Westminstenders: Boom. The Brexit Backlash starts to hit.

[RedToothBrush]

So it turns out that immigration figures that stated students overstayed were wrong. The home office knew this. And sat on it. Since 2015. Under Theresa.

That smells a bit doesn't it?

Imagine it: "Let's do lunch Paul. I'll cover up and give you a nice immigration story for your front page. In return, crown me PM."

Then tonight BOOM. Labour look like they have made a move. Soft very swishy Brexit. Even less brexity than the Beano Brexit that the Tories have been trying to announce on the quiet over the summer whilst Brexiteers are on holiday.

amp.theguardian.com/global/2017/aug/26/labour-calls-for-lengthy-transitional-period-post-brexit
Labour makes dramatic shift on Brexit and single market
Party opens clear divide with Tories, with support for free movement and paying into EU budgets for up to four years

Labour is to announce a dramatic policy shift by backing continued membership of the EU single market beyond March 2019, when Britain leaves the EU, establishing a clear dividing line with the Tories on Brexit for the first time.

In a move that positions it decisively as the party of “soft Brexit”, Labour will support full participation in the single market and customs union during a lengthy “transitional period” that it believes could last between two and four years after the day of departure, it is to announce on Sunday.

This will mean that under a Labour government the UK would continue to abide by the EU’s free movement rules, accept the jurisdiction of the European court of justice on trade and economic issues, and pay into the EU budget for a period of years after Brexit, in the hope of lessening the shock of leaving to the UK economy. In a further move that will delight many pro-EU Labour backers, Jeremy Corbyn’s party will also leave open the option of the UK remaining a member of the customs union and single market for good, beyond the end of the transitional period.

Why would Labour suddenly do this? It's not just because of the youth vote. What about their leave voters?

Faisal Islam on the subject:
2. On Labour Leavers is very very interesting and involves quite the psephological judgement re the election....
...the calculation appears to be that Labour Leave voters had the chance to vote for Theresa May's brand of Brexit, and bar 5 seats, said No
Was that because Lableave voters were already signalled "hard Brexit"? Or many millions such voters much more concerned about other things?

Have Labour been polling their voters on this?

Theresa has also apparently set her sell by date: Friday 30th August 2019.

www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/theresa-sets-date-shell-quit-11061894.amp
Theresa May sets date she'll quit as Prime Minister - giving herself time to see Britain through Brexit

The longer the transition and the squishier it gets, the more the more you wonder.

Mr Barnier will enjoy his coffee and newspapers tomorrow as he prepares for round two of Brexit talks starting next week.

The question on his mind most: Will David Davis remember to bring his notes this time?

I'm not sure you can reason with someone who randomly posts capitalised album titles on the Internet...

I love the way DD is calling for "flexibility and imagination" from the EU....... as if it were the EU's responsibility to work out how to invent everlasting cake and find the unicorns

Ah yes, but it's the same with we Remainers - it's our job to sort out Brexit. The Leavers are bored with it.

I love the way DD is calling for "flexibility and imagination" from the EU
Now, now, Mr Barnier. How about you just imagine we've paid our exit bill already? Oh look, a unicorn.

I'm not sure you can reason with someone who randomly posts capitalised album titles on the Internet...

This is true. Though Damon Albarn is a vocal remainer, so maybe a Blur album can act as a gateway to reasonableness.

Gosh, somecatch, that was rather beautiful
Aww fanks mate. Safe! Innit??

We can already deport EU migrants who are not working.
But we didn't. We don't. Logistically / practically speaking, we can't. Yes we can lay the "blame" for this state of affairs at the feet of Blair but it doesn't help now (or help the cause of the Labour party in post industrial towns right across the Midlands and North, nor in the former LibDem strongholds of the South West.)

Why don't we do this rather than leave the EU?
Well Article 50 has been triggered. Its irrevocable.

catch the concept of FOM was established in 1992 under the Treaty of Maastricht. Tony Blair was not in power then, John Major was. It wasn't implemented straight away, there was time to plan and prepare. The Tories failed to do so. Labour continued to fail to do so. Ditto the Coalition after 2010. This is not down to one side of the political spectrum.

Nobody knows whether or not Article 50 is irrevocable, btw. It might be, it might not be.

Let's not waste energy trying to engage with the illogical.

Article 50 is not irrevocable

But we didn't.
Not a reason to get rid of fom then.

We don't.
Not a reason to get rid of fom either.

Logistically / practically speaking, we can't.
Actually we can - there are already eu citizens receiving notification from the home office.

Yes we can lay the "blame" for this state of affairs at the feet of Blair but it doesn't help now
But burning down the house in order to kill the spider is more helpful? Or alternatively government could have been encouraged to exercise their treaty rights.

But we didn't. We don't. Logistically / practically speaking, we can't.
We can. It would take time and cost some money to set up, but certainly less than brexit will.

Well Article 50 has been triggered. Its irrevocable.
Oh, so we are at the "just because we can't!" stage of the discussion. As pointy had said I don't think that this is really the case. It would require some awkward conversations, but there is nothing that says clearly it is irrevocable.

pointythings

I'm not sure you can reason with someone who randomly posts capitalised album titles on the Internet

Pointythings, it was what the yoof call a "meme"..Russell Brand sounds just like the pompous windbag trying to make his inanities sound profound on the Parklife song. So all the youngsters shout PARKLIFE! at Russell Brand whenever he eventually comes to the end of one his wonderfully convoluted sentences.... Shut im right up it did! Ee pretends ee don't mind. But ee fackin ates it, the cunt!

Let's not waste energy trying to engage with the illogical.

You are right pretty. There are better ways to spend our time, but it is sort of fun.

True pretty but it's always fun to watch someone tie themselves in knots trying to argue something when they don't even understand what they're arguing against

If we stay in the EU, we have to accept that any EU citizen from any EU country has the right to live here

Sorry, I call big fat hairy bollocks with knobs on top.

That is not true.

And has (never been.

So, what's your next consignment of shit going to be about ?

True

It is indeed quite funny to see someone thinking they've made an irrefutable point, arguing one thing and actually proving the opposite.

So, what's your next consignment of shit going to be about ?
They haven't been given the next sheet yet

Pointythings, it was what the yoof call a "meme"..

Oh, those young people and their interweb japes. I'm sure it will never catch on you know...

bigly I have two teenagers so I get lots of 'yoof' memes in my life. So do they. They tend not to use them when they are trying to have any form of intelligent debate, however, Because they are, you know, intelligent.

The UK can't even manage to reduce non-EU immigration (was about equal numbers to EU immigration)

• this won't change after Brexit, even though Leave Uk was promising voters of Middle East, Asian & AfroCaribbean origin that they could bring in their relatives more easily afterwards

(another example of the Brexit campaign promising conflicting things to different groups)

The Uk already has the means to remove EU citizens who are not self-supporting after 6 months
(might even be 3 months iirc from Belgium ?)

Why is the Uk so incompetent that it cannot manage what Germany, France, Belgium etc all manage ?

Doesn't bode well for Brexit, which DD says is as complicated as a moon landing

• his method appears to strap a rocket to the UK's arse, light up and stand well back with fingers crossed ....

- his method appears to strap a rocket to the UK's arse, light up and stand well back with fingers crossed ....

His method appears to be to strap a rocket to his own arse, light it up and step backwards without realising the consequence of what he has done

Or threaten to light up his own arse if Barnier doesn't give in.

I feel DD's negotiating tactics are an interesting mating of Baldrick with Inspector Clouseau
< passes brain bleach around the thread >

Thanks for the thread red . It has been an engaging scroll down Brexshit Lane.

ALL THE PEOPLE, SO MANY PEOPLE - is that your problem with FoM thats?

We could have made those EU citizens without work leave after 3 months but we chose not to. Successive governments chose not to. So, instead of removing a few thousand EU people (so many people) from our shores, we have chosen to remove 65 million people from the EU.

PARKLIFE!

The initial right to reside is 3 months. You don't have to be a qualified person until then. However, as a jobseeker you can potentially have 6 months. But this requires a person to be actually seeking work, to be registered with the relevant body (Jobcentre in UK case) and to have a genuine chance of engagement. If they're not all of those things or a qualified person in some other way, they can be removed after 3. Because in actual fact it only starts being difficult to kick out an EEA national when they're a qualified person. Not removing EEA nationals who aren't qualified persons is a choice the UK has made.

Willingly accepts mind bleach. All the visions

leche