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Brexit

Westminstenders: Break Up or Make Up?

999 replies

RedToothBrush · 28/02/2018 07:53

The next week or so appears to be yet another crunch point (not that any of these crunch points have actually resolved anything so far).

The EU is set to outline the plan for Ireland. Which everyone thought had already been outlined and agreed already. And it had been admitted was legally binding.

Except apparently we don't want to do that, and we are now crying about how the EU want to break up Britain (nothing to do with England wanting to leave the EU and Scotland and NI wanting to stay in it of course).

Jeremy Corbyn has now apparently decided that the customs union is a good idea. David Davis and Liam Fox have responded by saying that this would stop us making our own trade deals. Yes this has obviously stopped Turkey, and why aren't we doing as much trade with China etc as Germany anyway? A vote in the HoC looms before Easter. Will Tory rebels support.

Will Jeremy Corbyn bow to pressure over the single market too? The customs union alone does not stop the border issue in Ireland. Nor does it stop ridiculous queues at Dover. I'm not sure Corbyn is one for listening though. He's got a whiff of power and democracy and reality is just a hindrance to utopia.

As for the Great Repeal Bill. Word has it, its not going too clever in the HoL. The conservatives had something of a show of strength with an unusual number turning up for the debate. But few on the backbenches were willing to speak in favour of...

It all feels like we are making no progress at all. We are still bleating on about cherry picked deals as if this is a negotiation. Its not.

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BigChocFrenzy · 03/03/2018 00:28

Don’t cry for Theresa May. This Brexit crisis is her fault

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2018/mar/02/theresa-may-brexit-mess

Yes, her situation is impossible, but her repeated miscalculations made it inevitable

BigChocFrenzy · 03/03/2018 01:26

I didn't hear the Radio Scotland interview, but I have read that
Ruth Davidson was very equivocal yesterday (Friday) on Radio Scotland about whether she & Scotland's Tory MPs will support May

However, she was apparently jabbering away, as she does when under pressure; hence she may have been misunderstood

or she may have learnt from English Tory politicians to make several contradictory statements in the same interview and get away unscathed

borntobequiet · 03/03/2018 08:42

An amusing though depressing conversation on Today between JH (whom I normally turn off as he annoys me so much) and a German MEP. Basically JH was saying that now TM has accepted that we can't have everything we want and will have to compromise everything will be fine and we can get on with Brexit. German MEP patiently explaining that negotiation is always about compromise, EU had made many concessions to UK over the years and also over recent months and now the UK willingness to compromise would have to be backed up by actual compromise...JH spluttering and harrumphing.

AgnesSkinner · 03/03/2018 08:52

According to the Civil Aviation Authority there is a mechanism for third countries to be associate members of EASA, as long as all EU regulations with respect to safety are met - stated as the CAA preferred option here.

HesterThrale · 03/03/2018 08:59

Jo Maugham pointing out on twitter that 5 weeks ago David Davis said:

"We have come up... the idea of a comprehensive free trade agreement and a comprehensive customs union that will deliver the exact same benefits as we have."

And now TM says: "Our access to each others markets will be less than it is now."

How quickly the hopes and promises are crashing down and being exposed as fallacious.

mobile.twitter.com/JolyonMaugham/status/969833650958282753

woman11017 · 03/03/2018 09:06

Thank you for replies on pensions Swedish and BCF I had heard about people getting stuck with very low pensions pre brexit when they moves away, it's true.
Much depends on how they force through @127 in parliament.

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 03/03/2018 09:13

How likely do we think it is that Labour will vote against the government's deal, due to the argument set out by Maughum? I really hope they rise to the occasion - do you think emailing them (and who would be the most effective person to email if so) would help apply pressure?

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 03/03/2018 09:14

Project fear would bear fruit but it's either withered on the bushes or rotted in the lorries

Brexit: UK faces unprecedented food crisis if no trade deal secured with EU, says Sainsbury's boss

‘Closing the borders for a few days to free movement of food would result in food crisis the likes of which we haven’t seen,’ Mike Coupe says

www.independent.co.uk/news/business/news/brexit-food-crisis-uk-shortages-eu-trade-deal-sainsburys-mike-coupe-a8236296.html

prettybird · 03/03/2018 09:25

If you think about the chaos and empty shelves resulting from a few days of travel disruption because of the weather, imagine the chaos and panic buying if our food imports (given that we are a net importer) are delayed! ShockSad

.....and still the UK government is sticking its head in the sand delaying the decision to put in the investment and planning for the necessary infrastructure and staffing. Angry

prettybird · 03/03/2018 09:28

BigChocFrenzy - you got a pretty accurate impression of Ruth Davidson. Wink

She will say whatever she thinks will benefit her and hell mend the inconsistencies. As I described yesterday, sleekit. Angry

Motheroffourdragons · 03/03/2018 09:30

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ on behalf of the poster.

prettybird · 03/03/2018 09:37

From that Jo Maugham thread Grin

Richard milne
@milneorchid
What is "Full Alignment" with EU regulations? ... this cartoon should help.
#Brexit #StopBrexit^ #DavidDavis^ #Remain^ #Brexitshambles^ #EU^ #FBPE^

Westminstenders: Break Up or Make Up?
OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 03/03/2018 09:39

I know it's been flagged up on here for eons, but it's interesting it's being talked about in the media (though it may have been before and I just haven't seen it).

But of course, no doubt it'll be dismissed by the believers as Sainsbo's just not being positive enough and talking down their capabilities.

prettybird · 03/03/2018 09:54

You're right Paininthear - it's good to see it now being covered in MSM. Shame it's taken them so long Hmm

But there again, the Brexit Brigade will just dismiss it as nasty fearmongering from that nasty fearmongering Remain Rag.

I was adding in the observation about the food supply difficulties over the last few days as evidence of how quickly chaos could happen not that the Brexit Brigade would believe it Sad

Motheroffourdragons · 03/03/2018 10:00

This reply has been withdrawn

This has been withdrawn by MNHQ on behalf of the poster.

woman11017 · 03/03/2018 10:07

Johnson summoned to account for loss of over £40m of public funds.

For plans. Confused

www.theguardian.com/politics/2018/mar/01/boris-johnson-defends-garden-bridge-plan-that-will-cost-public-46m

Boris Johnson has said that he cannot recall why he signed a key directive as London mayor that contributed to the loss of more than £40m of public money on the city’s garden bridge. Facing increasing pressure over the abandoned project, Johnson, appearing before London Assembly members, answered detailed questions on the scheme for the first time on Thursday

Johnson has attacked the journalist who has investigated this.
Didn't that happen before?

Earlier, Johnson launched a vehement attack on Will Hurst, a journalist with the Architects’ Journal, who won a British Journalism Award in December for a series of stories uncovering problems with the project, including the flawed process which awarded the design contrast to Thomas Heatherwick, creator of the London Olympic cauldron

There are some interesting thoughts on the cancellation of Leveson 2 and how it is linked to the aforementioned, around today too.

Cailleach1 · 03/03/2018 10:09

Agnes, I hope it would be so. If only for avoiding potential disruption. I would wonder about that document. From the British regulator, but it sounds more hopeful than sure. Not an EU Commission or EASA source. They say how the UK would be 'in full communion', so to speak on Brexit. Their options will be dictated by the British gov't. Gov't red lines might rule possibilities out. From day one of Brexit, whose auspices are they under? UK not remaining in EU/EEA/EFTA.

^UK preference would be to adjust EASA participation to
associate membership as part of the withdrawal negotiations.^

The only associate members are the EEA and/or EFTA. Iceland, Norway, Lichtenstein and Switzerland. Along with the EU on the management board. Nobody else. UK's red lines rule out these.

^ There is an established process for participation of third
countries in EASA (Article 66, Regulation 216/2008) on
condition that the country concerned applies EU regulation in
the field of aviation safety.^

The participation seems the option. But it is not associate membership. No place on management board. Not even observer status like pre accession countries.

But would the British side want it anyway (aside from the regulator). The ultras can act very strangely at the mention of EU anything. A voter mightn't know it, but some telepathic Brexiteer might inform everyone that the UK voted against EASA in any shape or form as it has something to do with the EU.

OnTheDarkSideOfTheSpoon · 03/03/2018 10:17

No worries mother, I didn’t take it as criticism!

Johnson is sounding awfully like Jeff Sessions with his “I do not recall”, although I suppose it’s bound to be the response of those in power being confronted with their wrongdoings.

Interestingly, Renew Britain have won their first council seat in Wandsworth council, with someone who defected from the tories.

www.pressreader.com/uk/london-evening-standard-west-end-final-a/20180302/281612420900331

Westminstenders: Break Up or Make Up?
Cailleach1 · 03/03/2018 10:18

Will the UK be happy in any shape or form to 'apply EU regulation in the field of aviation safety'.

I wonder if someone is ensuring that the bilateral agreements/technical cooperation and memoranda of understanding are still in force or replaced for the UK after Brexit?

I hope some really competent people are running the country.

Cailleach1 · 03/03/2018 10:25

Johnson is a nasty effer. Especially cornered. He will brazen it out. Andrew Tyrie was very good is cutting through his bullshit. I miss Andrew Tyrie.

I saw him aggressively say that the night on 40million he pissed away on his vanity project was really squandered by his successor. I do not understand the chuckles that man gets.

AgnesSkinner · 03/03/2018 10:27

cailleach the CAA apparently aren’t preparing for being out of EASA because it isn’t a viable option, according to this Reuters report:

uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-aviation/eu-could-dash-hopes-for-uk-to-remain-in-aviation-safety-agency-idUKKBN1FE2T6

If we don’t stay in EASA, then it’s going to be really grim.

woman11017 · 03/03/2018 10:28

Good news on Wandsworth pain. I wish we had a Mueller or gov which operated within the rule of law.
I hope some really competent people are running the country. Amen.
I do not understand the chuckles that man gets. cough Leveson 2

AgnesSkinner · 03/03/2018 10:30

TBH, I have no idea why the UK isn’t going down the EEA/EFTA route at this stage - all we’re trying to do is replicate it under a different name.

woman11017 · 03/03/2018 10:33

Need a mn emoji for 'cough' Leveson 2's cancellation, praised in guardian today (Shock) came at just the right time. Hmm

BigChocFrenzy · 03/03/2018 10:45

There were no consequences for Arlene after spunking £400 million in Cash for Ash Angry
No wonder Boris is so casual about a mere £40 million bridge

This is one of the many perks when your party or their puppets are in office
No wonder the govt clings so desperately to power
A lot of things to sweep under the carpet before they are booted out