I can’t do this anymore...

[User100000000000]

I just need to rant because I'm so fucking close to disappearing and I have zero friends, my husband is dead and my DC is only 9. Plus I have to attend her harvest festival this afternoon with a big smile on my face whilst fantasising about driving off a local cliff...*

Since my Dad died 15 years ago, my Mum has changed quite drastically. I'm pretty certain she doesn't have Dementia as I think i'm fairly familiar with all the different types, their early signs and different levels of progression etc.
I think it's just personality shifts as her life no longer has to be centred around my quite demanding Dad, anymore. So I think her true personality has appeared and it's like there's two of her!!!

She's 80 next week but you'd mostly never know it. The nice version of her is (mostly) awesome, laid back, down to earth (bloody funny) and in many ways, much more modernistic than I! In fact I think I can be very old fashioned in not just my tastes, but my thinking also at times.

However the nasty version of my Mum is VILE. It's not that she just randomly hurls abuse, it's that she becomes utterly incapable of seeing any thing or any point, from anybody else's point of view. If something is deemed as a criticism of her regardless of it being constructive or otherwise, she throws a massive tantrum, will not be corrected if she's misunderstood something and will scream and, usually, twist the narrative to reach martyrdom.

She will not ever allow anybody to finish any sentence (that's across the board with each version of her) and as this is my pet hate, you can see how we'd clash and oh boy, do we clash.

Today's latest episode began by me asking for rough ideas for gifts for her 80th birthday from my DD. I've never ever needed to ask for ideas from her as I {forgive me the self-compliment) am usually good at remembering what people like - even those not close. But DD wants to get her something Grandma really wants.

Well, today we seemingly have the meaner version of her so as you can imagine, it didn't go well. It's partly my fault that it escalated as I made a silly quip about the dead flowers she got me for my milestone birthday last month (I think I said something like "no dead flowers then?!" Fully expecting her to laugh as nice-Mum would've done). Wellllllllllll no. She didn't laugh. I got every previous gift I've supposedly 'disliked' brought up - none of them I disliked nor said anything of the kind. Then right on cue we got another round of the infamous 'Dress Gate' 🤦🏻‍♀️
5 years ago at Christmas, she bought my then 4yr old a dress in age 4-5. Loved it, but sadly she was in 6-7 by that point and it couldn't be squeezed on. I had two choices, either tell my usually very understanding mum, get the receipt and swap it, or put in charity bag and quietly buy the next size up myself. Stupidly I went with the former. Thinking that way the dress is still is a gift from Grandma. Got the receipt & swapped it. Job done.

Wrong. Every birthday, Christmas since when I'm asked what DD might like and in my list of suggestions when I mention clothes, I get this huuuuuge melodrama recited, about how "But whenever I buy her any clothes it's always wrong! I bought her that dress but nooo, it wasn't good enough, was it?" So I have to point out that the size was wrong so I swapped it for another identical one two sizes bigger? What else should I have done? I could either get rid of it or swap it? "But it was age 4-5 and she was 4?" Yes but at the time she was in age 6-7 clothes, so I gratefully & politely asked to swap it for a bigger size. What's the big deal? "But I didn't intentionally get the wrong size!" I know that! I never said you did? "I should've known you wouldn't like it! I'm never buying her clothes ever again!!!!!" I loved it! So did (DD). That's why I swapped it. "We'll never again......." Ad infinitum. Every. Single. Birthday & Christmas.
There's no other way of wording any of my responses either each time either, she still kicks off about how I rude of me it was to swap the size of that bloody dress.

This is just one of thousands of examples. It's several times a week that the nasty version of her appears. She twists my words like a helter skelter in order to play the victim, as soon as she detects that I'm about to make a valid point against her. "But I'm just sat here having a cup of tea and now I'm in the wrong" is a particular favourite, said right after I've (calmly) responded to something vitriolic that she's just said to me, to give an example.

I know you're probably wondering why on earth I don't go NC with her. Trouble is, my DD has not only a very strong bond with her, but she's quite literally the only other family she has besides me, as unbelievable as it may sound. Sadly it's true (and extremely sad and frankly worrying but that's another thread).

If I was reading this I'd probably be thinking: "but you can’t have her treating your DD like how she treats you" however the thing is, she's completely different with my DD! Completely different. DD can do or say no wrong whatsoever, thankfully.

Plus there's nobody else to do anything for her as my older sibling is utterly useless and refuses to do anything for anyone.
That's another issue tbh. I'm allllways doing jobs in her house which outweighs the capabilities of my disability but I do it because I know if I don't, she'll try and end up bloody chopping a limb off or something. I don't mind doing {most of} these things, I really don't and she is usually grateful. But the total lack of compassion (also across the board, even when in nice mode) alongside the ice cold nastiness of her nasty mode, just makes me sometimes resentful and angry inside. And having no friend/s to talk to about that anger & resentment once it's built up, is tearing me apart.

*The genuinely suicidal thoughts aren't just consequences of this issue with my Mum. I'm also severely disabled and fucking lonely as fuck (I don't usually swear but I need the cathartics of it right now, sorry). Life is miserable at the moment and woe is very much me.

So sorry for the essay. I guess I just needed to rant and/or to ask if anyone else has experienced this sort of thing. Thanks

Apologies for all the typos. I have Parkinson's and typing is particularly difficult as I only have a phone. This has taken me two hours to write. I don't think I can ever use my right thumb again 😬

Dementia does change personalities and removes filters . My mum was fine until she had a stroke now she says everything that comes into her head . Good , bad , racist , fattist .. she is possessed by the dementia monster and I rarely get a glimpse of the old her

Anyways regardless of if she does have it or not I feel your pain

I can't go NC because I'm her PA essentially while she stays on her home as she doesn't want to leave it 🙄🙄

First you don't know if it's dementia as early signs could be personality changes. My aunt turned ferocious and a few years later was in a home with dementia.

You need to stop hoping your mum will be nice and just accept her the way she is. Therefore I'd cut out the humour, cut down on time spent with her and leave if she gets nasty.

If certain things trigger her then don't mention them eg presents. Talk about neutral things that won't cause a reaction and if she acts up then make your excuses and leave.

Echo the above. Make peace with the fact that your mother, who has been living by herself for 15 years now and therefore has no significant other to sense check her ways, will not change.

However, you can change! I’m assuming your dwindling social circle is because you have to spend so much time doing admin and DIY at your mother’s house (as well the the limitations of your disability). Decide your schedule ‘Mother, I will come round on Thursday evenings’ sort of thing. When it comes to the comments, just let it go over your head and bulldoze in something else to chat about, like the weather.

You clearly have a sense of duty, which makes you a great person. A sense of duty does not mean you need to put up with abuse, or be someone’s servant.

You also have a child. Do prioritise time with him/her. Think of the positives - the hugs, the chats, the being proud when they do their exams, when they get a job, maybe one day becoming parents.

I feel your pain - my lovely, funny, strong, capable, flexible mum was a right PITA for the last couple of years of her life. She could be funny and sunny one moment and then horrid and wound up the next. In her case it was a combination of anxiety, brain damage after a stroke and depression about her health. You just have to realise that it's probably health related, involuntary and try not to take it personally. I remember the good version of my mother not the crabbit one

Thank you for responding everyone. The main reason why I don't think it's Dementia is because she's been like this for 15 years almost. To my knowledge even the slowest Dementia is usually quicker than that - however of course it's not impossible.

I guess it's my own fault for being entirely unable to simply 'let it go' whenever incorrect nonsense is launched at me. That's me in general, pretty much. I've also never been capable of that mindset some people have where they don't care what a stranger or un-important person thinks of them in a scenario. I find myself compelled to correct them. Madness I know. It's my biggest character flaw.
When it's my Mum, it's amplified. She pushes my buttons like nothing else.

I didn't want to read and run as I've been to that dark place. You've been given some good advice on dealing with your mother - but don't forget that you need to look after you as well. You clearly have a sense of duty but that often makes us give and give until there's nothing left. Tell your DM that you are taking a break for a few days over half term (even if you don't go away) and ive yourself some head space/spend time with your little girl.

On a practical note my DM has Parkinsons and we got some dictation software which has really helped - depending on what sort of phone you have there might well be a free one or an inexpensive app. We had advice from the Parkinsons Society on what people were finding helpful at the time.

Good advice thank you and that software sounds good thanks. It's an iPhone so should work, thanks.

Even if it’s dementia, you still have the right to limit your exposure to such behaviour.

PS. Was she a good, loving mother prior to the last 15 years? It seems unusual to have such a sudden change and with such an advanced level of unpleasantness for so long with no other changes - whilst prior to that being fine.

I don’t think it’s necessary dementia. When older most people get more selfish, less tolerant and patient so it’s probably this. I’m not surprised that she is different with your DD it’s often the case. If DD is happy I would leave it as it is.
At this stage you should treat your Mum a bit as a child - plan and choose your actions and words, don’t argue and ignore. I suppose as you have a lot on your plate your patience is not endless either, but try not to count on her for moral support (I know it’s easy to say that), just for spending time with DD.
Also if you are struggling with little jobs, don’t do them please. You have a duty of care to Dd so all your energy should go on her. Your mum is an adult and she is capable in dealing with issues herself would it be physically herself or arranging someone else. I’m not saying don’t help her but you and DD should be your priorities.

Oh op, you sound worn down and at your wits end. I bet you feel like you have the world on your shoulders and are slowly being hammered into the ground with it all - So big hugs to you.

It is so hard to draw a line between protecting your own well being and that feeling of Duty we have to our parents.

I don't know what the answer is - i am in a similar situation with my own mum, although there is dementia there. I am a single parent, with a chronic health condition and sometimes i just want to hide under the covers and sob. I day dream about something happening to me and then i get even more pissed off as i don't even have the luxury of the option of jumping off a cliff as there are two many people relying on me.

Sometimes things are ok, and it is like all is ok with the world, but most times it is like living with a feeling of utter dread.

Try to stay strong, and try to carve out sometime for yourself where you can xx

PS. If it’s not dementia - and is instead simply toxicity/narcissism* getting worse in old age the you might find this video on enforcing boundaries helpful …

Or else a combination of both toxicity and dementia.

Hello OP, we are really sorry to hear you are feeling this way.

We hope you don't mind, but when these threads are flagged up to us we usually add a link to our Mental Health resources. You can also go to the Samaritans website or email them on [email protected].

You're getting some wonderful support already - support from other Mumsnetters is great and we really hope you will be able to take some comfort from your fellow posters, but as other MNers will tell you, it's really a good idea to seek RL help and support as well.

We also like to remind everyone that, although we're awed daily by the astonishing support our members give each other through life's trickier twists and turns, we'd always caution anyone never to give more of themselves to another poster, emotionally or financially, than they can afford to spare.

Wishing you the very best,
MNHQ💐

Oops, wrong YouTube video. This is the one I was thinking of…

It sounds tough but I think part of the problem is that you are engaging with this nonsense.
Would just occasional "yep, uhhu, ok" work when shes off on one?
I appreciate that you want to make your case but it seems thats not possible so just drop the rope totally and don't argue. Another tactic I find helpful is only respond to questions, not comments so "You returned that dress" needs no response and "you returned that dress, didn't you?" just requires a flat "yes"
Stop arguing with the crazy, it just feeds it

@LimesTime No not really in an emotional sense. Very good at making sure we had everything we needed but was emotionally neglectful and cold I'd say. Opposite to how she is with dd thank god!

@pizzaHeart Good advice, thank you! You're absolutely right 👍🏻

@SunshineSky81 i don't even have the luxury of the option of jumping off a cliff as there are two many people relying on me.

Omg that is exactly it! I said that to my mum this morning that at least (almost) everyone else has the 'nuclear' option but I can't as DD would not only be destroyed by it, but she'd have to go into care. There's not a single person who could take her as my sibling has....issues. My mum has already said she couldn't possibly take her and that's genuinely it. The only other family DD has is my 1st cousins who is a single father to 4 kids and has only met DD once as a baby! He just couldn't and def wouldn't

@PipMumsnet Thank you but as I've explained already, I can't end my life because of my child so there's nothing to worry about on that score.

Also I can assure you this is NOT a money begging thread! I'm pretty sure I've not even mentioned money?!? Have I??

@LimesTime Thank you 🙏 I'll watch that after teatime chaos! I really appreciate that 💜

@Hoppinggreen I need to learn to do this!

If you can its actually very enjoyable
The person who is ranting at you can't get annoyed as you are doing nothing wrong, it drives them nuts and the more annoyed they get the more uninterested you get and so on.
They can't even complain to anyone else - "I was shouting at my daughter and she agreed"

They way you describe your mum is exactly how my mum can be. The slightest comment you say out of touch with her ideology sets her off.

I had one of these a few months ago and when she started, I just had enough. Said I was leaving. She was pulling on my arms to make me stay, told my dad to make me stay. It descended into a screaming match between us both and she knew fine well she was in the wrong but does what your mum does and dragged up every past issue or diverted, diverted diverted to as not actually get to the issue, which was her fault

She always ends up saying she has a headache and expects it to be ended at that point.

I try to keep her at arms length now. Don't divulge too much. I always overshared with her but try to keep news to a minimum. It sounds really hard.
My advice would be to just shit it down quickly and move on. Or if she starts, walk out!

@Hoppinggreen Genius! I will definitely try it with all my might.

@Hungrycaterpillarsmummy Yep sounds familiar. Only difference is that she doesn't care if I leave. God forbid she should show any care or concern for me! Ha

I’m pretty sure the iPhone has it built in, my daughter uses it. It takes a little while for the phone to get used to your voice, so you have to make a few corrections, but after that it’s pretty smooth.
Sorry about your ma, she sounds like bloody hard work. I hope I’ll have the strength to shuffle off before I get to be a pita.

Yeah I thought narcissist mother. She can't cope with any perceived criticism, can never be wrong, never to blame for anything. Cold and emotionally repressed when you were young. She gets angry with you because you don't think she's absolutely amazing in everything she does, you cannot reason with her. I bet the times she is nice to you are when she wants you to do something or you say something that pleases her. Otherwise you're her scapegoat to take everything out on, maybe she then plays either the guilt or the martyr card on you.

She doesn't care if you leave and if you weren't useful then she probably wouldn't be bothered if she never saw you again. She adores your daughter because your dd adores her - she gets narcissistic supply from your dd.

My mum is the same. I frequently fall into the trap of arguing with her, she loves to tell me what a brilliant mum she was and how I'm not quite as good. She was a brilliant mum when I was tiny as it was very important to her to look like the perfect mum and I was very well behaved. Then when I got a bit older and got a mind of my own I was then broken as far as she was concerned. She's never been very interested since. She'll never phone me I always phone her but generally she says she's too busy too talk. Then when I point out that she never phones me unless she wants me to do something for her she'll phone me to make the point that she does phone me. I've taken a huge emotional step back from her and have no expectations now, but it's sad not to have a mum who is properly there for you.

Anyway that's what I recommend big emotional step back, she can never be the mother you'd like. You could try saying 'anyway' and changing the subject every time your mum starts down the road to an argument, that's what I do if i can't be bothered. Tell her something about your dd to distract her perhaps. I also really think you need to step back from doing so much around her house and start looking after yourself a lot more OP. Your dd needs you and you need to be around for her. Putting yourself through all this is too much, cut back and think of it as putting your dd first.