Active discussions

Meet the Other Phone. A phone that grows with your child.

Meet the Other Phone.
A phone that grows with your child.

Buy now

Please or to access all these features

Talk
Elderly parents
Original poster

Need some advice desperately please

28 replies

BeauticianNotMagician81 · 14/11/2023 20:55

Hi, I don't know if anyone is or has been in a similar situation but I'm after any words of wisdom. My Dad has never been hands on. Parents divorced when I was in my late teens and my dad moved in with his parents. He helped my grandma when my grandad got ill. Then stayed in the house until my grandma passed away. Both grandparents had dementia. I think Dad is going the same way but the health professionals disagree. I haven't lived near my Dad (about an hour and a half away) for 15 years and he hasn't visited once in that time. Anyway he is of limited mobility, isn't washing or making it to the bathroom, is deaf (but refuses to pay to fix his hearing aids and won't let me), won't pay for carers, house isn't suitable and he refuses to leave. Because of his situation with my grandparents he thinks me and my siblings can just drop everything to look after him. DB is 40 minutes away, sister is abroad.

I have four DC, run my own business and my husband mostly works away. All of the extended family are calling on me to take responsibility but it's making me ill. The social worker said I should get POA while Dad is still seen as having mental capacity. That's proving tricky as I can't find anyone to sign the certificate as I can't physically get him to the GP etc as I wouldn't be able to hold him up. What do I do? How do you reason with someone that is impossible?

OP posts:
Daffidale · 14/11/2023 21:22

You can only do so much and ultimately can’t force him to take better care of himself, get carers etc… The emotional blackmail from Dad and relatives can be huge, but you don’t have to cave to it.

In practical terms, def get the POA in place. Then you can help with some things like managing finances without being there. I’d get someone else on it too like DB as he is closer (and you trust him) so it’s not all on you.

You don’t need to get Dad to a GP for it.

It needs someone who knows him who will certify that he’s not being pressured into it. And then you need someone to witness all your signatures. Could a neighbour do it as he’s lived there a while? They could come round next time you or DB are there.

Original poster
BeauticianNotMagician81 · 14/11/2023 21:24

@Daffidale thank you. My Das has literally alienated himself from everyone. He doesn't speak to a soul. The only other person is his girlfriend who's really just a companion now. But I'm not sure if she would be allowed.

OP posts:
tobyj · 14/11/2023 22:06

Pause a minute though - do you WANT to have poa? Are you willing to take that on? It sounds like there's a real danger that your own life is going to be seriously compromised if you take on more responsibility for your dad. It also sounds like it would be very difficult to say no - but maybe you need to at least consider the possibility. Where are your siblings in all this?

Original poster
BeauticianNotMagician81 · 14/11/2023 22:42

@tobyj I think it's especially difficult at the moment as I'm peri menopausal. I'm also in the middle of a huge house renovation. Like to make things easy for myself Hmm. I don't particularly want POA but I also dont want to just leave him to it. I can't sleep at the moment it's all I think about. My DB has been dealing with all of it for months and is at his wits end. My DS is abroad. I do feel guilty but I also feel angry that he hasn't got things in place long before now and that he only wants to communicate now he needs me and everyone else has given up on him. He's in a right sorry state. Pretty much living in his own mess.

One thing it's made very clear to me is that I'm in the process of sorting out a POA now with my older dcs as I never, ever want to put my children through this.

OP posts:
Borntobeamum · 15/11/2023 09:26

Could you arrange to meet a solicitor at your dads to sort out POA?

Our solicitor came to my parents home one evening to update their wills and arrange the POA. Granted it costs but if time is of the essence, that may be your best option.

MereDintofPandiculation · 15/11/2023 09:56

Does your dad not have NHS hearing aids? They’re very good and , of course, no need to “pay to fix”.

MereDintofPandiculation · 15/11/2023 09:57

As to reasoning, try arguments on the lines of “keep you out of a care home as long as possible “. But ultimately it’s his choice. He’s allowed to make bad decisions

Original poster
BeauticianNotMagician81 · 15/11/2023 17:52

@MereDintofPandiculation no he doesn't have NHS hearing aids they wouldn't give him any. I don't know why but my brother was dealing with that. I took them today to get repaired anyway.

Yes good idea to change my wording to "we need to get x,y,z in place to keep you out of a care home as long as possible". Thank you.

OP posts:
Original poster
BeauticianNotMagician81 · 15/11/2023 17:55

@Borntobeamum yes I took his solicitors details today so that's an option. I just don't know when I can next get back as I've got so much on.

I feel utterly exhausted today after spending all day with him. He told the carer to F off when I was there as well. He hasn't washed in goodness knows how long but wont be helped.

OP posts:
Borntobeamum · 15/11/2023 18:03

Oh dear. I really do feel for you.

Although my mum had dementia, my dad was very ‘with it’ and they both appreciated everything I did for them.

It was only after Dad died that Mum became difficult and said she hated me because I still had a husband and she didn’t 😞

Navigating dealing with elderly parents should be thought in school!

AllrightNowBaby · 15/11/2023 18:04

You don’t need the GP or a solicitor to do the POA.
You just send for the forms, fill them in yourself and get someone who is not a relative to countersign your Dads signature.
I should think his girlfriend could do it, as she’s not family.
He does sound as though he really needs carers going in and I would get Social Services involved.
Give them a call, explain he’s living in his own mess and they will come round to see him while you’re there. They’re used to this situation and will talk to him about the help he can have to live comfortably in his own home.
You and your brother are just going to have to over-ride him, as no-one can live like that.

MereDintofPandiculation · 15/11/2023 20:40

It was only after Dad died that Mum became difficult and said she hated me because I still had a husband and she didn’t 😞 That's a very understandable feeling, standard stage of grief. I went through a phase of hating people who had mothers. Thoughts like that are understandable but you keep them to yourself. But dementia can rob you of your filters.

You don’t need the GP or a solicitor to do the POA. You just send for the forms, fill them in yourself and get someone who is not a relative to countersign your Dads signature. It's not the PoA she's worried about it's the certificate provider. And although the GF isn't family she is a partner or ex partner, so it might stir up problems in the future if she does it.

The certificate provider can be someone who has known the person for a long time (and there aren't any available) or it can be someone professionally qualified, in which case they'll want to be paid. Maybe a solicitor would agree to be the certificate provider without having anything to do with the rest of the form, which would cut costs a little.

AllrightNowBaby · 16/11/2023 01:59

The Certificate Provider has to be someone who has known your father personally for at least two years (more than an acquaintance) but not a family member, so I would think that his friend/carer would be ideal, as it has to be someone who would have the best interest of the Donor (your father) at heart.
When we did a POA for my father we asked the taxi driver he had used quite a few times a week for years if he would do it.
He just had to make sure that my father knew what he was signing and that he wasn’t being coerced into it.

Need some advice desperately please
Sholkedabemus · 16/11/2023 02:12

My MIL was like your dad @BeauticianNotMagician81 . The situation nearly finished my DH, and me to some extent. I remember crying my heart out several times over the whole sorry situation. DH’s two sisters live far away and piled pressure on us to step up and look after someone who had alienated us and everyone else. My advice is to put yourself and your own family first. Do not be guilt tripped. Make it crystal clear exactly how much you can’t do. If you do anything, services will step back and do nothing. Social care have a duty to look after vulnerable adults but services are stretched. If they think a family member can step in, they quickly step away. Don’t get to breaking point like we did. Look after yourself. 💐

MereDintofPandiculation · 16/11/2023 09:28

so I would think that his friend/carer would be ideal, as it has to be someone who would have the best interest of the Donor (your father) at heart. OP describes her as a “girlfriend who is really now a companion “. One of the exclusions is partner. I don’t know how they’d look on ex-partner.

Original poster
BeauticianNotMagician81 · 16/11/2023 13:22

I really don't know what to do about the certificate provider it's proving so difficult. My DB suggested the lady that visits him but she was his girlfriend. We are wracking our brains as to who else could do it. He has lots of cousins locally would one of their partners be able to do it or is that still classed as family?

OP posts:
AllrightNowBaby · 16/11/2023 18:12

I really don’t think that being an ex-girlfriend is going to cause problems.
She’s not a partner, or even an ex partner, if I’m understanding what you have told us and doesn’t live in the same house.
At this point in time, she is a friend who visits him, so she would be the obvious choice.
Some people advising you on here are being too pedantic and making it difficult for you.

Original poster
BeauticianNotMagician81 · 16/11/2023 18:13

@AllrightNowBaby yes they have never lived together. She actually lives quite a distance from him. She sees him once a fortnight.

OP posts:
AllrightNowBaby · 16/11/2023 18:57

Perfect…. you have your certificate provider.
Also, good luck with getting your Dad’s life more manageable 💐

MereDintofPandiculation · 16/11/2023 20:24

Some people advising you on here are being too pedantic and making it difficult for you. A LPA which was declared invalid after the person had lost capacity really would make things difficult.

Agreed, after OP’s latest clarification, “girlfriend” sounds fine.

Original poster
BeauticianNotMagician81 · 17/11/2023 18:20

Thank you so much to everyone on here for the help. Today my dad's card got declined and my goodness it took him nearly all day to sort it out as he's deaf and couldn't understand what to do.

So I called the solicitor and asked about a home visit as I need to get this POA asap. They are getting back to me and it's not too expensive. Social services have extended his care until mid December then he has to pay, which he doesn't want to do. So it's all looking a little clearer. It's just the constant phone calls and I'm about to go into my busiest time at work so I won't be able to keep answering him Sad

OP posts:
Original poster
BeauticianNotMagician81 · 17/11/2023 18:21

Oh and his friend wasn't interested in helping she didn't want to be a certificate provider. Hmm

OP posts:
MereDintofPandiculation · 18/11/2023 10:34

BeauticianNotMagician81 · 17/11/2023 18:21

Oh and his friend wasn't interested in helping she didn't want to be a certificate provider. Hmm

Well, it’s a bit scary. Official document, signatures witnessed, registered with OPG. I wouldn’t blame her for feeling daunted.

Or did she refuse because she doesn’t feel he has capacity?

Original poster
BeauticianNotMagician81 · 18/11/2023 20:39

@MereDintofPandiculation no she just said she didn't want to do it. The social worker and the hospital agreed he still has mental capacity but just told us to get it done fast.

OP posts:
sixteenfurryfeet · 18/11/2023 20:59

BeauticianNotMagician81 · 18/11/2023 20:39

@MereDintofPandiculation no she just said she didn't want to do it. The social worker and the hospital agreed he still has mental capacity but just told us to get it done fast.

You don't have to have the POA yourself, you can appoint a solicitor to do it on his behalf. It is what happens when someone has no relatives to take it on. It's what I had to do when a relative of mine died - she'd had POA for her sibling and everyone tried to get me to assume responsibility. Social Services also expected me to drop everything (including my job) and move him in with me.

The social worker in your case wants you to have POA so you then feel obliged to be responsible for him in other aspects as well.

My advice would be - don't do it.