35 yr old healthy female dead from cancer in 12 weeks

[dreamofaVWcamper]

Just had news 35 year old friend of friend dead from cancer diagnosis within 12 weeks

Terribly business, children involved. Husbands bereft,

Upon hearing the terrible news I placated with the usual "so young, so soon, the poor fella, family and kids...."

I loosely said "makes you wonder if covid wasn't around if she could've been seen, treated or advised quicker"
(Given that there are millions of delayed treatments now, kidney transplants, mastectomy's, hip replacements etc)
Friend absolutely lost their shit at me saying "oh it's all about covid with you ain't it, you don't know shit, an expert on cancer now are you?"
I replied no of course not, but a healthy woman to die within 11-12 weeks of diagnosis is awful, I wonder if it had a part to play.....
Then a barrage of abuse and "youre jealous cos it's something that ain't all about you" this smarts, pretty appalling thing to say.....for daring to have an opinion/thought process on the situation,
What I though was my friend and I are house sitting for my sister, they've called me expletives and upset me to the point I'm shaking lump in my throat....wondering what prompted such a reaction (bf hasn't known direct couple involved for years....)
They've sulked off furious at me downstairs their cars outside and I have interview for new job in -6 hours
I'm feeling horrific here how wrong would I be to say there's your car F off in it, you've blown this out of proportion?
I barely could speak without being berated I'm devastated here

It wasn't a well thought out comment. You don't have any history, and it's not your friend, it's a friends friend and she's trying to process her grief. You don't know if she made multiple attempts to be seen regarding it, or that was the first visit she made. I'd apologise to your friend.

First of all, she wasn't healthy - she had cancer. Secondly, perhaps your 'friend' thinks you have history of making things all about you and was looking for a more empathetic reaction? Anyway, he's gone now and it sounds as though the friendship is over.

I remember years ago a young woman I barely knew died of cancer. She was in her 30s and had a young baby and I think despite not knowing her well the fact our babies were the same age meant I was really shaken by it. I couldn't stop thinking about her and I really grieved for her despite hardly knowing her. It was probably the first time I had really confronted death in young, otherwise healthy, people.

Fast forward 6 years and I've now lost someone young whom I was very very close to and my response has been completely different. I'm incredibly sad but I'm not shocked in the same way. I'm also having to play a major supporting role to my grieving family which has changed my outwards behavour. I know people think I'm not dealing with properly. I often reflect back to how I felt when I knew the other young woman had died and how different my responses have been I think knowing about her and processing the nature of death has helped me address grief within myself.

We all address death and mortality differently. There's no right way. I think questioning it and asking if anything could have been done to prevent it is a natural response although it doesn't always feel helpful because, if it could have been prevented why didn't we do something different? And that makes it very hard to be at peace with it. And eventually the best place to be is at peace. You see people all the time, often parents of young people, who realise that their child's death could have been prevented if someone had acted differently and it consumes their lives.

Good luck with your job interview. Give your friend some space and then try to make amends. It would be sad to lose a friendship over this disagreement.

It's not an unreasonable view to have expressed. It's been said pretty openly in the news that Covid was prioritised over other medical matters and there were cancers etc that would have been missed and so on.

However, sometimes there is no logical reason for a young person dying and there is no making sense of it. And to those suffering the loss directly, logic won't help with the loss.

Like starry night's friend I knew someone who died from cancer eleven weeks from diagnosis. Worked in medicine yet hadn't thought anything of any symptoms until they developed DVT. This was several years pre-covid.

OP, are you the person that beat a man with a curtain pole? I remember your name from a previous thread you commented on, Apologies if not.

Op are you saying the 'it's all about covid with you' is entirely wrong? That you don't talk about covid?

The person is a good enough friend that he is staying with you at your sisters. He has had an unusually unexpected outburst at you. Said you pull covid into everything and make things about yourself.

If a good friend, had an outburst like that firstly I would look at myself and wonder if I do, do that. But a real honest look at myself. If I genuinely thought that wasn't a true reflection and this person was a good friend, I would be wondering what's going on with them.

I am not saying I would have tackled it that night. But someone here suggested there's something quite big going on with him or someone close to him and your response was 'oh well can't heal the world'. About a close friend?

You can't heal the world. But most people, if this was a good friend, would at least be concerned. But you seem like you aren't, the slightest bit bothered.

I get what he did, by having a go wasn't pleasant and it's not OK. And I am not even saying you should try and speak to them. But I am quite shocked by 'yeah, could be going through something major......ah well' and its not even concerning you.

And honestly, I get irritated by people who assume all bad things, that happen, have some connection to covid. As though none of this happened before covid. Its like people are thinking the precovid world was far better than it was.

I do think it's a little crass to bring the whole covid thing into it. I think you should have just commented your condolences and moved on. I don't know you so can't judge whether or not this is you but some people do have an agenda with covid and would love to gleefully 'prove' that the response to covid is harming more people than covid itself.

Is there back story here? It sounds from his response that this isn't the first time something like this has happened ('it's all about Covid with you'). Perhaps this is the straw that broke the camel's back? It seems an odd comment for him to make if you'd never spoken about it before ...

@AwaAnBileYerHeid

I do think it's a little crass to bring the whole covid thing into it. I think you should have just commented your condolences and moved on. I don't know you so can't judge whether or not this is you but some people do have an agenda with covid and would love to gleefully 'prove' that the response to covid is harming more people than covid itself.

Agree. It feels a bit crass and tactless to suggest that it could have been prevented. Even if it could -pointing it out won't help at all. I think it would have aggravated many people.

It's the kind of musing you keep in your head or discuss with a third distant party.

Sorry for your loss.

I was talking to a doctor the other day and she said it's scary the amount of people they have had recently diagnosed with cancer because people haven't been getting checked out properly the last 18 months, so I am inclined fo agree with you.

@10ColaBottles I think she was saying those things to the friend, not the bereaved. I might be wrong.

Op this friend of yours - is he a friend or a fwb? Was he thinking this stay at your sisters was going to lead to something?

The reaction seems a very strange one.

But if its any comfort I know 4 young people who died within 2 months of cancer diagnosis pre-covid. The comment up thread about cancers growing quickly in young people could well be the explanation.

His behaviour is not acceptable in any circumstances. He isn't your friend.

Unless there's a huge back story here and you have without realising it, behaved selfishly towards him all weekend, and his outburst was nothing to do with the poor person who died, but an outburst of frustration for other reasons, (and even then ...) you were absolutely right to ask him to leave.

There's a worrying trend ATM of rude and verbally abusive people justifying their emotional incontinence by saying "I was triggered", for whatever reason, which can basically be summed up as "you have in my own head slighted me in some way so whether its justified or not, I'm entitled to let you have it". It's totally out of order.

It was a perfectly logical and reasonable speculation to make btw. We have lost a very close friend to cancer recently and she was mis-diagnosed by the doctor at the end of last year when appointments were hard to come by, and eventually took place by Zoom. Had the gp service been operating as normal I've no doubt she would have been diagnosed and treated earlier.

It's a terrible business what's happened to said person no way I saw such a hostile reaction, by the way said best friend is a hetro male he barely knows neither woman involved or husband so to my mind makes the outburst more staggering

Why does his being male and heterosexual make his reaction more staggering?

There may well be some reason for his emotions, one about which you know nothing. He may be expressing anger because this woman's death has reignited feelings about another incident he experienced in the past. And he may not be able to untangle that and explain why he's reacting so profoundly to a death that seems removed from his immediate circle and concerns.

Good luck with your interview today op

Get a grip. Your friend is grieving the loss of a friend who was young. You suggested it could be preventable, that twists the knife in when you are trying to cope with grief…believe me. My beloved father passed away suddenly and unexpectedly last year, so many people asked if it could have been prevented if not for Covid. I would politely reply but inside it crushed me that somehow he might still be here.
We all have our moments, these have been particularly testing times. Be kind to your friend.

16% less cancer diagnosis between April and December 2020 than in the same months in 2019
publichealthmatters.blog.gov.uk/2021/09/15/what-the-health-profile-for-england-shows-us-about-the-wider-impacts-of-covid-19-on-health/

Your point was valid. His emotional response might also be valid for him.

Get a grip. Your friend is grieving the loss of a friend who was young.

The op said her friend barely knew the woman who had died. That's the point!

@Seventhascent

Get a grip. Your friend is grieving the loss of a friend who was young.

The op said her friend barely knew the woman who had died. That's the point!

I admit missing that bit though that wasn't my comment

People say a lot of stupid and crass things about cancer, that can be really difficult to hear if you've been touched by it in any way.

"Had they tried cutting out meat...?"

"That'll be all that partying catching up with them"

"They should have gone to my homeopath/snake oil merchant..."

And your version is just the update for 2020/2021:

I loosely said "makes you wonder if covid wasn't around if she could've been seen, treated or advised quicker" (inferring that they should have pressed harder for this to happen)

It's all part of the fighter narrative which suggests that some people outwit cancer by fighting harder...inferring that others are somehow weaker, and didn't try hard enough.

The fighter narrative is about ignorantly clinging to an idea that we have more control over these things than we actually do, and hugely insulting and insensitive to people who have been touched by cancer.

Some cancers present late. Some kinds of cancer just kill quickly and are destined to be fatal the moment they appear. Many cancers cause co-occurring conditions that lead to death quickly (like pneumonia).

Bringing up the "what ifs" following a cancer death is ignorant, crass and insensitive.

I guess your comment triggered something. Perhaps you could now be more sensitive to that @dreamofaVWcamper

Bringing up the "what ifs" following a cancer death is ignorant, crass and insensitive.

This this this this.
Please don't do this ffs!!!

I'd also like to know if you do bring COVID into everything...

Is there some kind of backstory here - is your friend a covid denier and you perhaps talk about it a lot and your comment was the final straw for them. Or has he lost someone close to cancer and your friend's death has brought up uncomfortable feelings?

Sorry for your loss, I recently lost a close family member to cancer, by the time they had symptoms it was too late for any treatment and they died 8 weeks after diagnosis - nothing to do with covid though and I probably would be annoyed if someone linked the two together. Perhaps your friend just has covid fatigue and you linking your other friend's death to covid was just too much for them. Their reaction seems very over the top though and only you know if this is out of character for them.

Without covid my sisters cancer might have been detected. She died in 8 weeks. I wouldn't have found your comment insensitive unless it was delivered in a jovial way