How do you manage expectations

[Barney16]

Expectations from elderly parents I mean. I live three hours away from them and I work full time. Over the last year my parents have become sicker and their expectations have massively ramped up. At the moment I visit twice a month for about two or three days. They have said they wished I lived nearer and perhaps I could give up work. To be clear they have lots of support from family who live close to them, they drive, do activities, go out most days. I am their only child. I'm finding the stress of this very difficult to manage. After I visit I'm always poorly, when I leave to go home my mum cries. I was there before Christmas and Christmas eve and am there again now, oh one of them said, such a brief visit. Any suggestions, particularly about lowering my stress levels?

They have said perhaps I could give up working

Are they quite mad? Just so you can visit more?

I’m still not totally there but I have got past some of the guilt. Mine would love it if I moved in, wasn’t working and was available 24/7 to her.

That is never going to happen because I have a full time job to pay the mortgage, a child at primary school and a life somewhere else.

Others on here encouraged me to set boundaries and be realistic about what I can do. I see mine 3-4 times per year and I have resisted all attempts to increase this.

At some point there will be a crisis. The last time there was, I wasn’t well enough to travel so couldn’t do anything. The hospital and local friends dealt with it all.

Did they give up their lives to look after your children? Because their expectations seem very high. They also have each other, unlike many elderly people on their own. If you expected a lot from them, maybe they feel justified in asking you to help. But the bottom line is you do what you feel you can do, but more importantly what you want to do. My Dad lives on his own and neither of my brothers has visited him over Christmas. I live nearby, so everyone expects me to step up. I already do a lot for him. This year we had him on Christmas Day and Boxing Day only. And by the way my brothers are retired and I work full time!

This is going to sound harsh, but I say it with all compassion - twice a month for 3 days is too much. You make no mention of a partner or children of your own, but even if you don't have either, you deserve to have a life too.

So my practical suggestions - Work out what you do to support them - is it practical or social / emotional. Then speak to your extended family and firm up their support, eg can auntie Joan visit every other Thursday evening for tea, cousin phil drop by for a cuppa each Saturday morning.

Make sure they have any support going into their home, eg once a month cleaner, a gardener to mow the lawn every fortnight. Are they at a stage where they need more formal help from a carer?
Write out this timetable for them so they can visualise it more clearly, include their clubs and regular outings. My parents local Aged UK group were a godesend - tea dances, music group.

You will then need to gird you loins and grit your teeth to take a stance - decide what YOU want to do. So you may decide once a month / every 6 weeks for a weekend, eg Friday evening to Sunday lunchtime. Sit you Mum and Dad down and TELL them what WILL BE happening - this is NOT a negotiation. You need to make it clear

1. you will not be leaving your job;
2. you will not be moving nearer - any talk of either of these points, you shut it down - "Common on Mum, Ive already told you that's not going to happen" and change the subject. If the pressure continues, leave the room - "I'm not talking about this anymore".
3. this visit is flexible to fit around your work and social life. If you have a good relationship with a member of your extended have them there for this talk to show you are not their own support. And when you are at your parents have things to do that involve others so they can see you are not their only source of support.

This may probable feel harsh but you will have to stand up for yourself as your parents have already demonstrated they have no shame in emotionally manipulating you. Yes, they may miss you, feel scared at their aging, but they have plenty of support from others, they do not need you 100% body and soul.

From your describtion your parents sound reasonably fit and well so this is a marathon not a 100m sprint. You need to pace your input to keep you fit and well, both physically, emotionally and socially. What you mustn't do is let any guilt take over your life because it's your life to live, pure and simple.

My apologies if this seem hard and harsh, well actually I'm not. Draw those boundaries sooner rather than later.

Thank you very much for the replies. They did help me with childcare when my children were young but not in a particularly sacrificial way. I feel almost the aged parent equivalent of mum guilt somehow. But conversely feel that I'm becoming increasingly drained by them. Any suggestions I make , a cleaner for example are roundly ignored. I can clean their bathroom apparently 😕

Any suggestions I make, a cleaner for example are roundly ignored. I can clean their bathroom apparently

🤯

Could they move closer to you into a place which meets their growing needs? They are being honest if a bit unreasonable, it’s a long distance

What age are they and what are their ailments? I would suggest unless any of the illnesses are terminal then you are doing far too much for them, particularly as they are still driving and socialising. The one thing I would say is if this is out of character and their requests are so ludicrous like expecting you to give up your job,then it is possible than one or indeed both of them may have cognitive decline and it could be an early dementia symptom.

Can they afford a cleaner? If so then you stop cleaning at all. My DM refused to get one even after I got her attendance allowance ( they are loaded) and only caved because she was bed bound and DF was in agreement to get one. If they genuinely can’t afford it then I would get them some antibac wipes, bathroom mousse cleaner, a toilet foamer thing for the cistern and things to make the job easier. If they are well enough to socialise one or other of them should be well enough to wipe the surfaces occasionally.

Sadly with elderly DPs the choices seem to be guilt or resentment. Always go for guilt. How much did they do for their parents?

You have to treat them like children. No means no. Tell them they are being ridiculous and to act their age.

We have this a bit with DH's mum. We live over 2 hours away and both work full time with three DC (two at secondary school and one away at uni). DH visits her for one night every 3-4 weeks so I think you are doing loads! My MIL does make comments about us visiting more often, we just ignore them. And don't clean the bathroom for them!! Keep saying "maybe you should get a cleaner for that" over and over again. They may listen eventually!

They want you to give up work, be a mum, be their maid, and sod any of your needs as a human being?

You can clean their bathroom? The fucking audacity!

Having some of these conversations in our family.

Elderly FIL is adjusting to widowerhood and my husband’s siblings are proposing the three of them go to stay with him on a rolling basis each weekend (with the exception of a few short periods he’s had constant companionship and support from at least one of his children since MIL died). However, everyone is at best a 3 hour drive away and DH works full time, the sibs don’t. I just think that’s too much for everyone (but particularly for DH) and will be impossible to sustain. Plus FIL is in excellent health, in possession of all his faculties, still driving, computer literate, involved in groups and social activities etc. I’m encouraging DH to put down boundaries now before a culture of expectation and dependency starts to bed in with both FIL and the sibs. DH agrees with me but is very conflict avoidant and as the youngest tends to do what he’s told.

so interesting to read your post @DPotter as was worried I was being too mean and selfish.

If this ever arises for me my plan is to say "I have my own house to clean, that's more than enough".

They are mid eighties so reasonably old but still active, less active admittedly than 12 months ago. It's my dad really who is in poor health. The whole thing is ironic because both of them retired at sixty and their parents were all dead by then. I'm sixty which is what may have prompted their give up work comments. They have plenty of money too and I don't so they could pay for things to make their lives easier, a cleaner for instance.i am going to have to consistently state my boundaries. I'm thinking a once a month visit.

You have to not feel so guilty and put them right on this every time they raise it. You have your own life and job, and you would not want to give it up. And as above, you have you r own house to clean.

They are not your responsibility, they can want all of this from you, but you do not have to give it.

They often become totally illogical and unable to see anyone else’s point of view by this stage.

Mine wanted me to visit weekly to do cleaning (amongst other things). I don’t clean my own bathroom at home - don’t have time with work and children, that’s why I have a cleaner. It would have been insane to have a cleaner for my own bathroom but do a five hour weekly round trip to clean theirs!

But in their heads this was the obvious solution.

IME it helps to think of them as demanding toddlers, in terms of attitudes and expectations. Elderly people become totally, and I do mean totally, self-centred and self-absorbed. Whatever you do it will never be enough, so you have to decide what is realistic for you (eg travelling a long way to clean their bathroom is ridiculous, just don't do it) and point them in the direction of local care agencies etc for other help. Also encourage them to use taxis, because the lifts to medical appointments etc becomes a problem at some stage.

You say "no"..... as many times as it takes.
You are polite but consistent.
If they need assistance, it's up to them to either pay for help, or contact Social Services.
It's not your responsibility, OP.

You need to get as spoiled as me… I have a cleaner for MY house, like hell am I going to clean someone else’s for nothing. I don’t feel spoiled though, I pay because I value my own time. Other people’s consideration of what my time is worth is often inaccurate.

An unexpected problem I found was that both my dad and my in-laws were in circles where the number and length of visits you got from family gave you bragging rights. The culture at my MIL’s nursing home was all eg ‘oh Tony hello, this is my daughter in law the lawyer and my eldest grandson who’s at Cambridge, visiting again’. ‘Oh that’s nice. We’ve got both our twin sons and their families visiting today, there’ll be six of us, and they’re back tomorrow, they’re both semi retired from their businesses, ding so well.’ I swear some of them were keeping notes on who got most visits. My mum didn’t do this thank goodness.

Big rule of this stage of life is not to do what you can outsource. Frankly, any cleaner at all can clean better than me, I’m terrible at it. Only I can be Mum’s daughter and remember the family in jokes etc.

What about a Facebook portal or other video call option? Don’t ask, just set it up and start doing it.

This. Say no. You have a life, job, kids. The cheek of them expecting you to clean their bathroom is fuckin breathtaking. Say no, and stick to it.

Please look up Out of the FOG website- fear, obligation and guilt. And check into the cockroach cafe on the elderly parent board…. Loads of support from those deep in the trenches of elder care. A very popular Bad daughters bench( with plenty of room) and a very dusty empty good daughters bench…
I recognise some names from there! ( hello @PermanentTemporary) great advice on this thread too.

I found many older people still expect the females in their life to do most of this type of work . My brother who works FT and has a disabled child can't do as much as others which is fine with the rest of us . But when he does show up usually with flowers or buns he is greeted as the Messiah and his visit is talked about for ages . Luckily we can laugh including him .

This is a marathon - not a sprint. You don't throw all your resources in at the beginning of a marathon, you have to pace it out. I'm told 100m sprinters bearly take a breath. God hark at me talking running tactics - you'd laugh if you knew me IRL.

Stop with the cleaning! - that's why I suggested having activities planned for when you visit - gentle social, definitely not housework. If your Dad's too frail to go out, invite the family /neighbour over for tea and cake Saturday afternoon, glass of sherry Saturday early evening, whatever you fancy. You could sell a cleaner coming in to smarten the place up before hand, sneaking it in there so to speak.

Make the visit 6 weekly - that way you have the space to ramp up if/when things get tougher.

I would urge some very, verycareful consideration if the matter of them moving to you arises. Whilst it sounds a good idea, they have a good network where they are, of which you are only one facet. Moving to you, and you and only you would be their world. Our family has moved 2 elderly parents, but only once they were moving into a care home.

I do like PermanantTemporary way of looking at things -
Big rule of this stage of life is not to do what you can outsource. Frankly, any cleaner at all can clean better than me, I’m terrible at it. Only I can be Mum’s daughter and remember the family in jokes etc

Once a month is very reasonable. I think it’s good to slightly under commit when there are no crises going on, to save a bit of petrol in the tank for them.
I would develop some stock phrases to deflect from comments you know you are going to get “You should give up work so you have more time to look after us” - “Remember I won’t get my state pension until I am 67/68 - I can’t afford to stop working.” On the cleaner front I would just avoid discussing it, if they have their faculties then they can choose to live in squalor, it’s not your job to fix it , and that applies more broadly as well. You can’t stop them getting older and you can’t solve their problems. Show up as often as you think a good DD would for your own conscience ( got this from Let Them by Mel Robbins) and be prepared to walk away if they expect more.

I would caution though if it is the start of dementia which does sometimes show itself through personality changes, then encourage the DP to visit their GP early.

I'm definitely in the don't do what you can outsource camp. Sadly my brother isn't. He is of the don't outsource what you can try to bully countrygirl into doing. That's why I've gone NC with him and blocked him everywhere.