Father in law won’t pay

[ItsDdayalloveragain]

me and my husband are in a dilemma as to what to do with my father in law who is refusing to pay for his wife’s care. Basically, mother in law is 88, had a fall at home, taken to hospital 8 weeks ago, and 3 weeks ago was transferred to a care home for assessment. She has undiagnosed dementia which nose dived following her fall. Nothing was broken when she hit the floor but she is incredibly unstable and now shuffles with a walking frame. My father in law, has and is a tight arse. We are talking about having no heating on to save money and sitting in a coat, eating food that’s gone off etc. They live in a rented house and pay full rent due to their savings being £160k. Me and my husband believe that mother in law is looked. After well in a care home as she’s warm, fed and has her meds regularly, she is supervised and checked in on regularly. But he wants her home, he says he’s not paying for care and is now trying to hide the money in different accounts to avoid fees. We have explained it’s 50/50 her money and it’s a deprivation of assets. He doesn’t care and said their (social services) are not having it. Any idea on what we can do to ensure mother in law has the care she needs? He is a very unloving and uncaring husband- no different to how he’s been the 40 years I’ve known him!

She has had the FREE care that you get when you are discharged from
hospital. She has 1.5 weeks left of that. So I understand why SS are pushing to move her out and back home. We have been told that they will initiate carers coming but that she will have to fund it herself. That’s the problem (as well as the fact the house is not appropriate for her ). He says that he has worked , she was a stay at home wife (as many were back in the day) and therefore the money in the saving is his. She inherited money from her parents so she put it in savings and they had a joint account. I’m appalled that he truly believes she gets nothing! And at a time when she needs it most. My husband actually believes he will go through with this and I do to. I’d love nothing more than for him to ride off Into The sunset in a motorhome never to be seen again….. with his half…. Not hers.
in the care home she’s in she has physically improved, put a little weight on, clean clothes, happier, she enjoys watching staff and residents moving around and has company. I cannot believe SS want to try her at home when they have been told the situation. I am
onto age concern today to get advice. Thanks all for your help.

Report as a safeguarding issue. Call it financial abuse and elder abuse. My dad tried to do this, social services assessed my parents separately. Admittedly he didn't have to pay as no savings at all. Mum was eventually moved into care as she decided within her dementia that she actually hated my dad and wanted to kill him, so social services had no choice in the end. Make sure you log with the discharge coordinator that you consider this to be an unsafe discharge. When they discharge her home, it will take a while for the financial assessment to be done anyway so the not paying won't be an immediate problem. It sounds like even with carers it's doubtful she'll be ok at home, then the decision is out of your FIL hands, he doesn't get the option not to pay.

Health wise, does she need nursing care and is she incontinent? When SS wanted to send MIL home with carers the fact that if she pooed herself at night, she’d be waiting until the morning carers to get changed, this was enough for them to see sense and put her straight into residential care from the hospital. There was no way FIL could manage that at home, even with carers.

In theory your FIL is correct that he won’t be paying anything for your MILs care, as it’s only her savings and assets that should be used for her care.

Has she now been assessed as having dementia? And having lost capacity? had a financial assessment been done by SS? Does your DH have any access to your MILs accounts? Does he know where the savings are and whose name the are in? has anyone informed the bank(s) that your MIL no longer has capacity, and gone through the process of your DH and his brother taking on responsibility? Banks should treat joint accounts differently once LPAs are involved, but you need to tell them. Does your FIL also have LPA for MIL? If not and he’s just a joint account holder then, in theory, as soon as she no longer has capacity your DH and brother should assume the LPA. They can then open an account in her name and transfer half the savings to it.

So the pp who said that the first thing to do on the legal / finance side is to establish who has LPA, and to enact / use these powers to protect your MILs assets, is correct. You seem to be trying to get your FIL to ‘do the right thing’ against his own interests, by arguing with him - but there are legal means to force the issue. Your DH can sign a contact with a care company and use your mothers money to pay for it as well - again, the LPA needs to be enacted to do this.

IF the LPA had not been enacted, and your FIL had already ‘hidden’ the money or spent it on a motor home, then it depends how much your DH and just brother want to fight with their father?

Thank you for your reply.

1. she’s not incontinant
2. he knows his half of the money will not be used. The problem is they have a joint account and HE wants to keep her half for himself. 3)my DH does not have LPA for finance, only health. 4)no official diagnosis of dementia even though she is on the dementia ward and staff talk about her ‘severe dementia’.
3. FIL does not have an LPA for MIL
4. both sons have no access to MILs bank accounts
5. yes you’ve hit the nail on the head! DH and BIL want FIL to do the right thing and FIL is not having it…. But it is meaning that decisions are held back on MIL care because there’s not the finance in place to pay for it. I,e , at the minimum , she needs carers, everyone agrees, but nobody will pay. £20 ph x 4 visits per day = £560 pw. This amount pw would not be sustainable for her sons to pay.
6. your last sentence I believe will be the deciding factor. But I do know that my DH believes that his mother gave him LPA to ensure her best interests are upheld. And if it comes to it, I feel he will have to do what’s right by his mum and not his dad. This will create huge tensions….. but it is what it is I suppose

Isn’t it awful to think that this is all over money!!

This may have been done already but investigate Continuing Healthcare (CHC). It transfers the funding from the local healthcare trust to the NHS. It’s for 12 weeks and is then reviewed - it may mean she can stay where she is for now and at the very least, gives you some breathing space to sort out the next steps.

Speak to the Consultant overseeing her and the Ward Manager. Ask for a meeting with the CHC team and the above. I’ve just successfully used this to keep my mother in the hospice she was in, rather than be moved to a care home at the end of her life.

There may be a difference as mum was at EOL but possibly worth investigating.

If it gets so far as carers calling I would hope they would see the state of the place and raise a concern. When Dad came home the carers did an inital assessment for equipment, safety etc and if he refuses entry maybe a different but similar report?

Op you are saying it’s £560 per week. Can your dh steak to his mother and find out where she banks. Then tell her he needs access to her account to pay for her care.
The above poster hit the nail on the head. Your fil does not care for his wife at all. He is a misogynist who believes she is far beneath him and unworthy of any kind of help whatsoever ever. It’s clear that this has always been the case so I don’t know why your dh and his brother are shocked by his behaviour.
It’s very clear that your fil treats his wife like a dog. You need to stop expecting him to he a kind and loving husband, he isn’t. He will never do the right thing.
He would probably see her die first, in fact he only wants her alive so that she can continue to be his servant. Once she is no longer capable of that role she is worthless to him.
Getting access to his mother’s money should be your dh’s priority. Personally if it was my mother, I would not want her in That house with her abusive husband. I would try and get access to her money and use it pay for a card home where she will be safe.
Don’t forget that your fil will not want this, he wants his servant at home, doing the grunt work or even worse there so he can abuse her.
Finally you have to remember hard as it is, that your mil partly chose this life. Not all women of her age sat at home never earning their own money.
My own mother worked and earned her own money, her entire working life as did all her sisters and sister in laws.
Life hasn’t suddenly changed in 2025- that is a myth.
This is a very stark warning to all women.

If she needs the care, push for it. The council will do a financial assessment requiring probably at least 6 months of bank statements. They will know he's moved around the money, if he refuses to send the financial information they will start sending them invoices for the full cost of the care and if he refuses to pay they'll start recovery action eventually
Basically he needs to accept that he can move £80k into an account in his sole name, the other £80k needs to be used to fund her care in full until it goes under £23k where it will be a contribution based on her income. I would be sitting him down and explaining this to him clearly and calmly. If he doesn't want to use the money towards her care then you need to advocate for her. If he doesn't let her get the care she needs then it is neglect and if he refuses her access to her own money, then that is financial abuse.
Tbh if he doesn't come around to sorting this out with you soon, I would be doing everything I could for mil whilst completely distancing myself from fil. Any man who doesn't prioritise his wife's wellbeing above money doesn't deserve family to stick around

If the money is in a joint account and MIL is an account holder, she can transfer her half of the money to a new bank account without his permission - afaik. Other posters please correct me if that's no longer the case.

Try the age uk advice line op. They might be able to offer some advice

her sons can apply for financial deputyship - the forms are online but it's not a quick process.

FIL can say what he likes about not paying. Local Authorities are ruthless and they will see he has moved money around and class this as deliberate deprivation of capital. If he refuses to hand over financial details they will simply just class her as a full cost payer and s/he will be billed for the care regardless.

If the bill isn't paid then 'MIL' will be taken to court (the local authority will ask for a charge to be placed on her property/finances)

The local authority will then suggest either her sons apply for deputyship or the local authority will apply for deputyship to be awarded to an independent firm of solicitors.

No matter what happens she won't be left without any care - this would be a safeguarding issue. The local authority will still send the carers even if no one is paying but will pursue legal action for the funds if necessary.

If her needs can't be met at home then the carers will flag that up very quickly and if it's in her best interests to be in a care home then that's what will be recommended.

If her son's have LPOA for Health then they are the decision makers about where her care is provided not the local authority and not FIL

So in theory whilst they have the power here it's a bit moot because they don't have access to the funds and they can't make the local authority pay for it so they need to obtain deputyship.

I know it seems difficult OP but her sons are going to have to let it play out somewhat.

You'll hold SS accountable for her husbands actions?

Of course its the abuser who is primarily at fault but can i ask why they shouldnt be held accountable when its the elderly . I just looked for MN threads on the Arthur Labinjo Huges case and there was no one questioning it there. I wonder why 🤔

Wow, what a difficult situation.

i think i would tackle the unsafe discharge, that’s worth putting your energy into. Your DH has LPA for that, he has some justification to be included in decisions on her behalf - and this is clearly not in her interests. If she does go home, it will likely collapse very quickly and at least the carers will be able to flag it up.

At some point someone has to sign a contract with the care providers, to ensure that they get paid. FIL won’t, and he’s within his rights to do so. Your DH and his brother aren’t going to pay out of their own pockets. MIL can’t as It appears that she no longer has capacity - but has that been assessed by anyone? And no one has financial LPA for her so no one can sign on her behalf to use ‘her’ money anyway 🤦‍♀️. So if she is discharged home, it will have to be the SS who sign the contract with the carers on the understanding that they can claim the money back. She won’t be left with no care even if FIL refuses to pay them himself.

if FIL then goes ahead and spends or removes all the money from the joint account, it will be up to the SS to fight it out with him. Will they bother for £80,000? Idk.

Just on the discharge from hospital. I have an elderly uncle with dementia. I have LPA for health and finance. I was new to the situation. He lives hundreds of miles from me. SS first option was to discharge him home from hospital , with a care package, as I was told they like to go with the “least restrictive option”.

Myself and the other LPA did not agree to this and said if it was done, it was without our agreement. SS seem to prefer to send them home with a care package as the first option. Suggest your DH resist/refuse this with all the valid reasons he has as LPA.

with my uncle I told them under no circumstances would I ever agree that a home care package was appropriate or safe. It was for different reasons than in your case but we achieved what we believed was the better outcome. He has gone from hospital to a care home.

He cannot hide money, they will find it for the fees !

My Dp's mother was not allowed to return to the marital home after a fractured hip as her husband had a history of refusing access to her carers. This was instigated by the hospital, not us. She was admitted to a care home and he must have paid eventually as they had plenty of savings. So it is possible.

I'm sorry to say you will just have to been on the phone to them with every problem - refusing access to carers, any falls, no downstairs bed, poor food - the whole shabang

Your FIL is awful for doing this but the first step is for your DH to have a very firm conversation with SS that sending MIL back home is not safe or in her best interests. Have they done a full care needs assessment? When I asked that question they said “that will be our next step”. This was after suggesting they were going to send my uncle home with carers (which wasn’t right for him for a whole long list of reasons).

the funding can be the next step.

Does your mil want to go home, has she agreed to having carers. Does she have mental capacity to agree and accept all the risks involved. She needs a capacity assessment and if she lacks capacity the health lpa steps in and insists on attending a best interest meeting to air their concerns. If her money is joint money has she agreed to moving it, paying for carers. With the financial lpa she would have needed to write whether he takes over when it was registered or when she loses capacity so check the paperwork.

Also check if the landlord is aware the house is a mess and he's a hoarder, this can be a safety and fire hazard. Landlord may want to know if a heavy hospital bed is being installed and carers are going in.

I don’t know which force area you live/work in but that’s definitely not true here, it would be viewed as the domestic abuse it is here and police would take action.

Thank you, we found this reassuring! Hopefully the best outcome will happen, but they say nobody ever goes straight from hospital to a care home…. I find this hard to believe

I hate all this as it feels like we are telling tales on them. But it’s got to be done as there are safety issues at stake. if we tell the landlord, it’s not coming from us and he may listen!

Sadly MIL hit the floor and has never recovered and now does not have capacity. She doesn’t know who we are or where she is. There is no financial LPA as he refused it. He only agreed to a Health LPA, which feels a bit useless in this situation. My DM has both LPA’s and it’s truly come into its own in the last 12 months and has been a doddle compared to DH parents.