How do you manage expectations

[Barney16]

Expectations from elderly parents I mean. I live three hours away from them and I work full time. Over the last year my parents have become sicker and their expectations have massively ramped up. At the moment I visit twice a month for about two or three days. They have said they wished I lived nearer and perhaps I could give up work. To be clear they have lots of support from family who live close to them, they drive, do activities, go out most days. I am their only child. I'm finding the stress of this very difficult to manage. After I visit I'm always poorly, when I leave to go home my mum cries. I was there before Christmas and Christmas eve and am there again now, oh one of them said, such a brief visit. Any suggestions, particularly about lowering my stress levels?

I know they have money but maybe if you helped your dad to claim attendance allowance you could more easily insist on using that for a cleaner / gardener etc.?
I would stop trying to do so much as they’re not going to stop pushing whatever you do. See a counsellor and look after yourself first.

Everyone has covered it nicely.

Do not clean the bathroom. Not one time. Once you do anything that sets a precedent and in their selfish, unreasonable minds it forever remains your job. Short version is do not do anything you’re not willing to do on repeat. There are no one offs in this regardless of what you tell yourself. Learn to say ‘no’ and stop talking, no justification or explanation, or ‘no, that doesn’t work for me’ if you must. Learn to tune out or ear rumble to
block the nonsense guilt trip that ensues. Honestly, it’s easier to just not start.

OP this is really tricky. We had a similar situation, and I am a similar age to you. There was no cleaner because "you or your sister can do that when you come" etc. It came to a head when after being there for 5 weeks (due to a hospital stay) I was exhausted. My mother was refusing to eat properly (no good reason). I couldn't work properly etc. In the end I booked her into respite care for 2 weeks just to have a break and it worked well. She came out, started eating sensibly and got a cleaner a few weeks later. We do still have a few issues but it is much better and more manageable. I am sure there will be future challenges of course but for now we are in a better place.

I cannot thank everyone enough. It's wonderful to know that I'm not going mad and that unreasonable expectations are things that many people have to deal with. Definitely going to push the cleaner thing. I cleaned their bathroom because I found out that my mother had asked my son, who lives locally to them, to clean their bathroom for £10. I did speak to her, I thought quite forcefully but she wasn't having it at all.

Ok I’m going to push back there - what was the problem with your son doing it? Was it that she wasn’t paying enough?

@PermanentTemporary but why should her DGS be doing their cleaning any more than OP ? If she wants someone to clean she does what most other people do and hire a cleaner who has presumably chosen that occupation and pays them a living wage.

Most of my boundaries have been trampled over, but I am very clear that DS19 is not to be used as a substitute for myself or DH for any hands on work e.g. hospital appointments or general check ins. He has been taking DF out for lunch occasionally but as DFs memory fades and he is getting frailer, I am reluctant for that to continue in case DF has a fall or needs to go into hospital for other reason when he is out. I just don’t think it’s fair that a barely there adult should be required to take on that burden. In my mind DGCs should not be used for hands on elder care, and for those suggesting a roster of nearby cousins etc - most will fall by the wayside if required to make an ongoing commitment as they have their own immediate families and things to do.

I imagine it has less to do with the money and more to do with the fact that he didn’t want to clean his grandmother’s bathroom.

It was this. He didn't want to but felt that he should. I didn't think he should and their bathroom was quite nasty. I suppose I thought that if they are willing to pay a family member why wouldn't they pay a professional person to do their cleaning. It's part of a pattern really. They are perfectly capable of making a meal or popping out for lunch and they do but if someone is there they will say oh what's for lunch and expect a meal to be made and taken to them on a tray.

I agree with you that he shouldn’t be expected to do anything like this.

Refusing to use the services of a cleaner and expecting family members to clean instead, is incredibly common.

It is an entirely unreasonable expectation for them to have though, and, as others have said, it is their problem to solve.

That doesn’t make it any less frustrating for you.

All you can do is hold the boundary, reiterate the perfectly reasonable alternative you’ve suggested (a cleaner) and try and detach from their stubborn insistence that only you (or your son) will do.

It is really unfair and selfish of them to involve your son in any way.

No that’s completely right. I’m not against family members being paid to do things is all.

I’ve kept my DS19 and DD18 out of it too. They sat with MIL a lot when she was still with us because they wanted to be with her, that’s different. FIL demanded that DD (as a female relative) was obliged to clean him after he (deliberately, for attention) messes himself. DH shut that down before I did. Personal care is a different level, but I would argue that cleaning a filthy bathroom
is as close as it gets. If they can pay DGS they can pay a professional.

Many old people have a reluctance to pay outsiders to do tasks as they prefer to keep money within the family. It might have been marginally less insulting if they had actually offered him a decent amount to do it, but still not something he or you would be wanting him to do.

My DPs are bizarre with money. Happy to hand over large wads of it to their DGS but ridiculously resistant to spending it on cleaners or taxis even though they are absolutely loaded and a £14 taxi drive is nothing compared to us having to do a 2 hour return trip to get groceries with DF. It was a serious struggle convincing them to put £50 in a Christmas envelope for the cleaner ( it’s how much I pay her from their account for 3 hours per week).

I do wonder about your DMs mental faculties OP, asking a DGS to clean your bathroom is not normal at any age really coupled with asking you to give up your job and crying when you leave. I don’t think you should do anything different ( except not cleaning the bathroom again) but she might not be aware of how ridiculous some of her asks are, so deflecting may work better than proving her wrong if that is the case.

I'm nearly 69 and I do agree that people 80 and upwards seem to have a strange relationship to money. Obviously I'm talking about the ones who really, really aren't hard up. I know quite a few who would rather never leave their house than spend £15 quid on a taxi and would let their home fall apart than pay for repairs. They'll wear thick socks and jumpers rather than put the heating on too. I just don't get it.

This is a really bad idea if it means losing all their other support

You need to impart to them that you will not be cleaning for them.

Don't roll up your sleeves and clean next time you visit. Don't allow anyone else to do it either.

Difficult op they get worse too. My mother goes crazy when told no. I just do what I can. I only get over Sat as work all week. They grind you down for sure. I hate it

All the time you do things for them, they won't feel the need to hire in help as 'our daughter looks after us, we don't need any help'

Be careful

This has happened to me and as an only child it is awful ☹️

Not unusual my Mum cries all the time when I leave

Both her, and my Das are scared by the ageing process ☹️

Dad (apologies)

"That's what daughters are for..."

That's what mum said to me. I'm going to totally agree with the PP that said it's a marathon, not a sprint. Think what you can do, then repeat that's what you can do and signpost suggestions. They are adults, if they have capacity, then they can choose what they do and running you into the ground is not an available option for them.

There's a really good podcast by Annalisa Barbieri on talking to older people.

I read a brilliant expression - how women- daughters- do the “ invisible mending” that hold the elderlies together- unseen and unacknowledged

They drive a car but can’t clean their own bathroom?

You’ve had some great advice OP. I’m in a similar situation. Apparently it would ‘make sense’ for me to rent out my house, give up work, and go and live with them as a carer. Every visit I make is ‘too short’ and I should visit more often, even though I work and live 5 hours away (because they moved in their 80s).

They are draining, so I keep pretty strictly to not visiting more than a few days every 2 months. And agree with the marathon not a sprint comment. Mine are more high needs than yours as health is failing, so I have increased in the last couple of years from every 3 or 4 months to 2, but additional visits around hospital stays have also been necessary. So cut down your visits now, as expectations will only ramp up in future.

I agree totally with the advice to encourage them to outsource anything they can. The challenge will be to persuade them that they should do this if you are currently doing lots for them. With my DM I had some success with telling her I had a set amount of time that I can spend with her so it can either be spent doing her shopping and cleaning the bathroom or taking her out for lunch/to visit an old friend/looking at old photos etc. You do have to stick to it though.

I've also found that when they have unreasonable expectations it's best not to commit to visiting at certain times/doing specific chores for them unless you are willing to keep this up indefinitely. As well as longer visits for specific reasons I try to pop over to see DM for an hour or so every week or 2 just for a chat. This is a 3 hour round trip so means 4-5 hours of my time which is not always possible. If I call when I finish work to say I could pop over for a cuppa she is delighted and tells me/everyone she knows how wonderful I am for thinking of her when I'm so busy etc. If I tell her at the start of the week that I plan to pop over one evening if I can finish work in time she will call me constantly asking if I know which day I'm going, why can't I go tonight, how is she expected to do [totally non-urgent task] if I'm not there, comparisons with friend's DD who apparently visits every day etc etc.

Having lots of friends and family around them is great but I'd be wary of them expecting anyone else to commit to visiting on a certain day or do certain tasks for them regularly. My DM is managing to put off quite a few helpful friends/family members by being utterly unreasonable with them too (eg getting annoyed when a family member missed his weekly visit to her because he was on holiday with his children and grandchildren, getting annoyed with a neighbour who suggested using a prescription delivery service after DM has been expecting her to collect medication every few weeks because she once said she should let her know if she needed anything). This is another reason to outsource as much as possible.