Governments response to revoke article 50 petition

[Olivetoil]

This Government will not revoke Article 50. We will honour the result of the 2016 referendum and work with Parliament to deliver a deal that ensures we leave the European Union.
It remains the Government’s firm policy not to revoke Article 50. We will honour the outcome of the 2016 referendum and work to deliver an exit which benefits everyone, whether they voted to Leave or to Remain.
Revoking Article 50, and thereby remaining in the European Union, would undermine both our democracy and the trust that millions of voters have placed in Government.
The Government acknowledges the considerable number of people who have signed this petition. However, close to three quarters of the electorate took part in the 2016 referendum, trusting that the result would be respected. This Government wrote to every household prior to the referendum, promising that the outcome of the referendum would be implemented. 17.4 million people then voted to leave the European Union, providing the biggest democratic mandate for any course of action ever directed at UK Government.
British people cast their votes once again in the 2017 General Election where over 80% of those who voted, voted for parties, including the Opposition, who committed in their manifestos to upholding the result of the referendum.
This Government stands by this commitment.
Revoking Article 50 would break the promises made by Government to the British people, disrespect the clear instruction from a democratic vote, and in turn, reduce confidence in our democracy. As the Prime Minister has said, failing to deliver Brexit would cause “potentially irreparable damage to public trust”, and it is imperative that people can trust their Government to respect their votes and deliver the best outcome for them.
Department for Exiting the European Union

Not unexpected. Thoughts on wording?

*But I’m now beginning to think that this whole fiasco is such a catastrophic clusterfuck that people do need to be asked “are you actually sure this is what you want?” “Really?” With ALL of the information to hand. Because whatever your point of view, nobody can even begin to claim that the first referendum was held on an informed basis. Even parliament didn’t know what Brexit would actually amount to at that stage.

If people then choose to leave the EU knowing full well what will happen then so be it.*

This is very well written and sums up the situation perfectly. I don't care that leave won (although the constant reminders of we won we won are excessively childish). However, to use just one vote, which was held without all the facts, as the basis from strong-arming us into numerous poor decisions is not democratic.

If I got a job based on lies and misinformation it would only be fair and just to hold a second round of interviews once this information came to light. If they held a second vote now that the lies have been exposed and the realities have become clearer and leave still won that would be fine. To continue pushing forward regardless of all the new information is what pisses me off most.

If I got a job based on lies and misinformation it would only be fair and just to hold a second round of interviews once this information came to light

Well that’s all the MPs out of a job.

I think Sarah Wollastan's argument based on informed consent is the best argument I've heard for a second referendum.

Before doctors undertake interventions that may result in harm to the patient, they explain the intervention, the likely outcomes and the risks, and the patient gives informed consent to confirm that they understand what will happen and the risks they are taking.

Likewise if Brexit risks being harmful, people should be told honestly what it will involve and what the risks are, and then confirm whether or not they consent to it.

I don't agree with referendums generally but I think this is a very good, honest argument.

Shockingly insulting and dismissive response. I'm not and never have been a Tory voter, but if I were or were a potential voter that email would royally piss me off and likely make me far less likely to vote for them certainly in the near future.

Also insulting to schedule the debate for April 1!

"What do you think people know now that they did not know in 2016 that will encourage those who voted leave to change their vote to remain?" A hell of a lot actually!

Just a few examples:

That they were lied to

That the referendum was run in a corrupt fashion

How leave will affect them and their families directly & negatively (even seen on many threads on here when leavers have asked questions about things like "we can feed ourselves surely?" "Why would prices rise?" Etc) inc major employers withdrawing from U.K. As a direct result.

The Northern Ireland border issue which many outside of NI either didn't consider or didn't think would be problematic.

That immigration control won't actually change that much (which for many leavers was their main reason for voting leave)

That the problems within the U.K. Are largely of the U.Ks own making at a govt level at least - austerity policies particularly lack of funding for essential services, homelessness, poverty, cuts etc

There have been leavers who've posted here, on other forums, on sm and I know some in real life too who feel they were deceived/misled and would vote remain if asked now.

Mistake after mistake:

Mistake 1 - underestimating how disenfranchised and fed up a large amount of the population felt

Mistake 2 - Brexit should have been clearly defined in consultation with the eu (so we knew the costs involved too) BEFORE the referendum was presented to the voters for voting on.

Mistake 3 - triggering article 50 before getting ANY info or making ANY plans on how a leave would be implemented

Mistake 4 - ploughing on in a dictatorial fashion with ridiculous terms that amount to staying in the eu without any say on how it's run nor receiving any of the benefits

Mistake 5 - ignoring what's happening in terms of companies withdrawing from the uk, rising resentment of this govt (by which I mean all parties), rising tensions generally in relation to all this, people's fears of how it's going to affect them and not answering questions about eg of essential meds will still get through.

Cameron is the engineer of this mess but TM is the architect and she needs to go NOW

"They said they wouldn't have a GE in 2017 and they said they wouldn't extend Brexit. Both have happened. Don't give up hope yet, it's not over until we are out (and then we start agitating to get back in, or at least to stay in the EEA after transition)." True, but I reserve the right to worry because it's still possible to at least temporarily screw us the ordinary people over!

"This comment has made me mad......the electorate were not given a viable alternative which stood on an opposing platform. If you were a remainer what choice was there?" Totally agree!

It intrigues me how the indicative votes are advisory and Andrea Ledsom was on R4 this morning saying that they may not be acted on, but the Referrendum result was also advisory but the Tory Party seem keen to defend it to the hilt. When is advisory not advisory?

It's a bland, formulaic response that most of us must have expected, but that doesn't make it any less frustrating and disappointing. I doubt the debate on Monday will be any less so - I've read the Hansard transcripts for debates following petitions I've signed in the past, and invariably they seem to be a meaningless exercise in going through the motions. You almost imagine that the MPs taking part have to draw straws.

Nil desperandum, though. Despite the obvious issues that arise with a relatively unmonitored online petition, it was always going to have a symbolic importance if the number of signatories was high enough and I think it's clear now that it's had an impact, both in Westminster and in Brussels. As a result of the petition and the march on Saturday, MPs now have a clear justification for serious discussion of a further referendum or even a revocation of Art.50, in a way that would have been unthinkable even a few weeks ago. In particular the stark contrast with the 'no deal now' petition (about half a million) and the hilarious Jarrow 2.0 march (ahem...100 and dwindling) has totally undermined the crappy 'will of the people' meme.

The shameful treatment of the poor woman who started it has also thrown into sharp relief the character of the sort of people who are trying to stifle a sensible review of what the country really wants and needs.

The shameless behaviour of BJ and JRM last night and this morning is clear evidence that the leavers are panicking, which I'm sure is related and makes me very happy.

It wasn't at all a response that sought to bring a divided country back together. Instead it said that we actually don't give a stuff about what millions of people think. And to send the response before the debate was utterly crass. It shows that they have no regard for their own processes,

That they were lied to

Only remainers think that

That the referendum was run in a corrupt fashion

Only remainers think that

There have been leavers who've posted here, on other forums, on sm and I know some in real life too who feel they were deceived/misled and would vote remain if asked now

Speculation. My ex said in court that I had hidden vast sums of money, but had no evidence. Judge applied common sense and dismissed the case.

Mistake 1 - underestimating how disenfranchised and fed up a large amount of the population felt

Always going to happen when government is made up of very wealthy people.

Mistake 2 - Brexit should have been clearly defined in consultation with the eu (so we knew the costs involved too) BEFORE the referendum was presented to the voters for voting on

Both UK government and EU thought remain would win easily as they failed to recognize mistake 1.

Mistake 3 - triggering article 50 before getting ANY info or making ANY plans on how a leave would be implemented

Forced themselves into it by saying they would honour the result of the referendum and making same commitment in their manifestos before the 2017 general election.

Mistake 4 - ploughing on in a dictatorial fashion with ridiculous terms that amount to staying in the eu without any say on how it's run nor receiving any of the benefits

Because T May is a remainer.

Mistake 5 - ignoring what's happening in terms of companies withdrawing from the uk, rising resentment of this govt (by which I mean all parties), rising tensions generally in relation to all this, people's fears of how it's going to affect them and not answering questions about eg of essential meds will still get through

MP's are much more wealthy than average person in the street. Hence they will never experience the same worries.

"They said they wouldn't have a GE in 2017 and they said they wouldn't extend Brexit. Both have happened

Proof that MP's can't be trusted.

True, but I reserve the right to worry because it's still possible to at least temporarily screw us the ordinary people over!

MP's are not ordinary people and will never experience the same worries as those who are ordinary.

When is advisory not advisory?

When it suits the personal ambitions of MP's

Pizzacafe2016 - On many threads you have been given facts about lies** during the leave campaigns and investigations that have shown corruption in the leave campaign, do you not read and look into any of these?

You keep just repeating only remainers think their was losing or corruption, ignoring actual facts and examples given to you.

^ Lying or corruption not losing or corruption.

I voted remain and signed this petition

However, the number of signatures (around 6m) is pathetically small compared to the number who voted to leave (17m). I actually don’t know anyone my age (40s) who voted leave.

Despite not wanting to, I think we have to leave. Us remainers are more vocal but the silent majority want to leave. So we have to.

When is advisory not advisory?

When it suits the personal ambitions of MP's

Referenda in the U.K. are advisory because parliament is sovereign. You know that sovereignty that leavers want so much. That sovereignty that we need to take back. We already have it and it means referenda are advisory.

Parliamentary sovereignty do you want it or not?

Speculation. My ex said in court that I had hidden vast sums of money, but had no evidence

Oh i see

That explains a lot about your posts

MP's are much more wealthy than average person in the street. Hence they will never experience the same worries

Spot on

Proof that MP's can't be trusted

I agree, it amazes me that there seem to be posters (not you) that have only just realised this

Just in case some people think martial law is a formality, here's what it means (courtesy of Google):

Martial law is the imposition of direct military control of normal civilian functions of government, especially in response to a temporary emergency such as invasion or major disaster, or in an occupied territory

The will of the people is a transient thing anyway. It's not just the same people changing their minds (although there is some of that). It's old people dying, young people- who it will affect the most- coming of age and being eligible to vote.

If it was all about the will of one set of The People being followed on one occasion that decides the fate forever, we would never have been able to have this referendum because we would have been stuck with the original decision to join.

However, the number of signatures (around 6m) is pathetically small compared to the number who voted to leave (17m).

@Kaddm How would you say the proportion of the population who generally sign online petitions compares with the proportion of the population who are registered to vote?

I'm a remainer but I can see why they would ignore the 6M signatures. As far as I am concerned 17M isn't the will of the people, so 6M certainly isn't either, if anything it indicates that maybe the number of people wanting to remain as dwindled if you really want to read anything in the numbers. At the end of the day between the remain voters and the non voters you have a pool of about 40M people and only 6M decided to sign the petition. Why? Just being devil's advocate and have come to the conclusion that unfortunately there is probably a much smaller pool of people that reads and cares about the brexit outcome. Too many people are disengaged, too busy with social media and other bollox to care about politics and they just think that it will be alright in the end.

No one is saying that the petition should be regarded in the same way as a vote but it should have some influence.

The petition, the demonstrations the letters indicate a strength of feeling that should be taken into account.

if anything it indicates that maybe the number of people wanting to remain as dwindled if you really want to read anything in the numbers.

Erm no

I just haven't signed it yet

I dont generally sign petitions....but again if its going to be taken as another sign that anyone who doesn't sign it has changed their mind I'll have to bloody sign it (i know you're not saying this easterly)

I'll get dh and ds1 to sign it as well

The petition, the demonstrations the letters indicate a strength of feeling that should be taken into account

Why? The 6 Million who signed the petition maybe part of the 16.1 Million that voted remain in 2016. If so what has changed? Is there any evidence that the 6 Million who signed all voted leave in 2016? Even if they did what is to say it is not a hoax?

I know leavers who signed it with the sole intent of giving false hope to those that voted remain. Nasty, but an online petition can be signed by anyone.

I know leavers who signed it with the sole intent of giving false hope to those that voted remain. Nasty, but an online petition can be signed by anyone.

Brilliant- I wouldn't mind them voting Remain in a second ref for the same purpose! 😀

God what with all the leavers, people who live abroad and children signing it i bet no one who voted remain signed it

Honestly for an online petition, which we all know will have no effect, people arent half desperate to explain that the votes mean nothing

Does that actually happen with other non binding petitions?

Oh and signing a petition which they don't actually believe in and in fact is the exact opposite to what they believe in isnt nasty

Its makes them fucking stupid