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Elderly parents
Original poster

Carers for my elderly terminal parent.

29 replies

IamtheDevilsAvocado · 13/05/2025 07:53

Im close to complete breakdown... Doing 15 hour days with a very difficult, oppositional father. My own health is hanging by a thread. Social care locally is on its knees.

I really can't do personal care for him - we have a local person who comes in daily to help him shower /dress.

Dad (via me) pays her monthly by transfer.

A friend has worried me, saying I have 'employed' her... I thought I've been careful to avoid this.. I don't have the headspace to become an employer.

We pay above market rate(but less than agency rate) , and being clear it's a self employed role. (the woman appears to be paying tax etc) she also has her own indemnity insurance.

Could any legal /HR people advise??

OP posts:
librathroughandthrough · 13/05/2025 07:56

Well surely if she is SE she will have her own UTR and be invoicing you?

librathroughandthrough · 13/05/2025 07:56

Why can’t your dad just transfer her wages directly to her?

RareGoalsVerge · 13/05/2025 07:56

To be self employed, someone has to have the right to choose when to do the work, how to do the work, and have the right to subcontract the work to someone else if they aren't available. very much doubt that this carer meets these requirements. This is why most carers are employed via agencies.

MissCharlotteLutterell · 13/05/2025 08:01

RareGoalsVerge · 13/05/2025 07:56

To be self employed, someone has to have the right to choose when to do the work, how to do the work, and have the right to subcontract the work to someone else if they aren't available. very much doubt that this carer meets these requirements. This is why most carers are employed via agencies.

You're being even stricter than HMRC here and not at all helpful.

If the carer has lots of clients (or could do) and can set their own hours and days, plus has control of their business, those are all factors to take into account. It's just not true to imply that no carer can ever be self-employed and you are deliberately upsetting someone in a stressed state.

Original poster
IamtheDevilsAvocado · 13/05/2025 08:30

librathroughandthrough · 13/05/2025 07:56

Why can’t your dad just transfer her wages directly to her?

Because he is unable to manage his finances... I run his finances

OP posts:
librathroughandthrough · 13/05/2025 08:31

IamtheDevilsAvocado · 13/05/2025 08:30

Because he is unable to manage his finances... I run his finances

Show quote history

But he transfers money to you to pay her?

Original poster
IamtheDevilsAvocado · 13/05/2025 08:33

RareGoalsVerge · 13/05/2025 07:56

To be self employed, someone has to have the right to choose when to do the work, how to do the work, and have the right to subcontract the work to someone else if they aren't available. very much doubt that this carer meets these requirements. This is why most carers are employed via agencies.

It was impossible to continue via the three agencies we tried... The cost was extraordinary, many of the carers were not good and they were often several hours late... Whicb stressed my dad out massively... And also useless when I'm trying to enable his nornal going to classes etc

OP posts:
librathroughandthrough · 13/05/2025 08:33

However he gives the money to you to give to carer just cut you out and give straight to carer

Original poster
IamtheDevilsAvocado · 13/05/2025 08:34

librathroughandthrough · 13/05/2025 08:31

But he transfers money to you to pay her?

Show quote history

No as i said, I run his finances from his account!

OP posts:
librathroughandthrough · 13/05/2025 08:34

If you run his finances just pay her directly from his account then?

countrygirl99 · 13/05/2025 14:15

librathroughandthrough · 13/05/2025 08:34

If you run his finances just pay her directly from his account then?

I suspect that's what the OP is doing but has phrased badly.

ThisIsMyYearToFindMyself · 13/05/2025 14:21

Im close to complete breakdown... Doing 15 hour days with a very difficult, oppositional father. My own health is hanging by a thread. Social care locally is on its knees.

When you say social care is on its knees, what do you mean? If a carer comes once a day, how is he toiletting? You don’t do personal care and the career comes once a day. What about the rest of the time?

What are you doing for 15 hours per day? I’m not asking in a sarky way, I’m just trying to get an idea of how he is. You say he goes to classes?

Original poster
IamtheDevilsAvocado · 13/05/2025 17:28

ThisIsMyYearToFindMyself · 13/05/2025 14:21

Im close to complete breakdown... Doing 15 hour days with a very difficult, oppositional father. My own health is hanging by a thread. Social care locally is on its knees.

When you say social care is on its knees, what do you mean? If a carer comes once a day, how is he toiletting? You don’t do personal care and the career comes once a day. What about the rest of the time?

What are you doing for 15 hours per day? I’m not asking in a sarky way, I’m just trying to get an idea of how he is. You say he goes to classes?

Edited

On its knees...

Well they can't recruit carers. There are huge issues with bed blocking as there are few carers. The morning carer helps him shower.

My 15 hour days... They often start in middle of night as my father is wandering-3am this morning . He often switches his alarm off.
Sometimes helping him to loo through the night.
Three meals a day plus snacks, preparing and doing clear up.. He makes a LOT of mess.
He half toilets himself if he remembers ... He needs continual reminding.

He can no longer sequence basjc tasks.

He often has major accidents. The other day I had to clean the entire bathroom as there was poo on him, the floor/walls /sink /shower and walls.
His needs are asynchronous... .

Liaising with GP... Cos if his needs I'm in very regular contact.

Doing all his admin which is massive task as it was left in such a mess by him.

I have to physically take him to his groups, he can't get there independently... I can't leave him as he's likely to fall off chairs....

He can no longer change the TV channel or use the phone.

Al of this I manage solo.
Etc etc....

OP posts:
countrygirl99 · 13/05/2025 18:23

TBH sounds like a care home would be best

Original poster
IamtheDevilsAvocado · 13/05/2025 19:12

countrygirl99 · 13/05/2025 18:23

TBH sounds like a care home would be best

Indeed it would... He refuses.

I've said I can't continue much longer... And I'd rather plan his admission than for it to be an emergency....
He believes I don't have any needs to look after myself...

OP posts:
librathroughandthrough · 13/05/2025 19:20

If he was in sound mind what would he think of your current set up? He may lack insight so cannot make an informed choice about his care needs. You may need to advocate for what’s best as opposed to what he wants.

countrygirl99 · 13/05/2025 19:30

In that case you need to step back and let a crisis happen. It's that or you crash and the crisis happens anyway.

financialmuddle · 13/05/2025 19:35

Have you had a carer's assessment form social services? Not sure how quickly they can happen atm.

Fushia123 · 13/05/2025 19:35

Do you have Legal Power of Attorney for your dad? It sounds as though he now needs to pay for a lot more care in order to stay at home. We have an agency helping my mum at bedtime. They are very reliable and have 3 carers that come in rotation. It’s a franchise so there maybe a branch near you.

NeedForSpeed · 13/05/2025 19:38

You need to call adult social care and have them in for an assessment. You do NOT have to enable the hours you're doing at all. Time to get some support for you all.

If both your parents are terminally ill, could you speak to a relevant charity ie Macmillan for cancer related needs?

Original poster
IamtheDevilsAvocado · 13/05/2025 22:53

financialmuddle · 13/05/2025 19:35

Have you had a carer's assessment form social services? Not sure how quickly they can happen atm.

Yes.
My local council awarded me 1.5 hr respite weekly.

OP posts:
Original poster
IamtheDevilsAvocado · 13/05/2025 22:54

Yes.. Even though he's end of life... He's not end of life 'enough' for the tiny hospice in this area.

Macmillan did an assessment a while back.

OP posts:
Original poster
IamtheDevilsAvocado · 13/05/2025 22:58

Fushia123 · 13/05/2025 19:35

Do you have Legal Power of Attorney for your dad? It sounds as though he now needs to pay for a lot more care in order to stay at home. We have an agency helping my mum at bedtime. They are very reliable and have 3 carers that come in rotation. It’s a franchise so there maybe a branch near you.

Yes have had LPA for both welfare and finance for years.

I've put more care in... But all that happens is he sends them away and says' my daughter will do it.'..
We then have a stand off.... He then has a meltdown...

This has happened maby times.

It gets expensive when carers arrive and he sends them away..

Or theh arrive and it is after the emergency and I've had to intervene...

So much of his behavior is personality disorder. (he's deffo very similar to vulnerable narcissist criteria..
)
He's always had meltdowns... Since I was a toddler...

OP posts:
Original poster
IamtheDevilsAvocado · 13/05/2025 22:59

Fushia123 · 13/05/2025 19:35

Do you have Legal Power of Attorney for your dad? It sounds as though he now needs to pay for a lot more care in order to stay at home. We have an agency helping my mum at bedtime. They are very reliable and have 3 carers that come in rotation. It’s a franchise so there maybe a branch near you.

Which franchise is it??

OP posts:
ThisIsMyYearToFindMyself · 14/05/2025 09:48

But all that happens is he sends them away and says' my daughter will do it.'..
We then have a stand off.... He then has a meltdown...
This has happened maby times.
It gets expensive when carers arrive and he sends them away..

It sounds really harsh, but @countrygirl99 is right. You need to let the crisis happen, you need to let things get bad and you need to be firm that you cannot do this.

He lives with you I think? How about saying it’s not working and he has to leave?

What about your work? Do you work?