Is anyone else getting quite tired of being called a racist?

[Peppatina]

I know it can't just be me.

It doesn't matter what carefully thought out reasons a brexiter has for wanting to leave (I've seen some very articulate and reasoned ones on mn itself) we are still all getting lumped into a stereotypical group of closet racist idiots.

And Lord forbid any of those reasons might just involve any concern over levels of eu migration!

I've been told that I'm essentially imagining the three week waiting list for my GP or that this is nothing to do with eu migration. If I say I know it is because of the names being called out I become the equivalent of Enoch Powell.

The same goes for a certain local estate very much being a no go area, especially for young girls. After braving this street once with my children and being spat on and shouted at by a group of very hostile Romanian men/boys I've been told I imagined it.

When I had my son a few week ago my I was the only English speaking person in my ward. A polish man was shouting and being very aggressive to staff as they were struggling to find an interpreter.

I absolutely know that not every migrant is aggressive and that they should build more schools and go surgeries but I believe I'm right to be concerned about a high number of migrants who are not intergrating with their local community and the unsustainable strain on services.

I'm sick of being told that my experiences don't matter. That to even mention that this is what life is like in our town means I am a racist or little englander.

That's not being racist. It's an observation. I am white, I am therefore allowed to comment on white thuggery when I see it. I live in a non-white street where nearly everyone is friendly. If I go into town on a Friday night I see lots of white men shouting, throwing up and acting like 5 year olds. I'm sure people of all colours do this, but there seems to be a lot less of them where I live.

David Cameron has stated and this is fact people coming to this country have to live here for 4 years and working before they get any benefits. The government is making changes. People's emotions are taking over and people are pissed off. This is a massive decision that will affect us all. If you think voting leave will control immigration you are kidding you're selfs. We need people to come to this country.

We have ageing population. My Grandmother had 3 carers look after they were African women. She suffered with dementia and was walking around at night and the last few months of her life she suffered with stomach cancer. They made my Grandmother very comfortable and on the day of her funeral they sang in the church. If we didn't have people coming into the country would my Grandmother receive good care. As it is they are crying out for carers to help look after the elderly.

Another important fact investors are taking their money out of the country out of fear that we will leave.

That's not being racist. It's an observation Ho hum.

Gordon Brown said it the Government should be putting money into areas where there is an over flow of people living in the area. Aim you're emotions at the government not immigrants its not their fault. Fact there are more people coming from outside the EU than in the EU. What difference does it make.

Why did Labour not get in in 2010?

Why did Labour not get in in 2010?

Because of Gordon Brown calling Gillian Duffy a "bigoted woman" for voicing her concerns over unlimited EU migration.

Limer not a very good thing to say when trying to win the public over. What David Cameron has secured is a massive game changer it might make people think twice before planning a big move to Britain.

Sunshine , your point re grandma merely proves the appalling situation we've got into with depressed basic wages. Check your local paper, you will be on minimum wage looking after the elderly with dementia. You see lovely African ladies doing a priceless difficult job in your grandmas last years, I see an utter abuse of a section of society who have no choices but to accept minimum wage whilst all profits go into the care home owners pocket.

Vote to maintain an open access migrant workforce if you will, but don't dress it up as anything other than a means to keep basic wages low ensuring maximum profit in the private sector.

Add to that the dramatic rise in slum landlords due to the ridiculous cost of private rental due to lack of available housing, and you start to understand why the European freedom to work policy has failed.

It's been a race to the bottom and in an era where we supposedly have more human rights you can shake a stick at, we have more employment law protecting employees rights than ever before in our country's history, yet we see the rise of the Sports Direct workhouse and ever increasing zero hours contracts. We see a rise in slum landlords overcrowding poor accommodation. And it's all down to one very simple factor, oversupply of a cheap workforce.

Don't dress up the remain campaign as a means to fill desperately required roles that we don't have the resources to fill. It's main aim is to fill desperately required roles on minimum wage. That's abuse, irrespective of anyone's race.

Pay care workers a decent basic wage for the fabulous job they do, let's say £25kpa for arguments sake, and I'll guarantee 'benefits Britain' will be queuing up to apply, but until you plug the constant stream of 'prepared to work for anything' migrant, the Sports Direct workhouse will become a far more common business model. (If it isn't already?).

I love how people refuse or can't be bothered to see that many of their issues with immigration are down to government policies,not down to the eu. Non eu immigration is higher than eu immigration. A certain government encouraged that! They made it easy for people to come here because that's what they wanted! Again through the years and various governments it was easier or harder to come here and get rights,even from the eu. The ones that came during labour,got whatever they wanted. When i came i couldn't even get a national insurance number even though i was working.
And as for cheap labour....why no one bothered shutting down all the agencies with "we'll find you jobs without papers" ? Do you have any idea how many operate in London? Tens of thousands!! And workers go wherever they get send for 2 £ an hour for a 10 h day and the agency takes the difference. But no one gives a fuck.

No one can tell me how it's my fault and the EU's that the town's secondary schools are oversubscribed when the government shut down all the secondary schools in 3 surrounding villages.

So many issues here absolutely, one being toothless government policies (that is, there are already policies in place that should address some of these issues ie the recharging of healthcare to the 'visitors' home nation ) but rather than derail, I'll try to answer as the OP has asked.
Kate, yes I would like a points based skills linked system. What that means is yes, the French would be treated the same as a Nigerian or Chinese. Are you saying the French will have some sort of racist issue if that becomes the case? Surely any other suggestion of some tiered acceptance criteria based on which country you were coming from, is utterly racist in the extreme?! ALL immigration should be subject to the same controls and criteria, any suggestion otherwise is quite simply, racist.
Yes I would like to see a direct link to a specific job, that means that instead of this preoccupation with what ethnic background and suggestions of quotas your filling, (just how racist is that?) your filling a workforce requirement. Anyone setting targets like the BBC to fill a % of jobs with a certain ethnicity, is absolutely racist.

Skills, skills, skills. That's it. (And of course dependants are welcome, in return for the skill set required of course we should be saying thank you, providing all the support a home 'born' receives.

Sadly, because of the open door policy we now have, it's those very migrants who suffer the worst from lack of housing, access to health , education. That surely is indirect racism by those allowing it to happen? If you enforce a skills based entry system, any economic migrant will be guaranteed to be paid a very competitive wage, affording them the ability to live at the decent standard we should be offering.

I'm voting leave, not because I'm racist, but because I'm the opposite. No one should be abusing the less fortunate and needy, yet that is exactly what current EU membership in reality means (re immigration and this thread).

What that means is yes, the French would be treated the same as a Nigerian or Chinese. Are you saying the French will have some sort of racist issue if that becomes the case?

No they would not, but what do you expect the consequence of this policy to be for the 400,000 Brits who live in France, or the 1.2 million Brits who live in the EU (conservative estimate)?

If we leave there will be an emergency budget of more cuts and tax rises. That is what George Osbourne said on itv news programme this morning and that is what I woke up to. How depressing I understand there is an issue and I do think the Government is making changes. I do wonder how much we are giving up we wont be able to make decisions in the EU that could affect us. We may still have to allow free movement if we wish to trade with them.

Chris1234567890 If you enforce a skills based entry system, any economic migrant will be guaranteed to be paid a very competitive wage, affording them the ability to live at the decent standard we should be offering. I'm voting leave, not because I'm racist, but because I'm the opposite.

This all sound well and good if there were a cross party group working for leave but there isn't. They are right wing free market, "sanctioning is awesome" IDS, "cutting employment" red tape, priti patel types at the bargaining table. The latter has said our business aren't profitable enough because we have too many rights.

These are the people cutting the deal.......

These are the people cutting the deal...
Yeah, the people who refuse to release information on rape at Yarls' Wood immigration centre because it is 'detrimental to a private companies' interests'.

People don't matter to neoliberalists.

www.telegraph.co.uk/women/politics/home-office-refuses-to-reveal-if-women-in-yarls-wood-immigration/ - forgot to add link.

Why did Labour not get in in 2010?

Because of Gordon Brown calling Gillian Duffy a "bigoted woman" for voicing her concerns over unlimited EU migration.

No its got fuck all to do with Gillian Duffy. Working class voters didn't flee Labour until 2015.

Middle class swing voters were the ones who abandoned the Labour party in 2010. That was down to the failure of foreseeing the 2008 crash and a general dislike of Brown's dour miserable personality (in complete contrast to smiley Dave and Nick). As well as the increasing disillusionment following the realisation of the Dodgy Dossier on Iraq.

The constituencies that changed hands were not working class ones in 2010. Labour remained strong in its heartlands. This was still more or less true in 2015 too. It was the loss of Scotland in 2015 that was catastrophic for Labour. They did loose a lot of their share of the vote in their heartlands in 2015 because of the UKIP effect, but its not why they lost the election.

Labour only won 1997, 2001 and 2005 because they attracted middle class votes and dominated Scottish politics.

The Gillian Duffy thing, represents something that was simmering below the surface but has not changed the actually winner of an election. (Yet) It didn't even change the result in Gillian Duffy's constituency. Its still Labour.

Tying a visa to a specific employer will do fuck all to combat exploitation and undercutting of wages, but the opposite - it makes it harder for exploited migrant workers to report the crime that is committed against them for fear of deportation. If you tie visa to a specific contract of employment you aid slavery.

www.theguardian.com/global-development/2016/may/28/slavery-human-trafficking-hotel-workers-bangladesh-scotland

The poor people will continue to be present in deprived areas, but they will have British accents not Lithuanian ones perhaps. Would that make you happier?

I am baffled.

yes it would make me happier yes! The poor of the Uk come first. why do we need the poor of the EU to come here? how does it benefit the poor already here?

Its bizzaree.

Frank Field, Vote Leave for the Poor.

www.frankfield.co.uk/latest-news/articles/news.aspx?p=1021270

It is the poorest in our communities, those whose choices in life are already by far the most restricted, whose standard of living is most adversely affected by the arrival of a record number of newcomers.

There is a school of belief which quite naturally draws upon compassion to justify the opportunities given to millions of people from the EU to start a new life here. But compassion demands that we consider as a priority the impact that so many new arrivals has on our poorest citizens’ chances of securing the ever scarcer necessities in life — a place at a decent school for their children, a home that they can afford to rent or buy, and swift access to healthcare.

Definitely. Why would you want to import more poverty.

Some politicians are so out of touch.

I don't hear how leaving would make things any better it could make our situation worse.

• I haven't heard how etc etc.

OP nothing you've said there is racist. Part of the problem the Remain campaign have is that they won't have an honest conversation about the impact of immigration from the open borders of the EU. Now people from their own experiences- exactly like you have done here- are coming to their own logical conclusions. It's not enough to be told "the NHS is failing because of austerity cuts not the 200,000 EU immigrants coming to live in the UK every year! They have nothing but a POSITIVE impact..."

People aren't stupid. The argument isn't black and white. But you can't argue with the fact public services cost more to run when they are catering for more people and we have far too many people using our public services.

When you are part of a union when you are lucky enough to have the highest standard of living then OF COURSE migrants from countries which have a much lower standard of living will flock to us and you can't blame them. However we can't keep up with housing demand, school places and NHS care for them.

It's a shame the "open door policy" can't be reviewed in isolation as it certainly needs addressing. Where I live I can't get a GP appointment for 3 weeks and communities are divided and feel hostile. I'm not ashamed and I'm not racist but I am voting to leave as I wholeheartedly believe it is the best for the future of this country to be able to exercise control over its own borders.