Live-in carer - am I expecting too much?

[NetZeroZealot]

Elderly DPs (87 & 90), one recently diagnosed mild Alzheimer's, the other very frail & also prone to confusion / extreme forgetfulness.

They are lucky enough to have savings and a large house with a separate annex and as my sister & I live 1 & 2 hours away respectively & their needs have increased we decided a live-in carer was the best option starting in January. It was a job persuading them but after Mum had a couple of falls & a hospital admission they agreed ...

What the agencies promised and what has been delivered are miles apart!

As continuity is very important, we asked for a long-term carer to work a 5-day week - family can cover the other 2 days. Carer is free to do what they want at weekends and has the privacy of their own self-contained accommodation with TV, kitchen etc. I spoke to a few agencies and settled on a well-known, long-established company who promised (as they all do!) to carefully match the carer to DP's needs and offer us a choice of people, and importantly, came to meet my DP rather than relying on form filling.

In reality we were not offered any choice & had to accept the carers offered as the agency only found someone 2 days before the start dates. Only 3 months in we are now on carer number 3. The first did not drive which was a pre-requisite of the job; the second clearly did not like living far from home / in a semi-rural area and left of her own accord; and we now have number 3 who is OK. But not great.

Although the agency says they have checked references, they do not share the references with clients, but cherry pick quotes from them. DBS checks are a given.

All the carers have been competent and likeable and my DP have adjusted, but they found the unanticipated changeover between them very stressful, as I knew they would.

Meal planning is part of the care plan but the current carer seems to struggle with this - on my visits I still have to throw out bad food, or chuck stuff in the freezer which is on its last day when it should have been frozen the day the food delivery arrived, etc. This was a major problem with my Mum before & I feel the carer should be managing this better.

She also keeps asking me to buy stuff for them / the house which I don't think is needed or she could easily pop out & buy for them. And many other minor niggles - now I write it down it all seems a bit trivial.

They are paying a lot of money for this, and although it is reassuring to know there is someone there to deal with issues when they occur (which they do) I expected more. But perhaps I was being naive?

Sorry this is so long, anyone else got useful insights to share?

Genuine question. If the carers get such a bad deal (only minimum wage compared to the large amounts charged by agencies), what's stopping them from suggesting to customers such as the OP that they employ them direct so they they pocket all the money?

We had live-in carers for my grandparents, and for MIL. Both times through agencies. It is really tricky IME and I would be glad you’ve found someone who is covering the bases with minimal issues.

As you now know, there are not that many carers prepared to do live in work, so there is not a large pool to choose from. They haven’t chosen someone who ‘appreciates the rural area’ - seriously? They have sent someone who can do the job and is available.

Re out of date food in the fridge, you should be able to resolve that by speaking to the care agency. But if the family are there at the weekends anyway, it can’t be that out of date and family can deal with it. You said the complaints seem ‘trivial’, and you’re right. As long as your relatives are well cared for and reasonably happy with the arrangement, go with it and don’t expect everything done perfectly.

You’re not working with the “vast majority” simply your clients. Generally people who manage care themselves are on a budget and doing it to keep costs down, which I am not. All my friends either use agencies or care homes for their parents, so it’s not particular to me. Apart from career and family I’m also responsible for my elderly parents whose medical treatments and general nurturing already take up quite enough of my time as it is.

If you want to do that as a job, that’s fine you’re getting paid.

Now if don’t mind - back to the thread.

Agencies often make carers sign a contract that this doesn't happen. I believe if that a deal is done behind the scenes the agency can go for someone and get their commission for time worked... Not sure if it's the carer or employer.

Whatever the case, it's a lot of hassle and grief, based entirely around money!

Care companies 'care', but in my experience, more about the money than anything else. Getting their 'cut' for finding the workers... On indeed, LinkedIn, then arranging a DBS. It's often money for old rope on longstanding clients

I think you should hire direct.

Sound like a jammy job. £1400 a week plus your own apartment, bills paid.

Give out some bills and 2 decent meals a day. Help with bathing. This isn't time consuming or particularly taxing.

Not commenting on the level of care specifically but in context, however good and professional someone is, starting a new role at a new ‘company’ is a learning curve. New clients/colleagues/processes and it sounds like they need time to get into the right routine. It does also sound like perhaps whilst the location is picturesque it maybe isn’t the dream for others and could be very lonely? Hope you find a solution.

My mum has two carers that visit 4 times a day and it’s £1600 per month. Perhaps look at that and a live in housekeeper. That way their nursing and medical needs can be met and cleaning and cooking etc can be met by the housekeeper. My sister buys all my mum’s food and writes down what should be eaten each day according to the use by dates and the carers follow that plan. Look into dementia care too because I’m sure it is something councils have to provide. My mum gets a reduced rate because of her medical needs.

As per other posters ; recruit direct - there is a steady stream of South African and Filipina carers who would be happy to work for £1400 a week for 40 hours a week and accommodation paid.

Filipina carers less likely to have a drivers licence (our nanny/housekeeper has a moped licence but we declined her offer to take the dc on one! She used to be a carer and companion for an elderly person. In her church all of the women are housekeepers/carers/Nannies
and earn enough to support themselves in the UK AND support extended family back home) so set aside a budget for taxis. Possibly cheaper than keeping car insured.

I have no experience of care work and I’m now on early retirement due to my health. I personally think that sounds like a wonderful job with the accommodation. I would have happily have done that in the past with three hours to myself each day to enjoy the countryside and pop out to the local town. plus company of your parents whilst caring for them both.

With no accommodation costs if you are sensible, budget and only need basics you could save over £3k a month so in 2 years have £72k saved. I’d honestly happily have done that, I still would now.

you need to find someone a bit older I expect like me, maybe not use an agency, and find someone who likes living in the countryside.

Jammy job? Lonely. Stressful. More lonely. Quite boring. More lonely. Physically tiring. More lonely.

A countryside location, a nice bedroom, use of the family Ford fiesta, none of it makes up for spending time with family, freedom, flexibility, and general peace. "having a life"

It's a job most people do short-med term either for very, very very good money (if they bypass the agencies) or because they can't do anything else or this is their first experience of care and they don't know how hard it can be.

As previous posters have said, for 2 deteriorating adults requiring care with minor dementia in the mix, 1400 a week is a miracle to solve that problem. Any care home will start at 2000 each a week, before add ons... So, effectively 1400/wk is a third of the bills just around the corner....

Some of us would think that sounds great tbh. You don’t have to worry about your accommodation or bills . We don’t have family or friends to see. Plus you get weekends off. I think it sounds like a great job.

Gosh, so many posts - I only popped out to the optician!

Thanks to everyone who has shared their views. The point I tried clumsily to make about the benefits of a countryside location are that we were promised by the agency at the outset we would have a pool of people to choose from that would fit with my parents' circumstances. That didn't happen, and one was very clearly unsuited to it. Had the agency been upfront about the challenges my expectations would have been different.

I am taking away from this discussion that my expectations around food etc are unreasonable and going forwards we will manage that ourselves. The most important thing is and always has been that my parents are safe and happy.

And when the current arrangement comes to a natural end I will try to recruit directly so that I can be sure the next carer is paid appropriately for the job.

Thank you again for all your comments.

Please just stop! Stop being so rude and ignoring the fact that I have 16 YEARS experience! I have worked with hundreds of people with dementia in that time. Your experience is your single experience. Stop being so arrogant as to assume you know more from your single experience!

Having elderly people rely on you so much, and yet being lonely and sad yourself, isolated, is no dream job.

On paper I agree with what you say. But there's no future in it. As the elderly people get more frail and vulnerable, the carers get more drawn in and themselves more lonely and restricted in their lives....

I'm surprised it's only £1400 a week. Are they only charging for five days, because the family completely cover the weekends?

My grandparents paid £1100 a week for a live-in carer in 2010.

I agree with @Diamond7272 If it was a great job there would be no difficulty finding carers who want to do it.

The problem with paying for care is that you can't pay someone to care. You love your parents and want the very best for them, but can't provide the care yourself. You are paying someone to do a job, and often not paying much/asking a lot and expecting the delivery of what you would provide yourself or the very best there is. This is an issue with the care industry as a whole, and an issue with the lack of understanding about the economics of care. You simply cannot pay someone to be a loving presence who goes above and beyond to deliver tender care to your loved ones, those kinds of people are few and far between, especially in elder care (it's maybe easier with small children to some extent). So my advice is be realistic. You should provide a clear list of tasks and expectations that are realistic within the pay scale and take into consideration the inconvenience of the job (living in someone's annex, in a rural location, away from family and friends). Ultimately, it may be that just about satisfactory has to be enough, because the level of care you want is not available in the setting you require.

Yes, god if anything out there would pay me 1400 a week I'd be in heaven. Dreamland!

But, this isn't the way to do it via care. You earn every, every penny.

Those filipina ladies are remarkable. Truly. Truly. Impressive people. But their motivation is far stronger than anything most British workers face... In the Philippines, in your family are sick, poor, crushingly poor, there's no benefits. They starve. Without family money from abroad, people really suffer.

That's why those ladies work so hard.

Seriously impressive women.

But again, painfully lonely lives for them

Such a good post here. Well written. Opening line bang on

But the minute the job change you don't have a place to stay. It's a very insecure job.

It's an exceedingly cheap price you're paying OP. Anything needing a bit of initiative won't be done. It needs scheduled to a specific time eg clean fridge and bin all food out of date Tuesday afternoons.
People often want the bare minimum number of staff but underestimate the burnout of the intensity of the time spent. If they can only leave the house for 3 hours per day then they will be finding that highly restrictive and lonely so you will go through carers at a rate of knots. You may be better asking for the 120 hours to be split into two 60 hours based on a pool of 4 or 5 individuals to account for sickness and annual leave. Generally 5 people staying put for around with only normal movement of workers eg maternity, promotion, retirement means far less people over the next year than a new one every 6-8 weeks.

"eggs 3 weeks past their use by dates"

Eggs are good for many weeks after their dates. Float test and smell test and I've never been ill from eggs I've cooked myself.

"especially in elder care (it's maybe easier with small children to some extent)."

Yes, I was just thinking that reading your post. Small children are cute and endearing, but older people with dementia are totally different.

I suppose the problem with that is what happens if the person is ill, during the person's holidays, etc.? An agency can find replacements.

Being a good carer is more than just caring about them. And I think a lot of families confuse caring for someone and loving them unconditionally in the way families do.

To provide good quality care, you need to be fond of people yes but also retain a level of professional detachment - in the same way a childminder or nursery worker does. Your role as a carer is to ensure their needs are met and most of all their physical and emotional safety. That often looks a bit different to what families might expect.

It’s also very important to understand the effects of certain conditions and how to effectively manage them without letting emotions get in the way. Particularly where dementia is a factor. And it’s important to recognise everyone’s limits.
Just this week I have had to step in and suggest that family members take a slightly more back seat for awhile because their approach to a specific situation was completely counterproductive. And due to family dynamics and lack of understanding of how best to deescalate the situation came close to boiling point. A huge factor in that was mental fatigue on the part of the family member who was staying in the home of a parent with dementia. They had been there too long and were tired and worn down by the demands of the situation. So they have taken a break.

As a professional I can stand back and view the situation and diffuse it because I’m not emotionally invested and nor am I fatigued by the situation.
Living with someone with dementia is a huge undertaking and not one to be underestimated. 5 days alone with two adults with dementia would be more than most could handle. So having a couple of people splitting the week is a far more effective long term solution. That remains the same regardless of whether it’s managed by the family or an agency.

I can't believe 1400 a week is cheap! God if I didn't have kids I'd be on that in a heart best!

Can you search privately? The actual carer probably isnt getting half of that. Find someone that is actually suitable, with references that you can actually read.