How do I deal with my father's misery and his horrible words?

[BobButtonsismycat]

I am really not sure how much more I can take at the moment in time.

My parents are in their early 80's. Mum was diagnosed with Alzheimer's in 2018. I have helped my father with mum (she has several other health problems including breast cancer) since lockdown. Over the years I ended up taking on more and more 'chores' from them and nearly had a breakdown a couple of years ago as I was struggling to take on their work, my work and my home life. I started a thread back then and was advised to scale back. I did this but still visit them 4-5 times a week.

My father did not like me doing this. He has always been someone who will speak his mind with a 'Please or offend' attitude. Over the years he has fallen out with most of his friends (and neighbours). He can say some very scathing and unnecessary things and it's always under the guise of 'Oh, I was just having a laugh with you, you can never take a joke these days' - believe me, some of the things he says are down right nasty and personal and he just can not seem to help himself. He has always been this way and I used to think he was just a jokey kind of guy but I now realise as I have aged that it's not kind or jokey at all, it is always at the expense of the other person. I am still not sure if he does this intentionally or genuinely believes he is being funny. Sadly, I think it may be the former as he usually has a smirk on his face when he delivers such words.

But things were bumping along ok. Mum was ok, she would go to a day centre twice a week which would give dad time to himself, which he needed. Mum had a lovely carer in every morning to hep shower and dress her and between my sister and I we would pop in and check on them and help with whatever needs to be done. It was hard work but we got on ok (ish).

But that all changed 8 weeks ago. Mum fell in the garden, she split her forehead open, broke bones in her hand, dislocated her knee and fractured her neck. She ended up staying in hospital for over 3 weeks. This has been very detrimental to her dementia which very much worsened whilst there. They were allowing mum to soil the bed and wouldn't help her to the commode or toilet. She went into hospital fully continent and is now double incontinent.

She returned home and we honestly though she would die, she was unable to talk, was bed bound and seemed to be giving up but between my sister and I we have managed to find a team of wonderful carers and mum now gets out of bed every day. She is doing so much better although still sadly double incontinent, I doubt this will ever change. Mum is and always has been a very gentle, kind and happy person, she has never said a bad or nasty word during her disease, she has always been such a lovely mother to my sister and I. My mum is not the main source of my stress, never has been.

My dad however, is simply getting more and more bitter, depressed and nasty. I totally understand hence the reason I do so much for him. Yet he does not appear to appreciate it and seems hell bent on making everyone else's life a misery too. He refuses to go to the GP for help, I have spoken to our GP and she says she can help him but obviously I can not make him do this, only advice and he gets angry at me for even suggesting it. He will not speak to a dementia nurse for help/advice either (I speak to them regularly and find them so helpful and understanding). He will constantly say his life is over and no-one else has this kind of bad luck etc. He is 84, he has had a great life doing everything he ever wanted, I only wish I had the life he has lead up till now. He travelled, ate out, was out golfing 3 times a week, riding his motorbike whenever he wanted, saw friends at the weekends and has lots of money. He never once had to care for a parent, both his parents died quickly from old age. He (and my mum) have lived a golden and privileged life. I do feel resentful that he will not reflect on this and seems hellbent on making mine and my sisters life a misery. It feels as though he may as well admit and say 'My ship is going down and I am taking you all down with me'!

I secretly hate going to see them now, he moans about all his neighbours to the point he is obsessed with them, he never has anything nice to say about anyone and will say some very hurtful things. He tells my 19 year old son he is fat and now he won't go visit anymore, dad then he moans that his grandson never sees him (my two dc are his only gc).

I am off this week as my dh has a week of annual leave, he works hard in a very physical job and hasn't had much time off this year. My dad was fully aware we are of this week, I told him and my sister well in advanced and pre-warned them I probably won't be round so much but would pop in whenever I can and his reply was (in a very sarcastic voice) 'Yeah, you really need time off don't you cause you are such a hard worker (with an eyeroll)'. I simply came back with 'Well, yes we do deserve a few days off as we are both frazzled and you know that but you just can not help youself can you dad, you just HAVE to come out with something nasty every time'. He never replied and I never gave him time to reply as I said my goodbyes and left. This was Monday and I haven't seen or spoke to him since (which is unusual for me as I ring if I can't ever get to pop by).

On reflection I am feeling bad for not just walking away and I probably should have kept my mouth shut but I was feeling particulalry unwell on Monday due to my health issues. and I can only take so much, we all have a breaking point. My sister (who will always defend my father as they are very much alike) says I should have just sucked it up and not retaliated but I don't see why I should take constant shit from him when all I am trying to do is help and to try to make his life easier.

How can I deal with this moving forward? Mum will need to go into a care home sooner rather than later there is no dount about that, it is obvious dad can not and does not want to live this way anymore. I know putting mum into a care home will ease a lot of stress for us all but he is moaning constantly how much the private carers coming in 3 times a day is costing him and he will moan even more with the care home fees. My parents will not qualify for any help with care home fees and it will cost an absolute fortune sadly.

But even with mum in care, one of this will stop his bitterness and awfully sharp tongue. I have been reflecting a lot recently over him and am coming to a realisation that he may be quite narcissistic? He does appear to have many of the traits and old age and caring for my poor mum has brought this all to a head.

How do I deal with him moving on without falling out with him? I honestly feel as though I want to run away from it all at times.

I don't think you said anything wrong. Because he is your father and an older person, doesn't mean that he can say cruel and unkind things to you and your family. He will feel bad because he sees life changing in front of him, and really can't do anything about it. You have your life and family and you can only do so much. It seems that you might be on the edge of burning out. Protect yourself, even it involves having a straight talk with your Dad, despite what you sister thinks. He needs boundaries. Hope you feel better soon

Your mum needs to be in a place she can be cared for properly in her last days and you can then take a massive step back from caring for your dad. Time to protect your MH.

I’m sorry to hear about your Mum’s declining health. Having read your other threads I think the only thing you’ve done wrong it not saying some thing sooner. Get your Mum settled into a good care home and get yourself some counselling to find out why you’ve let his man abuse you and help you set some boundaries then make sure you tell him that you won’t be accepting it in future and every time he says something unkind leave.

Firstly, your mum needs to go into care sooner rather than later. There's really no question of that. I should ride out your Dad's nastiness until that priority is accomplished. Afterwards, tell him that you will cease contact with him if he persists. Tell him calmly but firmly that you will no longer tolerate his unpleasantness, sarcasm, selfishness or verbal abuse of your son. If he wants to see you and receive the benefit of your help, then he stops. Otherwise, he's on his own. I told my mother something similar when she was nearly 80 (although the circumstances were very different). I'd never spoken to her like that before and she was shaken to the core. She knew I meant it. She stopped.

Thank you for your replies.

I am heading towards breakdown, I can feel it physically and mentally.

I need to form some strategy to cope with the future.

My sister has just texted me to say she saw dad yesterday and says HE was very upset because of what was said! He loves to twist things and make himself the victim, he does this every sodding time and now my sister is blaming me when all I did was to remind him dh and I were out and about this week and I couldn't say which days I'd pop by and dad cane back with his nasty reply. How does that make me the bad guy?

I think you need to work on settling your mum into a decent care home, where you can go and visit.

You need to give your dad boundaries like a PP has said. If he wants the benefit of your help, he needs to be polite and respectful. If he cant do that, he’s on his own.

If your sister is on his side and thinks he can treat you however he feels, and be rude and abusive about your children etc, leave her to it. Your father can be her responsibility if she’s willing to accept his behaviour.

Life’s too short to knock yourself out for people who dont deserve it.

Just to add, I haven’t read your other threads, but relationship changes that occur when cruel parents start needing help are difficult to navigate, without losing yourself amongst it all. I think counselling for you is an important part of all of this:

I have read your previous threads too. I’m sorry your mum is so unwell now.

Your Dad is a nasty person. Always has been. But you are conditioned to accepting it. Everyone has tiptoed around him in the house as you grew up I’m sure.

You don’t have to take the nastiness. Keep pulling him up on it. Tell your sister you have had enough of him making nasty comments all the time and won’t put up with it.

I remember your previous threads where you were in your knees trying to help with your mum and he wouldn’t spend anything in her care. He is mean and nasty. It doesn’t matter why. It’s who he is. But you don’t have to take it.

it will not be easy at first but keep doing what you did. Pull him up on it and walk out. Each and every time. He will moan. He will make himself out to the be victim. But so what? what can he actually do? He needs you way more than you need him. Remember that.

@BobButtonsismycat I can really sympathise with you here. I am in a very similar situation - down to my mum having a fall and being hospitalised and my dad always having been a difficult character.

I have found that it's helped me to leverage the 'power' I have over my dad. He needs me to help him and, if he's being difficult, I remind him of that. I used to have to do it often but over time my reminding him who is the one helping him and my mum out had reduced and he actually acknowledges that now and apologises if he's momentarily out of order. He is a man who has never apologised for or to anyone in his life.

I know it's hard to do the first few times but if he's taking you for granted remind him that you're important and are kindly taking time out of your busy life to help him, but you can go home now if he likes. I'd also tell him that when you come to visit you can't listen to his negativity and meanness about his neighbours. He is mired in his negativity and he's feeling sorry for himself but none of this is your fault.

If he's sarky to you (about needing the holiday for example) then meet his words with an equal comment. He still sees you as a child where he has the power, but the power dynamic is not like that anymore. He's the one in need.

My dad has listened, and I know I might be lucky in this, but honestly the liberation of telling him the consequences of his actions - and reminding him that gratitude costs nothing will help you, in my experience.

I feel for you as it's a horribly wearing situation

it sounds like your Dad is struggling to come to terms with his new circumstances. He sounds angry with life and therefore anyone who irritates him. He’s not going to rational or logical but rather spoiling for fight so he can someone to shout at to give him temporary relief

There is no way to fix this for him. And many people simply don’t cope with this stage of life. it’s a final challenge for all of us - how do we stay hopeful/ postive in the face of great loss.

No doubt you will be torn by doing what you feel is right and protecting yourself. I just don’t think there is an easy/right answer. It’s difficult for all concerned. It may have been the right thing for you to be more honest and have a bit of space to regroup.

Maybe with you not there, your sister will be more of his anger? Either way she will also have to come to her own way if dealing with this. And her immediate reaction may not be what she thinks over time.

You sound upset by what has happened to your mum through her hospital stay. The way she has got worse. My mum definitely got worse after falls/hospital stays. It’s hard to watch this happen and worry about what’s going to happen in the long run.

I really sympathise. This is very similar to the situation I’m going through with an elderly relative at the moment, and I am also completely at the end of my tether. I am going to buck the trend on here and risk getting flamed, but will you get an inheritance eventually, and do you need it? If there’s possible inheritance involved, it’s easier (imo) to keep reminding yourself of that and having the drive to remain tolerant.

It sound really tough! And miserable !

i guess your Dad is struggling to come to terms with his new circumstances. He sounds angry with life and therefore anyone who irritates him. He’s not going to rational or logical but rather spoiling for fight so he can someone to shout at to give him temporary relief

There is no way to fix this for him. And many people simply don’t cope with this stage of life. it’s a final challenge for all of us - how do we stay hopeful/ postive in the face of great loss.

No doubt you will be torn by doing what you feel is right and protecting yourself. I just don’t think there is an easy/right answer. It’s difficult for all concerned. It may have been the right thing for you to be more honest and have a bit of space to regroup. You are not a punch bag.

Maybe with you not there, your sister will get more of his anger? Either way she will also have to find her own way of dealing with this. And her immediate reaction may not be what she thinks over time.

You sound upset by what has happened to your mum through her hospital stay. The way she has got worse. My mum definitely got worse after falls/hospital stays. It’s hard to watch this happen and worry about what’s going to happen in the long run.

I think you should focus on getting your mother into a decent care home. It doesn't sound as if your father is unwell, he's taking out his frustration and anger on you. Once your mother is settled, you can take a step back from your father and sister.

I look at things from a death perspective. Were that person to die, how would I feel about my dealings with them? That usually tells me where to draw the line. If I could live with it when they're gone, then that's enough for me. I know it sounds hard, but caring for an elderly parent will consume you unless you protect yourself.

Yikes, poor you, that sounds shit all round. Your mum needs a home, and your dad needs a firm talking to - what you said was spot on and probably not strong enough. You need to do more of that, and your sister can do one if she takes his side. You need to take a step back for your own health’s sake op. No way would I take that shit from my dad or my sister when I am doing so much, to my own detriment.

Good for you retaliating. I bet he got quite the shock. He's used to saying as he pleases and walking all over you. It's about time you got nasty back at him and let him know his bitterness towards you will not be tolerated. Maybe start telling him that his days are numbered and ask if he wants to be miserable for the little years he has left! I can see your predicament as you can't possibly leave your lovely Mum, she has shown you such kindness throughout your life and you want to give it back to her. Perhaps when she (sadly ) does go into a care home cut contact with your father. I would start to let him know this plan right now. You are only there for your dm and you will not do the same for him in the future.

I'd give him a dose of his own medicine.
"Sorry I upset you so much dad. I've had a big think and you seem so miserable and unhappy whenever we are together that it is best we do not see each other now, for your sake. I am very sad about it but want you to spend your time with people who make you happy"
Then ignore him for 2 weeks and see your mum only. He's a manipulative selfish old man, no more, no less.

OP, your father sounds difficult, but he is probably more difficult at the moment because he is frightened. He sees a wife he has been with for most of his life reduced to needing care, and he is probably only too aware that it can’t be long before she will need to go to a home and he will be left on his own. The fact that he has had a good life counts for nothing, as from his point of view, that is all in the past and he has to live in the present. Don’t let him rile you by saying unpleasant things - he must know that from being the one in control, he’s now dependent on you, so tell him straight up, DF, if you are unpleasant to me, or if you belittle me or my children, then we simply won’t come round any more. Next time he moans that your son won’t go round, ask him why he would expect him to do so when he was so unpleasant to him. He is being selfish, but he must know that he needs you more than you need him, although he is of a generation that took it for granted that it’s a daughter’s “duty” to look after elderly parents. If you go round and he upsets you, then tell him, “Dad, you’ve upset me by being so rude and unkind, so I’m afraid I shall have to leave” - and go. He’ll soon get the message. You can explain to your sister what you’re doing, too - I’d have thought she would understand your point of view, as no doubt he is rude to her, too. Enjoy your week off - and when your DM is in a home, take a few days for yourself and your DH and go away somewhere. Everyone needs to recharge their batteries, and your DF will have to learn that if he wants to see his family, it behoves him to be pleasant.

Thank you. I am finding as I grow older and am now struggling with the pain and discomfort from my health issues I just can not tolerate any of his behaviour these days.
I am waiting for a hysterectomy in the hope it will ease some of my health issues, it means I will be out of action for at least a month. I am even feeling bloody guilty about that. Maybe I have been conditioned to feel that way and that's why I have never stood up for myself in the past and now that I am it's shocking my father and my sister.

I simply don't want to accept the bad behaviour anymore.

Thank you, I will and am starting to try and be a little more assertive towards him.

I really don't like how he is and the things he says to me or about me, I can't help but feel such resentment for that. Hopefully the more assertive I become the easier it will get, as you say. Fingers crossed.

You need to put yourself first here, or you won't be fit to support anyone in any way.
Well done for speaking up, do more of that. You can't make your father happy, and you can't make him a nicer person, but you can decide what you will and won't put up with.

I doubt I will receive any inheritance, especially as mum will need to go into a care home soon. Tbh, I used to say to myself that if I did eventually receive a little bit of something then I could almost see that as 'compensation' for the last few crappy years which have taken it's toll on me but now I am questioning if any amount of money is worth losing my mental and physical health over. I really don't think it is and I no longer give any potential inheritance a thought. I am starting to put myself first for once before it's too late and my health issues become irreversible.

I don't think he did get too much of a shock though, going by the text my sister has sent me today it seems he has yet again twisted it round to make himself look like the victim as she says he was very 'upset' because of what I said to him. I have no idea why he would be so upset seeing the words came from his mouth and I simply stood up for myself.

It's exactly as you say, I do all of this for my mum, she has been the best and kindest mum and even though she can't string much of a sentence these days she always knows who I am and was even asking the carers where I was the other day. Every now and then she tells dad to piss off! I have never heard her say anything like that to him pre-dementia. It could of course simply be the dementia talking but she never swears or says anything horrible to me so maybe that speaks volumes? I often wonder now what kind of husband he really has been to her?

OP, you did nothing wrong talking back to him like that. I wonder why we feel people who make us creep on eggshells must never have to tolerate the kind of hurt they inflict on others. i think it is important that they do.

Next time he starts saying 'Poor me' say very clearly what you said here: Dad you had a golden life until recently - golf, motorbike, dining out. You never had the stress and exhaustion of caring for elderly parents. Now you have partial responsibility caring for mum. As do DSib and I. We have put carers in place who are doing a great job and we help more than we can, as we have jobs and families of our own. Show some appreciation and understanding that we are fitting this in to our very busy lives. If it is getting you down, discuss it with the GP. I am sympathetic to you - this is not the life you are used to. But that doesn't give you an excuse to attack me verbally whenever I am helping you. If you carry on, I will just step away.

that's not a threat, that is you being assertive and setting absolutely reasonable boundaries.

My Dad (87) is similar, though not all the time. He was awful during my late SM’s final illness and now, when he’s having a bad day or not feeling well, he’ll start up with the “everyone’s luckier than me” spiel and blame me for all sorts of things. He also rewrites history and says that I’ve been unkind in the past, made his life harder, etc.

It’s frustration at his situation that triggers this (he’s elderly, widowed, with multiple health problems). It sounds as if your Dad is reacting to your Mum’s ill health in a similar way. In my case, I’ve decided to let it wash over me as he won’t be around for much longer and he can be lovely when he’s in a better mood. I have told him to stop a couple of times when he’s been particularly nasty and it did pull him up.

You may not feel that same way though so I agree with PP’s that you should tell him to stop and see less of him if it’s too much. Luckily your sister is also there to help out- let her do it if he keeps being horrible to you. 💐

I am waiting for a hysterectomy in the hope it will ease some of my health issues, it means I will be out of action for at least a month. I am even feeling bloody guilty about that. Maybe I have been conditioned to feel that way and that's why I have never stood up for myself in the past and now that I am it's shocking my father and my sister.

I simply don't want to accept the bad behaviour anymore.

You no longer want to accept your 'D'F's unacceptable, bullying behaviour. Hoorah! I learned long ago, during a childhood dominated by a bully, that the best way to treat them is to stand up to them. If you don't, they know you're weak and they just keeping coming after you again and again. So, painful though it is, you have to stand your ground.

As for your hysterectomy, I think it might be two blessings in one, because you will simply NOT BE ABLE to be at your DPs beck and call during your recovery period. You will be forced to step back, disengage and focus on your own health - and I think that will do you and this situation a world of good. You're burning yourself out atm. Something has to change.