Westminstenders: The Bill Cash Appreciation Society

[RedToothBrush]

We've had a new thread pretty much everyday for the last week or so, so I'm short on inspiration.

There haven't been too many new developments today. There have been two ministerial resignations. Both were ministers close to Boris Johnson.

We had a vote to add an extension if we still have no deal agreed at the end of next week to the Withdrawal Bill. May has said she will do this anyway; this would merely tie her hands. It passed by 5 votes. It now is fast tracked to the committee stage and third reading.

A business of the house amendment by Benn to secure a debate and Indicative Vote 3 next week failed after a speakers vote. Bercow followed convention and didn't create a majority where there was not one (though under Erskine May he is free to do the opposite at his discretion).

Corbyn has met May for talks which have been described as construction, though we have no further details though curiously Emily Thornberry put out a statement demanding a ref on whatever was decided which suggests Corbyn isn't keen on the idea. Rumours are of Schrodingers Customs Union: somehow being in a union but not a union. It can't be called a customs union. And Liam Fox has said Corbyn can't have his union. Though he may have a vested interest as he loses his job if Corbyn gets his way.

Oh and the Commons photocopier broke so no one knows what is currently supposed to be happening.

Otherwise it's been a quiet day, all things considered. Too quiet?

No I can see it working for them.

There are a certain section of the population who would be pleased at 'the homeless being liquidated'. Some actively want social darwinism as a quick fix to 'social problems' (aka as poor people who are regarded as a 'drain' on society)

They won't believe any promise from May promise, with her history of reneging

I don't think they'll have to trust her - surely, like last time they will offer two extension dates with conditions: if you go ahead with EP, then you can extend to (say) 31 Dec, if no EP, then that automatically reverts to 22 May.

The question is can the UK trust her to allow EP, rather than force us into 22 May exit and continue to play chicken with her deal.

Possible Red but only if it anonymous.

In this case it would richer family members watching possibly younger relations flounder. There would be repercussions.

RedToothBrush
Hot Fuzz last night pretty much summed up some of the attitudes
Crusty Jugglers and that

Continuing reason to avoid any PV if it requires No Deal as an option:

YouGov poll
No Deal is only the preference of 26%, but would narrowly beat Remain in a 2-way vote
(poll out today)

Anthony Wells analysis of what it means

https://mobile.twitter.com/anthonyjwells/status/1113764259706613761

https://yougov.co.uk/topics/politics/articles-reports/2019/04/04/what-do-public-think-about-no-deal-brexit

Except it is nonsense, the poor don't cease to exist just because they get poorer. They get sicker, die sooner perhaps but they are still there. Living in houses without heating or water, suffering from a wider range of illness. More unequal, financially volatile countries have slums, violence and stunted GDP's. They have more problems not less and the problems impact all socio-economic groups in one way or another.

While the HoC is being cleansed of its sins I’m watching the Lords and it is WILD. If the archaic posturing and 17th century customs seem strange to any of you, just imagine how this looks to forrin little me. I’m utterly fascinated.

(They dont say Aye/No! They say content/not content because they’re not common! You couldn’t make it up!)

Labour Whips @ labourwhips
The sitting of the House of Commons has been suspended as there appears to be a sewerage leak in the press gallery

Tom Newton Dunn @tnewtondunn
Are you saying the Lobby is full of shit?

Like the truth is stranger than fiction.

There are many places in the country where Hot Fuzz isn't a comedy. It's a documentary. Minus the satanic bits.

The EU will grant an extension if they see a feasible plan for an orderly Brexit by the end of 2019

Current views here and what I read from Brussels is that there will NOT be an extension just to put off No Deal

Logic is that No Deal will force the UK back to negotiate a trade deal within 6 months ... and the UK would first have to sign the WA

RTB
Don't I know it. I'm reading Parish Council minutes at the moment

Absolutely depends on the Q as discussed earlier Bigchoc

Given that WA versus Remain is the preferred PV option and as outlined earlier disgruntled Tories would all have to campaign for WA I see absolutely no way WA plus PV would get through the HoC anyway, let alone passing the Electoral Commission.

The EU will not even grant an extension to 22 May unless the withdrawal agreement has been passed OR the UK has agreed to prepare for elections, because the UK retains its right to revoke during any extension. So technically, May could call the whole thing off on 21 May and jeopardise the integrity of the EP AND break an international treaty bc she’d be depriving citizens of their right to representation.

Back to being fascinated by the Lords...

Daddad There is little benefit to the EU of extending without purpose, just considerable risk

They are worried that the UK will use any prolonged extension to block other EU business and demand the EU makes major concessions

There was much disgust that the UK has already protected Hungary from the preliminary actions to start Article 7 suspension.
This was solely to try to get Hungary's support over Brexit

Dreich, they become easier politically to do things like 'warehouse' in the short term.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-england-essex-47720887?__twitter_impression=true
Inside Harlow's office block 'human warehouse' housing

Poor ghettos.

Paul Waugh @paulwaugh
Looks like Lords consideration of Cooper bill could tip into Monday now for remaining stages. Even if peers sit late tonight unlikely to clear it. Lords has Monday largely free to do rest of it

Nikki da Costa @nmdacosta
If this happens Royal Assent would not be received until Tues, and PM would not be required to move a motion on extension in Commons until Wednesday. The EU27 meet at 6pm that day to discuss extension.

You are right red you will get ghettos or slums, either by accident or design. Places where law and order in more internally rather than externally enforced, appalling living conditions and life chances.
But the rest of society will be impacted by these issues, the comfortable now may not believe this but that's only because they haven't lived in an extremely unequal society. They are totally wrong to think it won't effect them as well.

They are worried that the UK will use any prolonged extension to block other EU business and demand the EU makes major concessions

Yep this is why I think Revoke and Remain as a total PITA is the best way to renegotiate a sensible WA which works for both sides instead of the "force us to reconsider" nonsense currently in play.

@red Do you have any further info about the Order in Council for EP elections ?

I read May would do this on 11 April, the day after the EU council decides on the extension

If so, totally stupid posturing - it needs to be done by EOB Monday, so that the E27 heads of govt can be properly briefed

Looks like Lords consideration of Cooper bill could tip into Monday now for remaining stages

Why not tomorrow?

Leaking roof, broken photocopiers. The Commons is not happy. Wait until the foundations give way...

The Mother of Parliaments is quite literally falling down. They will have to move out soon for at least a decade, and we know about govt. building projects and their tendancy to over-run. (Very) Cross rail, anyone?

This is all very fin-de-siecle, like the days of the Great Reform Act and the Corn Laws. On no account must the bastards be allowed to put it back the way it was. We want a proper hemicycle with a seat for every member, electronic voting and a fair votng system so every vote cast elects someone.

We used to get given eec butter and tins of eec stewed beef for free dreich.

That's another reason why I'm so upset about leaving. There's still a lot of poverty where I live in Cornwall, but the actual area is better thanks to EU funding.

If this happens Royal Assent would not be received until Tues, and PM would not be required to move a motion on extension in Commons until Wednesday. The EU27 meet at 6pm that day to discuss extension.

I just like to hark back to when DD said repeatedly that the EU will leave things until the last minute.

Dreich I've seen speculation that the US will be more like Brazil with favela style slums of make shift buildings, with all the social problems that accompany that, than a 1st world nation within 20 years. Living right next to mansions with private security guards.

I think it's a conservative estimate.

The UK is the same. There are already communities living in tunnels under Manchester.
www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/homeless-people-living-squalid-tunnels-10331196.amp

Its horrendous in Central Manchester atm. Parts of the city that were OK I certainly would now avoid after dark. And the human shit in the Northern Quarter is something else.

Andy Burnham is trying to move the problem on but I'm not sure he's even touching the surface and it's just moving it rather than solving it.

Ed Stafford's c4 documentary 60 days on the street is awful. A hardened survivalist who found it hard.

We are definitely headed the same way, very quickly and Brexit will only speed it up.

Tory philosophy - remember this is Mays religion - is that the poor are poor because that's what God wants. Indeed, there are people who regard it as sinful to help the poor as it's interfering in Gods plan.

It was just about manageable during the Victorian era of philanthropy as a means to salve the conscience - especially when it became the displacement activity for Ladies who could not vote or own property (working, being out of the question, naturally). but luckily several generations of studied atheism from the Gentry has meant no one feels the need to save their soul by helping others anymore.

That's why it wasn't a good tactic to oppose the Bedroom tax as costing more than the benefits it was supposed to save. It wasn't designed to save money (after all, government can just raise more). It was designed to teach the poor their place. As is all of "austerity".

Against that backdrop, an impoverishing no-deal is actually just the ticket, if you believe that your place on earth is divinely ordained.

And now, Hymn 43, All Things Bright and Beautiful (I've embuggered the bit you really need to belt out )

Chorus:
All things bright and beautiful,
All creatures great and small,
All things wise and wonderful,
The Lord God made them all.

Each little flower that opens,
Each little bird that sings,
He made their glowing colours,
He made their tiny wings.

Chorus...

The rich man in his castle,
The poor man at his gate,
God made them high and lowly,
And ordered their estate.

Chorus...

The purple headed mountain,
The river running by,
The sunset and the morning,
That brightens up the sky;−

Chorus...

The cold wind in the winter,
The pleasant summer sun,
The ripe fruits in the garden,−
He made them every one:

Chorus...

The tall trees in the greenwood,
The meadows where we play,
The rushes by the water,
We gather every day;−

Chorus...

He gave us eyes to see them,
And lips that we might tell,
How great is God Almighty,
Who has made all things well.

Chorus...

(Amen)

(Other religions are available.)