Mum nearly 90 and so scared of dying

[izimbra]

My mum is 89, turning 90 in a week. She lives with my sister and is usually in reasonable health. She's very disabled through arthritis and her eyesight is poor, but she has a good appetite, cognitively pretty good, doesn't have chronic pain. My sister stuffs her with healthy food - vegetables, fish, pulses, fruit. Her younger and older sister have passed away in the past 4 years, and I credit her diet and my sister's care with my mum's continued good health.

About 12 days ago she picked up a bug and got very chesty. She's on her second course of antibiotics, is up, eating, her colour is ok, her voice is strong, but she's overwhelmed with fear that she could die any moment. I don't know what to say to her. I try to reassure her by pointing out that all her vital signs are good, that she's eating, she's up and about, but she just says 'I'm so scared, I feel terrible'. I think part of what's making her feel 'terrible' is constant fear.

The think is, at nearly 90 it's not unreasonable to expect that death might be round the corner, and I feel like a bit of a fraud not acknowledging this to her when she says it. I don't know how to comfort her. I just try to listen and then distract her with family gossip, but it makes me sad to think of her being scared. :-(

Has anyone else had to deal with this? Any tips?

I think if you've reached the age of 89 and you're still scared of death then whatever philosophy you ascribe to, whether atheism, god-fearing or whatever, it hasn't really worked out for you has it?

It’s completely normal for her to be scared of dying. I think the problem is feeling the need to jolly her along & change the subject. Let her talk about it, discuss it, reflect on it. It might help.

I do agree that faith can help. It seemed to provide hope & comfort to my relatives nearing death.

"I think if you've reached the age of 89 and you're still scared of death then whatever philosophy you ascribe to, whether atheism, god-fearing or whatever, it hasn't really worked out for you has it?"

But that's the thing - belief is where you arrive as a result of your perception of reality. It's not a choice. Reality is often uncomfortable. What you're describing is magical thinking.

And I'm not sure that being religious makes you value your life less. In fact many religious people are so desperately attached to the view that life is valuable beyond measure, that they put considerable energy into trying to stop women access abortion and arguing against assisted dying.

@CoconutAirways one of my grandparents lived day to day for 20 years

I think the PP who mentioned that you feel the same inside whatever your age is right, you are the same person and it's just instinctive for humans and animals to want to cling on to life. You'd hope we'd try and process the inevitability of death as we age but it's still very difficult. As for religion, I think it's for those who can't accept than when you're dead... that's it. I'd rather not be deluded. It's actually harder being an atheist in that respect but atleast I'm not Kidding myself.

@izimbra So what is your Mum actually scared of? If she's an atheist she won't believe in any sort of 'afterlife'. She presumably believes she will merely cease to exist. What's scary about that? Have you asked her what she's actually scared of?

The only reason to be scared is if secretly she does wonder if her soul will survive the physical death of the body, and if so that she might end up somewhere she doesn't want to go. So she's admitting she's not an atheist after all, maybe.

Nah, I'm an atheist and I can tell you it's non of that. There is no soul or afterlife. I'm scared of the pain of death and the process , not worried about afterwards because I won't know .

Could it possibly stem from some ingrained religious fear that she might be going to hell, or purgatory?

I’d def. ask her GP for something to relieve anxiety.

I’d be tempted to jolly her along, make plans and have lots to look forward to. She could have many years yet.
My dad has serious mobility issues and has ‘taken to his bed’ in a nursing home over a year ago. Hopes death will come along soon, very gung ho about it all ready for the off!

@grapeomelette

If she's an atheist she won't believe in any sort of 'afterlife'. She presumably believes she will merely cease to exist. What's scary about that?

Ceasing to exist not scary? Are you serious?

Personally I think life is pretty amazing and doubt I'll ever be ready to say goodbye to it. Ceasing to exist means the loss of a future -not seeing what becomes of my children, scientific advances, technological advances, what becomes of the planet. Yes I'll be dead and not aware of this loss at that point but that doesn't stop me mourning and fearing what I'll be missing in advance. Though it is some comfort that in ceasing to exist those feelings will have an endpoint.

You say she's an atheist, well maybe deep down she's not.
Maybe it's worth having that conversation with her, would she like to reach out to a minister or someone spiritual. I get that people live their lives believing there is nothing out there, but when faced with with their own mortality things can change, I'm not overly religious but I do believe that death isn't the end, maybe she doesn't believe it's the end.
OP I'm sorry she's scared, I find that heartbreaking to be honest, I'd take her lead in it, maybe have a tentative discussion about what she'd like to explore, maybe some meditation or something that might bring peace, my parents are v religious and are almost looking forward to their heavenly rest!

Unfortunately belief isn't a choice.

It's what you arrive at through your perception of reality (or more commonly through religious indoctrination from childhood, which none of us have been subject to).

I often wish I had the comfort of believing that the most important part of us will never die, but it's simply not a choice available for me or any of our family

This is me too

Just make her feel safe and talk to her x

You must have been utterly terrified for the billions of years the universe was trundling along before you existed.

I am a mere 67 years old, and find that I already think a lot about dying. It’s not fear of death exactly – I’m a settled atheist so I know I won’t be aware of being dead. But I do have a sort of fearful anticipation of the sad feelings that my loved ones will have to experience on my account, and which I won’t be there to help them with. I’ve taken care of all the practical stuff in order to make that as simple for them as possible. My adult children are all emotionally intelligent and I know they will support each other, but I still wish they didn’t have to go through the painful grief stuff because of me. I wish I could somehow save them from that. I know I have to accept that I can’t, but that is hard.

Sometimes I think about my Dad. He believed that he would not live longer than his father who had died at the age of 40, when my Dad was 10. Every birthday my Dad expected to be his last. My Dad actually lived to be 86 and I often think that perhaps he wasted a great deal of energy worrying about something that, if only he had known, was not going to happen for another 46 years! Life is fleeting and it’s all we have. Death is inevitable. I am wasting what life I have if I spend it feeling bad about future things I can’t do anything about. I try to remind myself of that in the wee small hours when those dratted sad, regretful thoughts seem to want to dominate my mind.

What I have done is to make sure I tell my dear ones frequently how much I love them and how proud I am of all of them, and how much their love has meant to me. I hope that that somehow sustains them a bit when (if!) there are times when they miss me once I’ve gone.

Sorry - I’m not sure how this helps the OP but I thought I’d throw my observations in the discussion anyway.

HNRTFT but we get the hospice counsellor involved. As a team we are excellent at EOLC and our residents generally except that their life is ending fairly soon but we do involve a counsellor/church / family to comfort the resident.The hospice counsellor is really good at explaining symptoms and what we can do to make things better.

Loved this, thank you.

The comments about having something spiritual to believe being helpful were true for my mum.

Both mum and dad were scared of dying. My dad died at 87 and at no point was he reconciled to it

My mum lived until 92. In her last two tears she moved to a care home run by nuns ( she had been a lifelong practicing catholic albeit not particularly devout ) . She was not at all. reconciled to dying either at first but after about a year in the home she was definitely more reconciled to it .

She was happy and lived life to the full in as much as her limitations allowed. She has friends to talk to and visitors almost every day and in the home she attended mass daily and became much more peaceful and content generally

A couple of months before she died we talked about how she felt about dying and she made it clear that she was ready . Not because she was miserable ( she wasn't generally despite very real health and mobility it difficulties) but because she had a good long life and she reassured me not to worry if I came in one day and she had died as she felt like it would be fine and she was ready emotionally and spiritualy. It was a lovely conversation albeit sad

I'm sure they're helpful to people who have already have faith. But they're not to an atheist - which is what my mum is, as I've made clear repeatedly on this thread.

@SparkleGranny - I use exactly the strategy you describe for myself all the time. I really apply mental discipline about it and I'm getting better and better at it. My main worry isn't for myself, it's for my very vulnerable, mentally ill 20 year old son who also has leukaemia. I simply don't know how he'll survive without me in a system which is increasingly incapable of meeting the basic care needs of severely mentally ill people. I have to ruthlessly close off my visions of his possible future.

This sort of practice is a form of mindfulness.

@izimbra I can see why you might have justifiable concerns about your son's future without you in it, as his needs are greater than some, but I think that none of us really let go of worrying about our children, however mature they are, however independent, healthy or needy.
I came across this poem which lightened my mood a little:

Life in Reverse by George Carlin

The most unfair thing about life is the way it ends.
I mean, life is tough. It takes up a lot of your time.
What do you get at the end of it?
A death.
What’s that, a bonus?
I think the life cycle is all backwards.
You should die first; get it out of the way.
Then you live in an old age home, feeling better every day.
You get kicked out when you’re too young, you get a gold watch,
you go to work.
You work forty years until you’re young enough to enjoy your retirement.
You drink alcohol, you party,
you get ready for high school.
You go to primary school, you become a kid, you play, you have no responsibilities,
you become a little baby, you go back into the womb,
You spend your last nine months floating…
Then you finish off as an orgasm.
(Or as a gleam in someones else’s eye.)

@SparkleGranny

That poem is a beautiful thought. When you read it like that, it gives a very bleak picture of the way live is in fact lived.

There is actually a theory that we only perceive time in the current direction because … well … essentially because that is just how we are currently perceiving it (for want of a better way to phrase it), but that simultaneously we are also experiencing it in reverse. As the “future facing” version of our perception we are unable to experience the “past facing” part of our experience.

Random thoughts.
Time is concurrent, the brain is a filter but how the heck that works, I don't know.

The mass of the universe does not change, no matter how people come and go, so in a sense we are eternal.
I hope your mum can find peace.

@OwlCityisthemostunderrated

There is actually a theory that we only perceive time in the current direction because … well … essentially because that is just how we are currently perceiving it (for want of a better way to phrase it), but that simultaneously we are also experiencing it in reverse. As the “future facing” version of our perception we are unable to experience the “past facing” part of our experience.

I don't understand this but it sounds very interesting!

do you know what the name of this theory is or where I could read more about it? how did you hear of it?

It was something my teen was reading. From a quick Google this is a similar concept (towards the end of the article) https://www.inverse.com/entertainment/10150-your-experience-of-time-may-be-backwards-from-the-rest-of-the-universe

@SparkleGranny thank you for your post! The poem is wonderful!