Westministenders: The Art of the Deal

[RedToothBrush]

Well Trump seems to have put his foot in it.

Not that this should come as a surprise. For all the talk of closer ties with the US that was never going to happen. All that was need was for Trump to over step once too many.

By chance (?) Barnier also raised questions about our commitment to working with the EU on security.

Its almost as if we are being asked to choose whom we look to for security.

Meanwhile it sounds like the divorce bill is sorted - though this may not be as settled as that, if it comes with conditions. The deal might also be backtracked on, seeing as that appears to be the done thing presently.

Talks on Ireland are stalemated with Ireland threating to veto. No sign of a breakthrough here yet.

Talks on EU citz rights are reportedly going backwards (again) rather than going forward.

All of this is theatre for a British audience though, with the UK agreeing to everything. Because they gave again their cards when a50 was triggered.

The crunch is coming on whether we move to stage two before Christmas. We have no time to lose.

Does the Government think the British voting public are stupid ?

Answers on the back of a fag packet !

John Stalker was royally stitched up. I'm led to believe that he's a very decent bloke.

Why was he stitched up, by whom and for what reason?

For ideological purposes and to protect guilty individuals by people in government for daring to try and expose the truth.

Oddly familiar.

MynewnameisKy it's been done before Yes
And internment without trial and internment in deportation camps without trial now?

Peter Geoghegan
@PeterKGeoghegan
Minister Chris Grayling on #r4today basically saying gov haven’t assessed impact of #brexit because wouldn’t like what would find. Incredible I/view.

Does the Government think the British voting public are stupid?

Yes, absolutely. And also that a significant proportion can be swayed into anything by pandering to their xenophobia.

The thing is, it’s not because it has been done befire that it’s right.
I find that extremely shocking.

Same feeling about internment wo a trial etc... btw.

And the fact that no one is finding it an issue, so much somthat a member of the government can say that and it’s just reported by newspapers. No questioning about whether it’s an ok thing to do or not.

In my view, the U.K. is now a country who has no respect at all for human rights. It didn’t feel Ike this 20 years ago when I first came.
Maybe I was just very naive then.

Brexit will require deletion of references to the EU from the Good Friday Agreement, Northern Ireland’s peace deal.

But.....this is an international treaty, Theresa May or even the Tories in Parliament won't just be able to decree that this will be done - all parties (i.e. those furriners) will have to agree.

Re Impact Assessments - I think I suggested a few threads back that a few blank sheets from a new packet of A4 would suffice. It seems I was more right than I thought.

Does the Government think the British voting public are stupid?

Or they just don’t care about the British population at all, bar around election time.
The population has no right to say anything anymore (See for example the way the Police is reacting to people manifesting against fracking in Yorkshire for example)

Did anyone hear Bernard Jenkin on the Today Programme? Yep, it's all the nasty EU's fault for not letting us have cake and unicorns. Why oh why did I not turn on music instead? To be fair the interviewer made a weak attempt at challenging him but she was pretty feeble.

Gavin Williamson has said 'a dead terrorist can’t cause any harm to Britain

Neither can a dead Tory, but oddly they wouldn't like that call would they? Scum

In my view, the U.K. is now a country who has no respect at all for human rights.

I don't think it ever did, really. When you start to look back, you realise how appalling things were anyway ... from "terrorists" being handed over for torture, through to the miscarriages of justice (now with no compensation) of the Birmingham/Guildford innocents, through the abuses of the 1970s and 1960s in Northern Ireland, through the appalling treatment meted out to British colonials - documented in Kenya and India but doubtless prevalent everywhere ...

It was as recently as 1980 when Lord Denning effectively said that courts weren't allowed to find the police guilty in civil court.

www.irishtimes.com/news/appalling-vista-observation-stuck-1.160004

So, some of the remaining constitutional players/ strategies include:

The lords;
www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/dec/07/no-deal-brexit-would-be-worst-outcome-possible-for-uk-lords-warn?utm_term=Autofeed&CMP=twt_b-gdnnews#link_time=1512627451

The @50 challenge that pain posted earlier:

www.crowdjustice.com/case/a50-chall-her-e50/

Bercow, has also asked MPs to write to him re DD's lies.
Umunna's letter is public. It could be yet another thing to write to MPs about?

11.12.17 rally at HOC and Brussels.

Any more?

This is an interesting blog post.
www.norgroveblog.co.uk/2017/12/hard-brexit-has-reached-dead-end.html
(we can always hope).

Minister Chris Grayling on #r4today

had this tiresome tone of voice that suggested "whatever we say, goes".

He kept on talking about "ready to move on to trade talks" as if that's all it took. Which will fool the Brexiteers (which isn't really much of an achievement) but not the EU.

LauraK said, following that, that Theresa May was looking to "add some text" to whatever the EU and Ireland had agreed, to "provide clarification".

Not being an international negotiator, like David Davies it's probably just me. But can anyone think of an addendum which would manage to salvage what was agreed ?

This probably won't come to anything but the Lib Dems are calling for Davis' resignation:

www.libdems.org.uk/resign?utm_campaign=dd_the_liar_2&utm_medium=email&utm_source=libdems

THere's also challenging article 7 (though I think apart from writing to your MP there's not much else to be done)

bestforbritain.org/lucky7

[Incidentally, this was Raab's response to my letter if anyone is interested:

Thank you for contacting me about Parliamentary approval of the final terms for leaving the EU.

The government has recently announced that a new Bill will be introduced to implement the Withdrawal Agreement so that the deal that the UK reaches with the EU can be put directly into UK domestic law – and properly voted on by Parliament. That is why amendment 7 was rendered unnecessary.

This means that Members of Parliament in the House of Commons and Members of the House of Lords will be able to debate, scrutinise and vote on the final agreement made with the EU. The commitment provided to both Houses of Parliament that they will have a meaningful vote on the final deal will not be affected. This will take place as soon as the deal agreed and before the European Parliament votes on it. There can be no doubt that Parliament will have a full opportunity to have its proper say on the final agreement.

This Bill is also important for the Committee Stage of the EU (Withdrawal) Bill. This is currently being scrutinised by the House of Commons. Powers in EU (Withdrawal) Bill will, if necessary, be used to make more technical changes that are appropriate for secondary legislation. The exact details of the UK's withdrawal arrangements are still subject to negotiation with the EU, which is why it is important to press ahead with the EU (Withdrawal) Bill and ensure that the UK's exit is delivered in a smooth and orderly way.

The government has listened and will continue to listen to suggestions from Members of Parliament to improve the legislation relating to the UK's exit from the EU. MP’s on all sides should work together to ensure that the UK can pursue a smooth and stable exit from the EU. This is in everyone's interest.

Thank you again for taking the time to contact me on this important issue.

Yours sincerely,

Dominic. ]

Protest to attend in London:

Nick Reeves - #FBPE‏
@nickreeves9876
December 11 is the day when Parliament debates the #FinalSay referendum petition. If you can, please join the protest from 10am onwards outside Parliament. I think it's fine if you turn up as late as 4pm. whatson.london/event/protest-final-say-referendum-debate/

And that's all I can think of at the moment

Gina Miller‏
@thatginamiller
Fears May’s govt could collapse as early as next week without a Brexit deal. @TelegraphNews says Johnson, Davis & Gove ready to act in case of coup agst May. 2 Putin puppets & 1 liar. I feel sick to the pit of my stomach & mourn for the future of the UK.

Jean-Claude Juncker 'fears Theresa May's Government will collapse next week without Brexit deal'

www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/12/06/jean-claude-juncker-fears-theresa-mays-government-will-collapse/

The Guardian
@guardian

Electoral Commission launches investigation into whether Momentum broke election spending rules -www.theguardian.com/politics/blog/live/2017/dec/07/brexit-deal-may-varadkar-eu-less-hospitable-for-foreign-talent-after-brexit-says-banking-chief-politics-live?CMP=twt_gu

Electoral Commission launches investigation into whether Momentum broke election spending rules

The Electoral Commission has announced it has launched an investigation into whether Momentum, the pro-Corbyn Labour organisation, broke election spending rules in the general election.

In a press statement the commission said:

The investigation will look at:

whether or not Momentum spent in excess of the spending limits for an unauthorised non-party campaigner in the UK parliamentary general election;

whether or not Momentum submitted a return that did not include accurate donation information and/or the required declaration stating that the donation return was complete and accurate;

whether or not Momentum submitted a return that was not a complete statement of payments made in respect of controlled expenditure;

whether or not Momentum submitted a return that did not include all invoices for payments of more than £200.

It is possible that during the course of the investigation, the commission will identify potential contraventions and/or offences under PPERA other than those set out above.

And Bob Posner, the commission’s director of political finance and regulation and legal counsel, said:

Momentum are a high profile active campaigning body. Questions over their compliance with the campaign finance rules at June’s general election risks causing harm to voters’ confidence in elections. There is significant public interest in us investigating Momentum to establish the facts in this matter and whether there have been any offences.

“Once complete, the commission will decide whether any breaches have occurred and, if so, what further action may be appropriate, in line with its enforcement policy.

Looks like the BBC is slipping more bad news under the radar ...

Bad news for UK wool

www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-42229842

Another Brexiteer fantasy unravelling. Literally.

Thanks pain and emily

On EU citizens’ rights, Reuters has this on the European Parliament’s proposals - uk.reuters.com/article/uk-britain-eu-parliament-exclusive/exclusive-eu-parliament-details-uk-concessions-on-rights-idUKKBN1E1001

Suggests that would have gone through if the DUP hadn’t stopped the deal.

British Prime Minister Theresa May has secured agreement from Brussels that British citizens in the EU will be able to live freely in any member state after Brexit.

Also a compromise on ECJ time limit, perhaps 2 years + 8 years

These included that “core family members and persons in a durable relationship currently residing outside (Britain) shall be protected by the Withdrawal Agreement and that this is also the case for children born in the future and outside (Britain)”.

London[i.e. the government], which does not grant its own citizens automatic rights to bring in foreign spouses, had sought to apply that to EU citizens after Brexit and also wanted to deny rights to British residence to any children born abroad after Brexit.

“Citizens’ rights will be guaranteed through a declaratory, light touch, proportionate procedure, consisting of a single form per family,” the resolution stated -- going some way to addressing lawmakers’ complaints that costs of hundreds of euros could be incurred by families making several declarations.

Thanks for the link to the petition, PainInTheEar, I have signed. Just think 54 years ago Profumo lied to the House, did the honourable thing, and resigned and spent his time doing voluntary work in the East End - which he could afford to do as a wealthy man.

Now it seems, if they are caught in one lie, the response is to tell another one to cover it up.

I was pleased to see Ed Vaizey, who represents the adjacent constituency to me, sign the letter to the PM. I am glad to see him begin to put some actions to his words. His Count at the GE was held in the same hall as our own, so I heard his acceptance speech, where he clearly said that the result showed that the public were fed up with Austerity and had rejected a Hard Brexit. Then he had the good sense to shut up, because we had all been up all night and didn't want to hear him rabbit on.

The Electoral Commission has announced it has launched an investigation into whether Momentum, the pro-Corbyn Labour organisation, broke election spending rules in the general election.

I don't have a problem with this. As an activist for another party, I feel we have to be squeaky clean as far as finances are concerned. So if Momentum have broken the rules, then they need to be caught out. Same with the Tories fiddling the 2015 election, with their 50 or so MPs under investigation. I suspect the Tories were doing this for a few earlier elections, but because they didn't get caught then got more brazen.

Bad news ? We got it.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-42257277

The UK's ability to attract talent is already suffering, following the vote to leave the EU, according to the boss of the UK's fifth-largest bank.

(contd).

Some good news I thought was May standing up to Trump at long last and say that we weren't going to move our Embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem. I had thought she would rush right in behind him. Maybe his tweets last week were the straw which broke the camel's back?

I am so not surprised by an investigation into Momentum. They have freely pushing the idea of being Trumpian and pushing boundaries where they can like UKIP/Leave. Is it surprising in that context to think there might be dodgy dealings with finances.

As far as I am concerned scrutiny is a good thing. The problem is the limitations of the Electoral Commission might allow it to happen more not less, if there is something going on, but the EC can't do much about it or prove it completely.