When parent says they wish they were dead as they've had enough of life...

[walkingonthemoon]

Hi

Any advice? Kind words? Would counselling help?

My mum has been diagnosed with cancer (again) at 81. She's frail, has carers and is totally fed up. Lost her independence.

Feeling at a loss.

I suspect my Mum will say the same soon. In her 70 with multiple co morbidities and as result of a fall is currently bed bound, in pain and doubly incontentient. This is unlikely to change. I’ve been laying awake thinking I’m going to sort out my own advanced medical planning. If it was me I wouldn’t want things like uti/chest infections treated, I would like to slip into spesis and die.

My mum hasn't explicitly said this, but she's said similar things. To be honest, I can see her point. She's got a variety of health problems which mean that she's often in pain or feels rubbish and can't walk far. She may have early dementia, which she's aware of, and her anxiety and apathy mean she never wants to go anywhere or do anything very much. She does still take pleasure in her grandchildren, but as they grow up, there's less opportunity for her to really be involved in their lives. She spends most of the time sitting at home, oing nothing, fretting about her health problems and various other anxieties, and becoming irritable.

In her case though, she's only 76. None of her health problems are life threatening (apart from the possible dementia, and that's not definite). She could live another 10 or 15 years quite easily (possibly longer). She has nothing to look forward to except her mobility getting her worse, her grip on reality getting weaker, and her world continuing to shrink - and i suspect she lives in fear of losing her (much fitter but also slightly older) husband, which would render her immediately much more vulnerable. She could sign a DNR etc, but unless she becomes really ill or has an accident, that wouldn't make any difference - and to be honest, I'm not sure she'd want to anyway - it would make her so anxious to think about it.

I totally understand how she feels when she says that everyone lives too long these days, and there's really nothing I can do except sympathise.

I think this is much more common than is expressed tbh, people come to a point where they feel they have little quality of life, are in pain, Ill, feel vulnerable, frustrated and a burden to the people they love. My dad has dementia, he's still physically well and mentally well enough to enjoy life but has told us very, very clearly that once he's just "a burden" then he no longer wishes to be alive. It's heartbreaking for the people left behind so the temptation is to cling onto them and push for life-prolonging measures at any cost but I do wonder whether there needs to be a real shift in thinking so that we start allowing people to in these circumstances to have painless and dignified end of life treatment.
Then on the other hand I look at that last sentence and think it sounds a bit chillingly dystopian so I'm in two minds about it all really.
It's all incredibly hard though OP, sending your way.

My dad started saying this in his mid-80s. He had polio as a boy and it's still affecting him. His legs don't work any more and he's gradually losing the use of his arms. He's in pain most of the time and he's had enough. He still has a good appetite and enjoys music, so that's something, but I can perfectly understand why he says he's lived long enough.

I've had quite a few elderly people tell me they don't want to live any more. One woman, wracked with osteoporosis, told me 'I'm just trying to stay sane until the end' and that's stayed with me. Not much you can say to that, really.

Working in palliative care, I see people who have had enough all the time.

It is often interpreted by families as the person having 'given up' and that if only we could improve their mood things would be better.

Having done this job for many many years, my experience is that the overwhelming majority of times the person is just aware of their body and knows that things are going very very wrong and expressing reality. It's hard for someone without advanced cancer to picture how bloody awful it makes you feel, even if you aren't in pain. And of course families don't want to lose their loved one. But it's actually rare to see someone who has 'given up' ahead of time.

DM was in pretty good health for a 92 year old, but she had gone I to a home to keep her very poorly husband company, and couldn't mentally cope on her own even with a live in carer.

Most of her friends had died, my dad had died 39 years ago, she had remarried and now her second husband was in a terrible state. She had a living will for no treatment, she needed a stent, but declined. She was taken into hospital a few times by ambulance crew and self discharged.

Finally she decided against COVID vaccines. In the end she caught COVID before the roll out, and died on the same day as her husband. It was a blessed relief for her, and I am probably one of the very few who is glad that she didn't get treatment, or go into hospital, but was allowed to die with dignity in her care home, with her husband.

And the brutal truth is that the whole 'becoming a burden' thing has an element of truth. I love my mum dearly, and I certainly don't begrudge any of the support she needs, but it's undeniably true that our interactions have already shifted from a laugh over a glass of wine or a game of scrabble and a nice Sunday lunch, to long (frequently repeated) conversations about her health and her worries. The love hasn't gone out of our time together, but if I'm honest then a lot of the joy has.

This is very true - my elderly ma veers from saying she has had enough (when feeling poorly) to recently telling me she wants to live to be 100…It is nice that she feels positive - I would not want her quality of life (she is frail, inactive and in supported living) and TBH I view the future with misgiving as she is steadily declining, but that is just the way it goes…

I also think that by the time elderly people are voicing it to their relatives, which will be very hard for many of them, they may well have been feeling this way for significantly longer.

i think every old person thinks this eventually. It’s normal and not necessarily depression but a realistic asessment of things

Agree - yep I can see why you feel like that mum. Assuming you do.
but as we can’t take you to the vet and have you put down I’m here to make sure we have some little sparkly pockets of fun - what would you like ? ( places to go , things to watch / listen to , food or drink ? My mum had a wee drop of baileys in her terminal 2 days at home and giggled like a kid. I also brought a weak g&t into hospital in a water bottle - it wasn’t the alcohol it was the naughtiness that sparked her 😁)

mum whilst we are thinking of this sort of thing I think we need to set down your wishes as to how you want to be looked after. She needs an advanced care plan /RESPECT form or what ever they are called round your way. Gp or nurse or what ever can do - it’s pretty clear mum wants to be allowed to pass peacefully when she does and no k e try to drag her back withCPR for instance - make sure that’s explicit - but also how interventionist would she like people to be if she gets a chest infection etc most people thinK and decide no hospital for chest infection but if I break a leg I’ll have that sorted type of thing.

hugs. It’s really hard but actually you can help your mum to have the kindest death in a way she wants.

I have heard many older people express their wish to not be alive any more.
Why doesn't your Mum stop taking her medication unless she feels a direct benefit from ie painkillers and sleeping tablets? Is that something you could discuss with her?