNHQ to protect the privacy of the user.

prettybird · 07/04/2019 18:00

Problem is that Corbyn is really a Lexiter (so wants out of the EU anyway to progress things he can do already as long as he follwed due process his nationalising of the railways) and a Marxist if not in his policies (because, as has been discussed, even under Corbyn, his policies aren't really that radical and in many parts of Europe would be seen as pretty centrist Confused) but in his political class analysis and wants to create the environment in which the proletariat will rise up and Seamus he can "show them the way" Hmm

So Corbyn can't be trusted an inch either Sad

Jason118 · 07/04/2019 18:01

Imagine if Loathsome was your MP, how would you feel? I'll tell you, like shitSmile

MockerstheFeManist · 07/04/2019 18:01

She's gone bonkers:

twitter.com/theresa_may/status/1114891046025084931

Officially Bonkers.

AuldAlliance · 07/04/2019 18:03

FGS.
TM on that sofa with her throaty chuckles, her smiles like a death rictus and her bloody hypocritical "I'm doing my best, but others are getting in the way, titter" spiel makes me want to boak.

And then punch something.

(I have never punched anything in my life...)

havingtochangeusernameagain · 07/04/2019 18:03

the two parties had found common ground on many Brexit issues, including ending free movement

but only for British citizens, hey? Why can everyone else in Europe move around freely but we should be stuck on our island?

DGRossetti · 07/04/2019 18:04

Lions and lambs have common ground in breathing air ...

Ellie56 · 07/04/2019 18:10

I do feel fury at the utter irresponsibility of Cameron for calling a bloody stupid referendum and organising it in such a bloody stupid way,

Yes yes yes, and then the stupid twat threw the towel in and did a runner, despite promising only months earlier he would not resign if people voted to leave! He has so much to answer for! Angry

MockerstheFeManist · 07/04/2019 18:11

At PMQs, she has stated that JC wants to destroy the country.

But that doesn't mean she can't do business with him.

WhatWouldScoobyDoo · 07/04/2019 18:15

That TM video is really scary. Like the bit of the Men in Black film where the farmer’s body is possessed by the alien cockroach.

TheNorthWestPawsage · 07/04/2019 18:15

Ignore informality, shaky camera and awkward laughs. This is another trap for Corbyn. Ending free movement is the first thing May says she has in common with Labour. That should go down like a bucket of cold sick. It’s time for Labour to stand behind its own principles.
twitter.com/jonlis1/status/1114905543842443264?s=21

TheMShip · 07/04/2019 18:16

^At PMQs, she has stated that JC wants to destroy the country.

But that doesn't mean she can't do business with him.^

After all, she does business with the Saudis and the ERG ...

TalkinPaece · 07/04/2019 18:16

Plant label tucked into the thread

have not read the last 580 posts

but have to say that Leadsom reckoning she knows better than the Cabinet Secretary about the impact of No Deal TOOK THE BISCUIT

MockerstheFeManist · 07/04/2019 18:17

...shakey camera

Is that you, Chris Grayling?

Ellie56 · 07/04/2019 18:17

But as many have pointed out - it's so odd that we suddenly do have power in the EU.

Yes Nicola Sturgeon nailed it.
"How strange - isn’t this the same guy who said the UK had no power to do any of these things in the EU and that’s why we had to leave." Grin

MaudBaileysGreenTurban · 07/04/2019 18:21

Idiot Cat giving a better sofa performance than May

Ellie56 · 07/04/2019 18:26

That's not difficult is it Maud?

Even a plank of wood would give a better performance.

TalkinPaece · 07/04/2019 18:26

GABAPENTIN and PREGABELIN
just to pick up on this as DD used to take bucket loads of both
they were - on 1st April - reclassified as Class C drugs due to massive evidence all over the UK and Yerp of abuse of prescriptions
therefore stockpile prescriptions like DD used to get are now banned
so drug companies are under massive pressure to reduce supply.
A bugger for those who need the bucket loads
but NOTHING TO DO WITH BREXIT

HazardGhost · 07/04/2019 18:35

Just silent watched TM's message to the people. She keeps threatening us with risking no brexit at all and now not leaving but when will she deliver on this threat? I want that threat delivered to the people.

Agree her tone was much calmer and less destructive. Much better, less riot inducing, she doesn't sound like a PM whose actively about to kill people.

Pilcrow · 07/04/2019 18:38

May's acting is grotesquely bad in that sofa video 😱

As for Loathsome, I was unfortunate enough to see her a few weeks ago at Euston station as I was arriving.....she was departing, I presume to her Northampton constituency by train. I glared at her. Best I could do under the circs.

The80sweregreat · 07/04/2019 18:41

Loathsome said today ' I wouldn't want to work with Jeremy Corbyn'
I'm sure he wouldn't want to work with her in the room either. What a nasty woman.
' let's all blame labour' game has revved up a gear. Tories are so transparent.

MaudBaileysGreenTurban · 07/04/2019 18:45

Just found out that a colleague of mine who is applying for settled status has been told that there is no record of her living here for the past 6 months.

She has worked both for the NHS and for our profession's national regulator for years.

Angry Angry