Why do people say that both sides of the referendum campaign told lies?

[Apileofballyhoo]

What are the lies?

EU immigration didn't cause most of the problems being cited. Studies have shown that immigrants from the EU are net tax contributors, higher than UK citizens, and much higher than non-EU citizens. They also have little to no effect on wages. As for the notion that they're stealing UK jobs, that's absurd. There are farmers on record as having to let crops rot in the fields because they couldn't get the EU pickers they have come to rely on, and the number of NHS vacancies is at its highest level ever while in parallel over 70,000 more EU citizens left the UK last year than came here.

Also, the number of people who see immigration as an important factor in Brexit has dropped from around 45% at the referendum to under 20% now.

Immigration is emotive. It grabs the headlines. It plays to the worst fears of the hard right, and stokes them to a boiling hatred. But 8 out of 10 people aren't concerned about it. And rightly so, because the facts support their lack of concern.

There was no issue filling job roles pre 97 because there wasn’t enough jobs to go around.
I grew up in an area that felt the full force of Maggie.
I do actually agree that immigration should have been more controlled - but that was down to the British Govt and the way they implement things.
And during the referendum campaign a lot of the immigration that was complained about was non EU immigration.

But on the other hand I can understand people’s concerns. But we should be looking closer to home for the issues

"Unfortunately thousands of trades people whose jobs were under cut by cheap labour wouldn't feel the same way you do about eu labour. "

"There is little evidence of substantial impacts of EEA immigration on
aggregate wages. Again, there is some evidence that lower-skilled workers face a negative impact while higher-skilled workers benefit, however themagnitude of the impacts are generally small"

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/741926/Final_EEA_report.PDF

On the self employed there is very little data, however, most EU migrants tend to be employed by others.

"You cannot stop the criminals. Sadly crime gangs, sex traffickers etc have also been able to access the UK. People with criminal records, murder in their home countries, who have then committed murder here too. "

We aren't in Schengen, and we won't be checking for things like this with Visas, people are criminals are going to come anyway, being out of the EU won't stop this.

We've had skills shortages in this country for decades, and still do despite immigration.in 2004 when immigration from the EU 8 started ( you do realise the other countries in the EU could come before this right/) the UK had hundreds of thousands of vacancies it could not fill.

Yes, the amount was unexpected, but your appeals to common sense etc are not valid.

Highlights from the migration committee report:

• There is no evidence that migration has reduced the training of UK-born workers.

EEA migrants pay more in taxes than they receive in benefits.
• The positive net contribution to the public finances is larger for EU13+ migrants than for NMS migrants

There is some evidence that migration has increased house prices. This impact is higher in areas with more restrictive planning policies where it is harder for the housing stock to increase in line with demand.

Caveat to the above - this comes from ONS data showing immigration has increased on average house prices by 20% over 25 years. However over this time House prices have increased 320% so
So the non immigration factors have increased house prices by 12% per year, whilst immigration has 0.8%.

EEA migrants contribute much more to the health service and the provision of social care in financial resources and work than they consume in services

EEA workers are an increasing share of the health and social care
workforces though these sectors employ greater numbers of non-EEA
migrants.
• There is no evidence that migration has reduced the quality of healthcare

There is no evidence that migration has reduced parental choice in schools or the educational attainment of UK-born children. On average children with English as an additional language out-perform native English speakers.

There is no evidence that migration has affected crime.
• There is no evidence that migration has reduced subjective well-being
though some suggestion that this varies with attitudes to migration.
• Overall, there is no evidence that people are less satisfied with their
neighbourhoods than in the past

Just a few of the detailed research highlights provided by a Government with Theresa May ( who has silenced positive migration reports before) as PM.

Facts eh, who'd use them?

*"House Prices will plummet= Great I might be finally afford to buy one"

Shows an utter misunderstanding of what actually happens if house prices crash*

Maybe but we have many threads on here with people waiting for a house price crash in order to buy.

It is the way a lot of people think

{Maybe but we have many threads on here with people waiting for a house price crash in order to buy.
It is the way a lot of people think}

With the likelihood of the Pound crashing too it will be those with money outside the UK that will make the real 'killing' like our friends Farage and Mogg.

1tisILeClerc

What I was trying to say was if you are going to tell a group of people who are waiting for house prices to crash that if you go and vote a certain way that house prices will crash then what do you expect is going to happen.

Most wouldn't think beyond that.

Also, the number of people who see immigration as an important factor in Brexit has dropped from around 45% at the referendum to under 20% now.

But that may be because those that were grumbling about immigration now think it’s all been sorted and “we’ll just send them all back home now” (which I have heard said in the Leave area I live in).

People say both sides because they don't want to admit that voting Leave meant you were duped by false promises of unicorns and sunlit uplands. They want to pretend that everyone was duped and that's why they voted as they did.

Yeah yeah if it makes you feel better I was really duped into preferring to tackle national problems from a stable basis. Those Remain buggers really got to me just like the Leave campaign got to you

Wages are surpressed by the design of our benefits system - built to promote lots of low wage ‘minijobs’, and our tax system, with built in incentives to structure jobs to avoid NICs and pensions auto enrolment and by the deliberate choice to do away with wage councils and to shackle the trade unions. These were all political choices. Immigration was a useful scapegoat.

What really upsets me is that we have sold our children’s free movement rights down to river because some people swallowed crap narratives about polish builders and nannies and patronising twaddle about ‘knowing best’. Inexcusable.

Wages were not suppressed during the 90s or early 2000s.

Real wages have not returned to their pre crisis levels because of the way the economy has grown since 2008, people have also been willing to accept less pay in order to hang on to a job.

The Polish builders narrative falls down when you look at the data, only a tiny fraction of people working in construction from the EU are outside London. In fact one third of all EU citizens are in London, which means the concentration elsewhere is very low, and mainly in cities, not smaller towns.

We were warned that if Brexit won, there'd need to be an immediate Budget and hikes! Proof that the Remainers lied too with their Project Fear.

Think we have another one !!

You got your emergency budget from Phillip Hammond, he didn't increase taxes ( although he tried on the self employed), he just delayed the end of austerity till 2027, rather than 2020.