35 yr old healthy female dead from cancer in 12 weeks

[dreamofaVWcamper]

Just had news 35 year old friend of friend dead from cancer diagnosis within 12 weeks

Terribly business, children involved. Husbands bereft,

Upon hearing the terrible news I placated with the usual "so young, so soon, the poor fella, family and kids...."

I loosely said "makes you wonder if covid wasn't around if she could've been seen, treated or advised quicker"
(Given that there are millions of delayed treatments now, kidney transplants, mastectomy's, hip replacements etc)
Friend absolutely lost their shit at me saying "oh it's all about covid with you ain't it, you don't know shit, an expert on cancer now are you?"
I replied no of course not, but a healthy woman to die within 11-12 weeks of diagnosis is awful, I wonder if it had a part to play.....
Then a barrage of abuse and "youre jealous cos it's something that ain't all about you" this smarts, pretty appalling thing to say.....for daring to have an opinion/thought process on the situation,
What I though was my friend and I are house sitting for my sister, they've called me expletives and upset me to the point I'm shaking lump in my throat....wondering what prompted such a reaction (bf hasn't known direct couple involved for years....)
They've sulked off furious at me downstairs their cars outside and I have interview for new job in -6 hours
I'm feeling horrific here how wrong would I be to say there's your car F off in it, you've blown this out of proportion?
I barely could speak without being berated I'm devastated here

His emotional response might be valid for him

This is exactly what I mentioned down thread. Just because his emotional response "is valid to him" it doesn't mean that he is justified in taking his anger or grief out on another person who has made a perfectly innocent and observant remark.

I might feel rubbish one morning because I overslept and the cat was sick on the carpet. Am I then justified being rude to my colleagues because my tiredness and frustration is "valid to me"?

@Psychonabike

People say a lot of stupid and crass things about cancer, that can be really difficult to hear if you've been touched by it in any way.

"Had they tried cutting out meat...?"

"That'll be all that partying catching up with them"

"They should have gone to my homeopath/snake oil merchant..."

And your version is just the update for 2020/2021:

I loosely said "makes you wonder if covid wasn't around if she could've been seen, treated or advised quicker" (inferring that they should have pressed harder for this to happen)

It's all part of the fighter narrative which suggests that some people outwit cancer by fighting harder...inferring that others are somehow weaker, and didn't try hard enough.

The fighter narrative is about ignorantly clinging to an idea that we have more control over these things than we actually do, and hugely insulting and insensitive to people who have been touched by cancer.

Some cancers present late. Some kinds of cancer just kill quickly and are destined to be fatal the moment they appear. Many cancers cause co-occurring conditions that lead to death quickly (like pneumonia).

Bringing up the "what ifs" following a cancer death is ignorant, crass and insensitive.

I guess your comment triggered something. Perhaps you could now be more sensitive to that @dreamofaVWcamper

Except her comment was nothing to do with the "fighter" narrative as it was about speed of diagnosis. If anything she was saying that the NHS had failed the patient, not that the patient hadn't fought hard enough.

MakeMeCleanTheHouse I'm sorry for the loss of your sister . That must be incredibly hard.

This is exactly what I mentioned down thread. Just because his emotional response "is valid to him" it doesn't mean that he is justified in taking his anger or grief out on another person who has made a perfectly innocent and observant remark.

Agree. If this a valid response for him it doesn't mean anyone cant have a valid response to that of cutting ties.

No one has a duty to save these kind of people. His feelings do not outweigh or negate the OPs. In fact people like the OP are doing him the bigger favour as he might realise eventually that the way you treat people impacts on how said person reacts to you.

The kind of thing most of us learnt as kids.

If anything she was saying that the NHS had failed the patient, not that the patient hadn't fought hard enough

She has no idea if that actually happened though, she was purely speculating. Which means her comment was unnecessary and insensitive.

Friend overreacted but there’s no backstory at all.

I think his reaction was over the top, particularly given his closeness to the person who died.

But would echo other posters who say it can be very distressing for people to speculate on circumstances around a death or even worse to construct a false narrative around it. I reacted very badly when a well meaning relative said to me that my DM had died of a broken heart when she passed away 10 weeks after my DF. While that may have been comforting for her to think, it was utter rubbish. My DM always knew she would outlive my DF and had accepted that, but it was covid that took her - she was mentally and physically exhausted by fighting it for 3 months, and losing my DF too, but she did not die of a broken heart.

How are you this morning OP? All set for your interview?

*People say a lot of stupid and crass things about cancer, that can be really difficult to hear if you've been touched by it in any way.

"Had they tried cutting out meat...?"

"That'll be all that partying catching up with them"

"They should have gone to my homeopath/snake oil merchant..."*

Someone tried telling me my husband had cancer of the spleen because he kept all his emotions stored away so it manifested in his spleen

Also tried convincing him not to have chemo, just to go vegan and drink sea moss. That'll sort it!

Also a COVID denier, anti vax conspiracy theorist funnily enough.

I agree it can be upsetting if someone is speculating about the death of someone close to you but that was not the case here.

She has no idea if that actually happened though, she was purely speculating. Which means her comment was unnecessary and insensitive.

Yes she was speculating. About someone they both barely kbew. And it was a valid question (as explained below my late friend was mis-diagnosed in November last year and Covid played a valid part in that). That's not by definition cruel or unkind. Nor was her intention. It was in the context of op sympathising with her friend.

And anyway, even if she didn't say exactly the right thing supposedly, it doesn't warrant the invective to which she was subjected by her supposed friend. Someone in my family committed suicide many years ago. Many people said the "wrong" thing, you would be surprised by how crass or trite some of the comments were in fact . But because they were coming from people who were friends, who had previously behaved well towards us, and we knew their intentions were good, and the situation was difficult, we didn't shout at them or anything stupid, we overlooked it and thanked them. Because we are not cockwombles!

Bringing up the "what ifs" following a cancer death is ignorant, crass and insensitive.

^ this. Always much better to just support than imply they could have been saved if....

Well before the pandemic, I knew two otherwise healthy young mothers who died shortly after a cancer diagnosis. One went in for routine gallbladder surgery and died in a hospice just 15 days after, leaving behind two primary school aged dc. It was devasting for their loved ones and noone needs to hear someone say the obvious, unnecessary and apathetic "I wonder if..." when coming to terms with it.

Hope your interview goes well. I would apologise to your friend for being insensitive and move on.

Just had news 35 year old friend of friend dead from cancer diagnosis within 12 weeks

The way he reacted may be nothing to do with your 'friend of a friend' it may however have triggered some other bad memories from his past and he's reacting to that.

@hairybakers

*People say a lot of stupid and crass things about cancer, that can be really difficult to hear if you've been touched by it in any way.

"Had they tried cutting out meat...?"

"That'll be all that partying catching up with them"

"They should have gone to my homeopath/snake oil merchant..."*

Someone tried telling me my husband had cancer of the spleen because he kept all his emotions stored away so it manifested in his spleen

Also tried convincing him not to have chemo, just to go vegan and drink sea moss. That'll sort it!

Also a COVID denier, anti vax conspiracy theorist funnily enough.

That’s blaming the cancer patient though. It’s not at all the same to wonder if they are the victim of covid related health system gaps.

@Seventhascent

"Except her comment was nothing to do with the "fighter" narrative as it was about speed of diagnosis. If anything she was saying that the NHS had failed the patient, not that the patient hadn't fought hard enough."

I think lots of people would hear it as part of the same narrative. It infers that there was a fault, a problem that could have been overcome, adds speculation and a "What if" when it is not helpful...and for many people it infers (intentionally or unintentionally) that the deceased (or their family) should have fought the system/NHS harder. When someone has died the time for that kind of discussion has passed.

@Unsure1983
I think when she lost her shit the first time you should have realised she was really upset and left it alone, not nailed down your point.

@Unsure1983
Oh, it's a man sorry. And he doesnt know the person? I take it back. That is strange. I would tell him to leave but probably a bit late for that now. Maybe he should leave tomorrow.

So its ok if its a woman but not a man? A man isn't allowed to be really upset by something and treated sensitively? Are you always deliberately this sexist?

Be honest @dreamofaVWcamper, do you talk about Covid a lot?

Whether it’s 11-12 weeks or 11-12 years it’s still shocking and shit and terrible and awful. It’s hard to wrap your head and heart around.
For your “friend” to jump on you for nothing makes it worse.
I lost my sister to cancer after four years — it was like some awful, grade C science fiction movie. My husband didn’t like her and hinted that she deserved it - needless to say, our marriage didn’t last.
Don’t put up with verbal abuse like that. You’re better than that, aren’t you?

If you and he disagree about the way covid has been handled then I expect your comment came across as using her death to score a point.

Yes I suspect he took this as point-scoring. I am sorry I think it was insensitive.

To be honest, someone who dies that quickly from cancer is very unlikely to have been saved with the best treatment in the world.
In terms of diagnosis, you do not know if it could have been diagnosed earlier. Some cancers have very few symptoms until it is fairly advanced. Some people do not seek diagnosis until a late stage even if they are fairly sure they have cancer.

ZOMBIE THREAD ALERT

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@Billandben444

First of all, she wasn't healthy - she had cancer. Secondly, perhaps your 'friend' thinks you have history of making things all about you and was looking for a more empathetic reaction? Anyway, he's gone now and it sounds as though the friendship is over.

Very stupid and unnecessary post

You're normal and your friend is an arsehole. Who cares what might be going on for him? Nothing gives him the right to be so rude to you.

I repeat:

ZOMBIE THREAD ALERT

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I'm glad you have asked this person to leave.

@BreadInCaptivity

I repeat:

ZOMBIE THREAD ALERT

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as @BreadInCaptivity said........

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