If a parent goes into a care home will the LA come for some of the money from the sale of their house?

[Thebluespoon]

Once the remaining partner (who is currently living in the house) dies?

I am not sure if I should have placed this thread in the Money matters section but thought there may be some people on here who have gone through this.

I am a bit confused following a meeting with my parents finanical advisor.

Mum has Alzheimer;'s, it's been 7 years since her diagnosis. She lives at home with my dad and between my dad, my sister and myself we have been helping to look after her. However, following an awful fall in June and subsequent hospital stay mum's dementia has progressed rapidly and she is now double incontinent and can only walk aided and even that is tricky. We now have private carers who come in 3 times a day.

We are hoping to keep mum at home for as long as possible but we are aware we are on borrowed time and there will come a point when the home carers are not enough and we will not be able to cope, at this point we will have no choice but to look into care homes.

Mum and dad have investments. Because of mum's recent change in circumstances Dad and I had a meeting with his financial advisor yesterday. My parents investments were changed after mum's diagnosis in 2018 and most of them are now in dad's name (all done under the financial advisor's advice). There is a fairly good chunk under mum's name but this wouldn't last too long if mum went into a care home tbh.

The financial advisor said as soon as mum's investments fall to below the £23,250 threshold the LA will step in and pay (obviously that will be after a full assessment).

Mum and dad own their own home and I know the LA can not force any sale of the house whilst dad is alive and resisding there but I was under the belief that if dad were to die or mum ran up a care bill which exceeded the amount she has in investments then the LA can take the remainding figure from the sale of the house (after dad passes away or if he were to die whilst mum is still in care). The financial advisor says this would not happen.

I am a bit confused as I hear constant stories of people in care homes having to sell their homes to pay for the fees or a large chunk taken out from the sale of a house once the remaining partner passes away and leaves the house empty.

Does anyone have any experience of this sort of issue?

Should also add that my dad's side of things are all in trusts, this was set up by their solicitor.

Moving assets into fathers name- isn’t that regarded as deprivation of assets?

And you wouldn't ever do that of course.

From reading all your posts @Thebluespoon , I understand your position.

I honestly would not add to your heavy workload by fretting about the financials.

It is very unlikely your mother would get CHC, by all means enquire but don't expend too much energy on it.

What the LA do or don't do some time in the future really doesn't matter. Again, ask AgeUK, you should get a quick answer, but don't expend your energy on it. Her care will be paid one way or the other and that is what matters.

Focus on getting your mother the right care. I found my mother's care home from carehome.co.uk (checked out the reviews and facilities, phoned them, went to visit). Don't be distracted by all sorts of nonsense your mother won't use like cinema rooms and hair salons which will add to the £££. What she needs is good care.

https://www.carehome.co.uk/

(By the way there is not really any such thing as a council funded home any more, they have all closed. There is only one in our entire county, so the LA is limited in where they can move a resident. If you choose somewhere reasonably priced - no cinema rooms! - they are likely to leave your mother there as they have few choices. The LA continued to fund my mother in her moderately priced home.)

My mum’s mum had early onset dementia and her dad refused to put her in a home. He had a heart attack from the stress of looking after her. When my gran was told he had died, she didn’t know who he was.
My mum has always said ‘put me in a home’ and I say the same to my DD.

Was it only yesterday that there was a thread about disabled people claiming PIP being workshy scroungers? Spending my taxes seems to be ok if the money goes to the well off but not if the poor benefit.

Wouldn’t your dad willingly and morally wish to pay for his wife’s care if he has considerable assets?

What if he spends all his assets on his wife's care then needs care himself?

Oddly enough no, no one in my family is wealthy enough to have financial advisors and trusts, I pay my taxes via PAYE and in the usual way. Like the vast majority of people.

jeez louise OP, do try to ignore the insensitive twerps putting in their two penneth

I agree with the person upthread who said try to not to worry about future financials.

if you've decided that it's time for your mum to go into residential care and she can self fund for now, I'd concentrate on getting her into the best home you can find.

Your Dad can't be forced to sell his home to fund her care, so while he's alive he will always have somewhere to live which is the key point.

I know how stressful this is, do try to take care of yourself

This is what I keep telling my dad and we certainly don't want to get her settled into a nice home only to find the LA will move mum once she reaches the threshold of £23,250.

Thank you catofglory

Yes, that's the very reason the have separate assets. They were advised to do this should dad also need care sometime in the future.

From personal experience I would say it depends partly on whether your mum qualifies for her fees being paid because she needs continuous nursing care and qualifies for CHC funding also known as
NHS Continuing Healthcare.

CHC is a package of care for adults with significant, ongoing, and complex health needs that is arranged and fully funded by the NHS.

To receive CHC, individuals must undergo an assessment by their local Integrated Care Board to determine if they have a "primary health need". This assessment would be arranged via your mum’s Social Worker.

Funding is then free and covers care costs in various settings, such as a care home or the individual's own home, and is different/separate from local authority funding, which involves means-testing.

It’s pretty difficult to qualify for CHC - my mum did qualify but she was unable to walk having had a severe stroke so she required 24 hour care with nurses (ie not just supervision but medical care that couldn’t be provided by care home staff alone).

Other than qualifying for CHC the local authority would look to fund any shortfall in fees via the sale of your parents’ property if your dad passes away first.

It’s likely that your parents are joint tenants on their property but you could ask your solicitor (it states this on the deeds to their property). Most jointly purchased property will be joint tenants unless the parties request tenants in common.

That’s my understanding having been through similar circumstances a few years ago.

I totally empathise with your situation and hope that everything goes smoothly if and when your mum enters the care home x

Yes, a new financial assessment is required. IIRC we had 8 weeks grace after DM died, then charges were made after that date.

I was wondering that too.
Surely, as a married couple, any investments made by either the mum or dad would be used to pay for care?

Also came in to say, find her a nice home now, self fund, worry about the "what ifs" later. It really doesn't matter unless you want the LA to take responsibility for her immediately.

We had a similar situation, with both eventually going into the same home, all self funded, from savings and investments. They had the money, they chose where to go. They tried a live in carer for a while, but that was very stressful, and they never stayed long. Step Dad moved three times before they found a care home they could both be in together. Self funding gives you complete choice and flexibilty. In the end they both died together, on the same day, from COVID.

We were actually in the process of selling their house as funds were running low. They were widows/divorcees so each had a half share in the house.

Apologies OP, I haven’t rtft but have some experience having had parents in LA funded care.

The LA cannot take into account your DM’s home while your DF (or anyone over 60
I believe) lives there. If he dies, and she inherits his share of the house, then yes, it would become part of her annual assessment. She wouldn’t have to back pay, because the years before his death qualified her for LA funding. But the value of the asset would put her above the threshold from then on.

The caveat is the trust that her solicitor arranged. If your DF’s share is in trust to his children, let’s say, then they MIGHT be able to say that she has a half share in a property which they could take into account. However logic would say that they can’t force the sale of a shared property and therefore wouldn’t be able to put a charge on it.

My experience of LA assessments is that they are pretty crude and broad brush. I was organised and honest in my declarations but was quite surprised at how much was taken at face value.

Just an edit to my post, Step Dad COULD have applied for LA/NHS funding, as he had cancer, heart disease and dementia and needed nursing care, but we didn't apply, as he had funds.

If they have a great deal of equity then personally I would think if it’s fairer and better for her for your father to actually draw down a fixed sum via equity release ( types vary including ones you still pay the interest on) and actually have a care home that suits her needs and you feel comfortable about , rather than any old place that the LA ‘might’ put her in if not able to self fund. However might be worth checking out places you like and then using equity release to ‘top up’ between the cost and what LA might contribute once her own funds run out

Thank you. We are going to start viewing care homes next month so hopefully we can find the perfect one for her.

Thank you heybabeyourhairsalright

The council will do a financial assessment when the time comes and yes the house will be included.

This!
Amazing how many people are keen to avoid paying their own way! Why should struggling young tax payers pay for care that the elderly have means to pay for themselves!!!

In our council in Wales that would be considered deliberate deprivation because your mother had the diagnosis before this was set up. Our council would fight it. However,, I've zilch ideas what happens in England or Scotland.

I know you will feel sad, but It will also be a big weight off your shoulders when she moves

suddenly all those logistical tasks you’ve been doing like filling prescriptions, organising personal care etc will all be taken care of. You will get some bandwidth back and a bit of breathing space. Your mum would not want you to be in the stressed place you describe

In Scotland, LA's go back 7 years for a financial assessment. Investments etc. prior to then will not be taken into account, however interest from anything will be counted. I don't know about other areas, but you should find out.