To ask if anyone know what happens with EU citizens after brexit

[BlueandYellowandRed]

I'm from an EU country and have been living and working in England for 6 years now.

I just looked into getting British citizenship which apparently cost £1330. It's fine if it comes down to that I'm happy to pay for it. Although might move countries again as kind of started feeling a bit unwelcome here since the whole brexit thing took off.

Anyway I was just looking at the application and it crossed my mind that there must be millions of people in the same shoes as me and I wonder what the plan is for us after brexit?

It's not because there is "something special about Europeans that means they should be treated differently to Asians, Africans or Americans" it's because freedom of movement is a reciprocal arrangement and a fundamental part of the single market.

As for the "the UK has always been welcoming to hard working people from any country" - there are many, many examples where this has not been the case at all.

If you think the UK immigration system works perfectly well for non EU people harshbuttrue, you don't understand it. Couldn't possibly.

It's a shambles. The quality of decision making is uneven and poor, hence high success rates at appeal for eg asylum cases. The term not fit for purpose was invented for that branch of the Home Office. Things haven't improved since then.

Nobody knows, it could be really easy for you or negotiations could turn really nasty and all your rights could be stripped from you. I know much of the public have the pitchforks out for foreigners. I'm sorry you're going through this op, it was not my doing, I voted Remain. I would leave the country if I could.

buttermilkwaffles travelling alone or with EU dh I've been told I need to be in the EU line entering the UK (in the UK) with a non EU passport.

I've started the painful process for citizenship. Got my test,but now need to apply for settled (I think it is?) status which is a pain in the ass and then wait another year before I can apply. Then it's an £1300 fee just to apply. Oh well,I should really sort it I guess.

The gov plan is for all EU nationals to apply for settled status for a £65 fee. Tbh,I don't see how the system will cope with so many people at once and it's not 100% guaranteed it will stay that way. I just don't trust it or the government and due to how difficult it is to renew my own country's passport when needed I'd rather just have this done.

@HotblackDesiatoto

Ireland is nothing like the UK at all. But perhaps you were being humourous.

ROI has the most to lose from Brexit, they are totally correct to fight their corner as an Independent State.

It's quite a lot like the UK actually, in various ways. Odd to suggest otherwise.

Hotblack.

What are the similarities. You might explain.

I really don't think I have to, anyone who has lived in or even been to both countries can tell you. Or even those that haven't.

Honestly, does anyone actually have to explain how Ireland has many similarities to the UK? Really?

blueandyellow
I've been in the UK for over 20 years. I studied at a British university and then just stayed. My entire adult life is there. Brexit (and especially the recent chaotic months ) has reminded me that I'm still a foreigner. Things will not get easier for immigrants in the UK- or anywhere else for that matter. Yes, it hurts to spend one's savings on citizenship fees and the process is quite intrusive but that's the only way to regain some sort of confidence in one's rights. No one knows what 'settled' will mean in 10 years. As it'll be only digital, what if a bug corrupts data and 000s are denied basic services as a result?? Windrush truly terrified me. Only real proof of anything in the UK is a passport (and I shall always make sure I keep ALL expired ones too).

@ShadowCatt You need to apply for Permanent Residency Status first.

Google form 'PR' on the gov.co.uk website.

It costs £65 and took us 6 months from being sent off to receiving the PR card.

Once you have this then it's a case of meeting the language criteria - Taking a level 5 -B1 SELT Level 5 qualification in English if required, Passing the life in UK test and then applying for citizenship.

As you say I think there's a delay in having PR status and being able to apply for citizenship but you can in that time get everything else done so you can apply promptly once you can.

It's a horrendous process which we found very stressful as it frankly is intrusive and costs a lot. But is the only way of knowing you are truly protected from this chaos.

No one knows what this 'settled status' will actually consist of and the protections it will provide - personally we chose not to rely on it.

Has there any word on the status of ROI passport holders? Are they keeping the 1948 residency act or has EU residency legislation superceded it and therefore will it fall by the wayside when (if- crossed fingers) A50 is ratified.

Irish citizens' rights are separate (e.g. Irish citizens can vote in general elections, whereas other EU citizens cannot).

harshbuttrue1980
You may differ on this, but the Brexit vote showed that most people don't want people coming to the UK with no money and no job
Ah yes, Shrodingers immigrant.
The EU has never required the EU to accept unemployed EU migrants not in search of a job - the three month rule works just fine.
EU migrants claim out of work benefits at 1/6 the rate of native born Brits.
They get in work benefits because they do shitty jobs that Brits don't want to do.

If you think the US system works great, please explain why the whole of California's agriculture industry relies on undocumented hispanic illegals

Permanent Residence £65
Life in the UK test £50
English test £150
Citizenship application £1330 (includes £100 form checking service)
Biometric data £19.20 (done at post office once the application has been approved).
Cost of ceremony is included in the application fee.
Grand total £1614.20 plus travel and passport application fee.

harshbuttrue1980
You may differ on this, but the Brexit vote showed that most people don't want people coming to the UK with no money and no job

But people are not coming to the UK (from the EU) with no money and no job.

80% of EU immigrants in the UK have jobs - a far higher percentage than the indigenous workforce. Most arrive in the UK having already secured a job; after all, nobody gives up their job, home and risks their savings to trek across Europe just to be unemployed.

And as you know full well, if the UK actually wanted to, any EU citizen who was not able to support themselves could be asked to leave after 3 months. The person responsible for (not) implementing this policy is the Home Secretary. The longest serving Home Secretary of recent times is Theresa May.

There are a few different aspects to the discussion about EU citizens rights after Brexit.

The legal situation quoted above (Permanent Residence Status, Citizenship etc) has not yet been agreed with the EU and is part of the Leaving Agreement. The details have largely been agreed at negotiation level, but 'nothing is agreed until everything is agreed' means that EU citizens cannot be 100% sure of their situation, particularly in the event of a No Deal, Hard Brexit. While several posters refuse to believe that there will be mass deportations of EU citizens, the position remains that if there is no Agreement, then technically EU citizens lose all of their legal rights on 29th March.

Which neatly bring up the second major aspect. It is illegal (with the threat of huge financial penalty and imprisonment) for an employer to employ someone who does not have the right to work in the UK, or for a landlord to rent a property to someone who does not have the right to live in the UK. With no Agreement, on 29th March, all of the employers and landlords with EU nationals as employees or tenants could risk being charged with acting illegally. It will be for the employer or landlord o make the necessary checks - in effect, these people become an extension of the UK Border Force.

It would be understandable if these employers and landlords decided that the risk is too great and begin to give notices of termination to their employees and tenants. While EU citizens might not be directly deported, the result would be that they would be deported by default - with no automatic rights, or employers/landlords who are fearful to engage with EU citizens in case they get it wrong, thousands would be forced to leave the UK as they lose their jobs and homes. (This also applies to their loss of rights to healthcare and education and property ownership).

A third aspect of all this affects UK citizens. If EU and non-EU citizens will be required in future to provide proof of eligibility to live, work, rent etc in the UK, then UK citizens will also be required to provide this information. ID cards, or something similar, will be required. It will not be sufficient for someone to say 'I was born and educated in the UK, so give me the job/house/treatment etc.' They will be required to provide documentary proof. [The person who almost single-handedly shot down the Labour government's proposals for a system of ID cards was one David Davis. The name may be familiar].

@IHateMats what is the English test? When I looked into it it was never mentioned(or I completely missed it). Doesn't the life in the UK test prove you know sufficient English?

Rebelrogue
The English test is a proof of proficiency in the language - such a joke for those of us whose birth language is English

THe life in the UK test is about knowledge of the UK - and is something that most Brits would fail.
When I took it I had to ask for a substitute question as all of the options were demonstrably incorrect

Havana
Oh yes, the extended hostile environment

• employers
• landlords
• schools
• doctors

all supposed to do the dirty work of the Home Office for them.

Hmmm I have to reread the requirements and make sure I get that booked in as well then.

Life in the UK test was a joke,because I obviously couldn't possibly live here and fit in without knowing who won two olympic gold medals for sailing.

Does anyone know if this counts?

No idea !
My UK Accountancy qualifications (14 three hour exams written in English) were only grudgingly accepted.
And that was before I corrected the grammatical errors in one of their letters to me

@Ta1kinpeace that is petty. And I thought working in a school would be enough. Oh well , good thing I've read this thread as I completely missed this one.

Rebel
Its an utterly insane situation
ENTIRELY brought about by the xenophobic racism of Theresa May
who led the Home office from 2010 to 2016

I have to say though that after jumping through the hoops,
the citizenship ceremony itself was rather cool
realising what others had gone through to get there
(the Christian Pakistani family literally bursting with pride
or the Rwandan family whose dad had machete marks in his skull)
I felt very humbled

Its a shame so many British born do not value their country as much as immigrants do.

TM was a terrible Home Secretary and is totally out of her depth as P.M

@RebelRogue
I don't think your certificate counts unfortunately, they only accept
certificates from two awarding bodies: Trinity College and the IELTS SELT Consortium and the test certificate is only valid for two years.

assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/731794/Approved_Secure_English_Language_Tests_and_Test_Centres_-_website.pdf

The actual test is a doddle though.

The Life in the UK test doesn't 'prove' your knowledge of the English language either. I didn't enquire how the heck is anybody going to understand the questions if they don't speak English
The Life in the UK test is easy if you prepare for it, I've lived here a long time but I didn't know anything about the Scottish legal system and I'd never heard of Sake Dean Mahomed