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Elderly parents

Dads flat and cleanliness

30 replies

paulfoel · 28/09/2023 14:22

Last few times its been absolutely stinking in his flat. Really, really bad.

I've tried to tell him. Doesn't listen.

I've noticed the smell is him. I sort of asked him and he said "I had a shower the other day". Turns out he means he has one once a week. Ewww.

His answer "well its only me here so it doesnt matter and when I was young we didn't have things like showers so you'd have a bath once a week".

Hes has nurses, meals on wheels people going there. I dread to think what they think....

OP posts:
Oldthyme · 28/09/2023 14:31

Speak to his carers! See if they can encourage him to shower?

I know the smell you mean. There was a young student type chap in Aldi this week whose aroma was gagging. He scented the entire place.

I followed another chap around B&Q yesterday, not by design. It just worked out that way. He really ponged.

It wasn’t BO for either, just a vile unwashed ingrained body/clothes smell. 🤢

MariaAshley · 28/09/2023 14:47

You can't control other's behaviour only your own.

You could try telling him you believe he has become nose -blind. That it's not only him there because you're there visiting, other professionals visit, he presumably goes to shops etc so other people are being affected by the results of his lifestyle choices.

Apart from that all you can do is refuse to visit unless he wears freshly washed clothes that day, has taken a shower and washed his hair in the prior 12hrs, empties his bins and opens his windows to air out his home before you arrive.

Unfortunately, he has the right to be disgusting if he wishes. I think, for some people, it's only the social consequences of their choices that would ever make them choose differently. The world is awash with people who make an effort/more of an effort only in order to attract a partner and who, if given the opportunity, will live as total slobs. He's not looking for a partner, the professionals will come regardless and be polite because they have to, he likely doesn't care about the people in the shops. So that leaves only you as someone who can provide a consequence for his actions. There's no guarantees it'll work though, he may choose being a slob over his relationship with you. It's your decision whether his behaviour is a deal-breaker for you or not.

paulfoel · 29/09/2023 09:42

He doesn't go out which I guess is part of the problem....

Tried to tell him nicely but I don't think he cares to be honest. I even said look its not fair for people inc me to come here and his attitude is "well hard luck don;t come then"

OP posts:
SeaToSki · 29/09/2023 09:46

Do you think it has become to hard or scary for him to shower? As you get older and have less ability to balance. Wet feet can be very slippery, bending over to soap and dry, fiddling with buttons and towels etc can be exhausting. Could you try and see if his washing set up is still easy for him to manage?

Iknowthis1 · 29/09/2023 09:48

Are his clothes being washed?

TheYearOfSmallThings · 29/09/2023 09:58

It sounds as if he is either unable to care for himself or is too depressed to do so, and his carers are not dealing with it successfully. You mention he has nurses and meals on wheels, but does he have an actual carer who helps him wash, and anyone who washes his clothes and does cleaning? Is he capable of these things?

In my job I encounter some very ill smelling people and I always think of the quote below from a book about a trauma cleaner. It is a sign of someone not coping.

I imagine the smell settling like snow on my hair and my skin, breathing it like smoke into my nose and mouth; how it curls its way into the fibers of my clothing and the hollows of my ears. Like death, it is an old smell; so fundamentally human that it can only be disavowed. You avoid this smell each time you take a shower and each time you wash your hands. Each time you brush your teeth or flush the toilet, or launder your sheets and towels. With every plate you scrub clean, every spill you mop up and every bag of trash you tie up and throw out. Every time you open a window or walk outside, breathing deeply, to stretch your legs and stand in sunlight. This smell is the lingering presence of all the physical things we put into and wash off ourselves. But it is equally the ineffable smell of defeat, of isolation, of self-hate. Or, more simply, it is the smell of pain.

paulfoel · 29/09/2023 13:02

Re: washing. I sorted out a grant for him hes got a proper walk in shower now.
Before that he washed even less!

OP posts:
paulfoel · 29/09/2023 13:08

Re; His clothes
This is a story going back years. He moved in when he was 58 when he got divorced. Refused to get a washing machine because "he couldn't use it" and "its womens work". Really. At the time I was fuming but his (older) sister offered to do all his laundry so I was scuppered.

Note "older". You can imagine. Dads 89 now his sister is still alive. That little set up lasted prob 5 years. Since then Dad still refuses to get a washing machine.

Hes used brothers "various" partners to take his washing home and do it. Really. I stepped back and always refused to do it. I live 30 miles away, got kids, I'm certainly not asking my wife to do his laundry!!!! (he wanted me to ask her - he never asked me to do it).

So yes he does still get his brothers partner to do it but I don't think its that often. Once or twice I've visited to take him out and had to say "No Dad put something clean on to wear".

Hes an adult I've tried. He can make his own decisions. As with many things with Dad, I've forced myself to take a step back a little.

OP posts:
paulfoel · 29/09/2023 13:14

re: carers
Sorry for confusion. He has nurses who come to take his blood (hes on warfarin).
He has no carers.

That's another thing. He had carers but he cancelled them. To be honest, the carers complained about him too so I think they'd have told him no.

He wanted them there at 9am no earlier no later. Of course not everyone can have 9am - these poor carers have multiple people to visit. He'd then berate them for not turning up at 9am and he'd get nasty with them.

I tried to explain (my own wife used to be a district nurse so I know how it works - someone is 1st on the list, someone is last its just tough luck) but No he wanted someone there 9am.

Only option was to pay privately and hes never going to pay so that was that.

Again, adult making his own decisions and I've got no say.

In all truth, Dad would be better in a home. He'd love all the attention to be honest. BUT hes probably not ill enough to qualify for free so he'd have to pay.

Also, hes got this idea in his head that you get "put away" in a home. And its shameful if you put a family member in a home. Very backward place where I come from and this is the attitude........
Im sure he thinks its like a victorian workhouse like in Dickens. But hes stubborn, narrow minded what can I do?

OP posts:
MariaAshley · 29/09/2023 15:41

Is there a seat in his wet-room? If not, you could get one. After he's washed his butt, he can sit on it whilst he washes the rest of him, feels safer, less risk of falling, he sounds the proud kind that would never admit he's struggling.

Does he know where his local launderette is? He can pay for a service wash if he doesn't want to wash his own clothes. Or could you all club together and buy him a washer/dryer for Christmas? Use s red pen to mark the basic wash/dry cycle. Show him how to turn it on, put powder into the drum (because he's never going to clean out the powder drawer) and press start. Ensure he knows to take the clothes out as soon as they've finished to minimise creasing and going mouldy from being left damp from the steam that's still in the machine. Part of the problem could be he just doesn't want to admit how much he struggles with technology, so blames it on "women's work" instead. Although he does seem to have a bit of an attitude problem there towards women, a generational thing perhaps, a dislike of change and a refusal to move with the times. A large part of why he smells will be his filthy clothes. Clothes are so cheap now, if he doesn't want to wash them he could buy a new set every week to put on after his shower and would smell infinitely better, although it's a wasteful way to live.

What hobbies does he have? Maybe he feels like a "housewife" now he's retired and living alone, if he has no hobbies. If housewives aren't people he respects then, leaving aside his misogynistic attitude, that could be hard for him. Does he have an identity outside of his job or was his job everything? Has he lost himself now he's retired?

He can pay a cleaner, nobody gets those for free. He does need to treat the people who do it with respect though otherwise they'll drop him as a client. He'll need an agency to do a spring clean first, then a regular weekly clean to keep it nice. Ensuring it includes changing the bedding.

A trip to the doctor might help, although he's probably against antidepressants too and would see them as a sign of failure. Getting old and infirm can't be much fun, I'm sure a lot think they'd rather be dead and give up. If he wasn't depressed before living like this, he maybe is now. Unless he's always been a slob he won't be enjoying being one now. It's all very sad. He's obviously not coping if he was allocated carers, the council doesn't pay for those without good reason.

You can only help those who are willing to help themselves though. If someone is set on a path of self destruction there's not much you can do. Disengaging and stepping back is a better approach than becoming overly involved in someone's life when they don't actually want your help, that way madness lies and all you achieve is to hurt yourself.

mathanxiety · 29/09/2023 19:47

You say you've had to take a step back - what sort of help did you use to offer?

Itisyourturntowashthebath · 29/09/2023 19:58

You can help him get a direct payment carer.
https://www.gov.uk/apply-direct-payments
The local council assess your needs and generally pay towards it.

Then he can employ someone to come in when he wants, as opposed to the randomness of under staffed agencies.

Buy him a washing machine for Christmas, get the family to club together and then someone can take him o a day trip while it is fitted.

Apply for direct payments

If you get help from social services, direct payments let you choose and buy the services you need yourself, instead of getting them from your council

https://www.gov.uk/apply-direct-payments

goingtotown · 29/09/2023 20:06

You need to speak to him about his personal hygiene.
If that was my dad I'd do his laundry including the bedding.

TomatoSandwiches · 29/09/2023 20:15

Not much you can do, leave him to it.

SarahC50 · 29/09/2023 20:20

It's really difficult but if he has capacity and all his marbles then he can choose to live this way. He sounds like a very difficult and abrasive character. Unbelievable that he's farmed his laundry out since his late 50s.

I think all you can do is take a step back,many people live this way unfortunately and often the 'dirty squad' have to be bought in by the council to deal with filthy houses too.

I would increase the length of time between visits for your own sanity. Until he becomes physically or mentally incapable of living on his own I'm afraid he will stay this way.

Not easy for you I know but he sounds like a difficult man in general x

Muchtoomuchtodo · 29/09/2023 20:29

My Dad was starting to struggle but wouldn’t admit it. I live 150 miles away so only saw him every few weeks but when I did I’d change his bed and put any worn clothes through the wash. It helped that he had a washing machine.

He’s not going to change so you either need to stop worrying about it or give / arrange more support. There are laundry services who will collect, clean, dry and deliver the laundry back. Would he consider that? Direct payments are another great suggestion from pp, through you may end up doing the administration.

Daffidale · 01/10/2023 12:49

But hes stubborn, narrow minded what can I do?

Not much sadly. It sounds like you’ve already tried a lot of things (the walk in shower, carers etc)

On practical front maybe getting him a washing machine and dryer AND a cleaner, who can come in and do the laundry once a week

Have you looked at supported / sheltered accommodation? That wouldn’t be being “put away” in a home. Find one that will provide a care package as well. That way he gets to feel he is still independent but arranging bits of care, and increasing care, will be easier. Look around - places often have a restaurant on site for meals, ask if they have a laundry service etc

You probably can’t make him shower tho.

paulfoel · 01/10/2023 17:11

"goingtotown · 29/09/2023 20:06

You need to speak to him about his personal hygiene.
If that was my dad I'd do his laundry including the bedding."

Heres another one - look at me I'm a saint I am.....

Jeez everyone's situation is different. I live 45 mins away from him.... Which of the following shall I drop to be able to do this?

  1. Leave my 10 year old home alone.
  2. Sack off work every now and again.
  3. Leave my teenager with aspergers home alone when he can't cope.

BTW - all of these are things Dad said I should so.

OP posts:
paulfoel · 01/10/2023 17:13

SarahC50 - Yep hes always been like this. World works how he wants it to work in his eyes..... Women do this, men do that.

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paulfoel · 01/10/2023 17:15

Yeh hes got it all in his shower. Seat etc perfectly adapted for him.

I've tried in the past to just buy him things. I can't get a washing machine. He'd literally have a strop and not use it. Honestly he would. Then he'd call me every day to get someone to take it away.

OP posts:
theduchessofspork · 01/10/2023 17:22

Does he need/have a shower chair and things like that? I think showering can feel quite scary when your older.

Any chance you could get a cater in twice a week to help him wash?

paulfoel · 02/10/2023 08:54

Duchess - yes got all that. Its a proper adapted shower with chair etc.
He has meals on wheels every day (and moans its expensive).

Tried carers. He gave them grief because he wanted them there at 9am every day. Of course, the poor carers have a few people to do and not everyone can have 9am.

Tried to explain that to Dad but he had a right go at the carers. In the end, the manager had to phone him to try to explain and tell him to lay off. So he cancelled it (bet they were glad though) without telling me.

I have suggested private carers who probably would come at a time to suit him but he'd have to pay. Despite having thousands and thousands in the bank, Dad won't pay for anything.

I know he'd expect to pay £5 or something for an hour long carer visit which isnt happening.

As you can see, its difficult. I do all I can to help. I used to get mega stressed by it all because he was struggling now I just think why stress myself out when hes not going to change.

OP posts:
SarahC50 · 02/10/2023 09:02

@paulfoel you need to step back, you have done above and beyond what you can do. He is a stubborn and difficult man who is choosing to live this way.Leave him to it, he doesn't have dementia or any mh problem that would stop him looking after himself has he?

You have a busy enough home life as it is. Decrease the frequency of your visits,let him complain. Your stress levels will decrease as you deal less with him. I'm guessing as a child he wasn't father of the year either,step back for your own good xxxx

paulfoel · 02/10/2023 09:10

@SarahC50 Yes I've had to step back... To be honest, I'd be divorced by now otherwise.

Nah no dementia no MH problems. To be honest, hes not really that ill just old.

Thinking back yeh. I think at the time I didnt realise but now when I realise how he was I get it. Like you said not father of the year at all.

OP posts:
SarahC50 · 02/10/2023 09:30

Absolutely it sounds like he's been a difficult man all his life. My dh is a cpn and people living in this way aren't uncommon. He's sane and choosing to live this way. He has a lovely shower and stool etc but chooses not to use it.

Step back start by taking longer to reply to his calls,don't reply every time. Increase the time between visits and if he starts the ridiculous argument of you doing his washing or his choice to live in filth - leave.

I bet you've had the argument about washing /his filth 100000 times. Don't do it anymore cut it short and leave. He knows you don't like him living this way so he will needle you with it.

Think of yourself and your marriage and your kids. You'd never dream of subjecting your son's to what your dad does to you. Focus on your own wee family and step back from your father. Not easy but small steps will really help xxx

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