sister and motability car

[Oblahdeeoblahdoe]

Would love your thoughts on this. The background is there are 4 siblings including me and our 84 year old DM. Generally we all do our bit to help her albeit I do the most with hospital/ doctors /opticians appointments as I'm retired. I found out today that my sister has had a brand new car on Motability and is paying DM what she would otherwise receive in disability payments. She's done this with no consultation with the rest of us. Indeed one of my DBs suggested he could the very same thing a few years ago but same sister strongly objected. DM has early signs of vascular dementia although seems to understand this situation. I feel quite cross as I think my sister has a brand new car to swan about it but won't be doing all the running around that I do. In fact I'm thinking of stepping back and not doing it anymore. I don't want DM to suffer but she saw fit to hide it from me and my DBs so now will have to ask sister to do it all from now on. It's the sneakiness that's got to me more than anything.

[premicrois]

IPlease try reading my full post before attempting to correct me!

I did. But in the event you are struggling, this is what I responded to...


Also, adults are no longer in receipt of DLA! It is now only in existence for disabled children (apart from an exceptionally tiny number of people).

So, it seems your argument that adults don't get DLA was indeed nonsense, as I said, and you even went on to confirm as such.

[nokidshere]

@nokidshere Please stop attacking everyone

Lol except I don't write that post, you are quoting the wrong person 😂 chill

[Babyroobs]

@boboshmobo

Does your mum get dla just for being old and having dementia ?
My mum is in this position , I didn't know you could get dla ! 🤔

No, people cannot make a new claim for DLA. Some older people have been on DLA for years and don't get re-assessed, so if they had mobility before turning pension age they just carry on getting it forever really as don't seem to get re-assessed. I guess DWP think that as people age , then mobility is unlikely to improve. If however a person is already over state pension and not in receipt of a disability benefit already when they turn state pension age, they can only apply for Attendance allowance which has no mobility element. So you end up with two elderly people who may be equally restricted with mobility issues wheras one can be getting DLA or PIp and a motorbility car paid for, and another can't get any mobility component. It's an unfair situation and many older people get very upset about it when they find out they can't get a motorbility car ! I guess the government think that eventually most elderley people's mobility would be poor enough to qualify nd they can't be affording motorbility cars for all. many people do continue to drive well into their eighties and I guess as mobility gets poorer, they rely on their cars more yet many can't afford to get any help like those that get morobility do.

[Babyroobs]

@premicrois

IPlease try reading my full post before attempting to correct me!

I did. But in the event you are struggling, this is what I responded to...


Also, adults are no longer in receipt of DLA! It is now only in existence for disabled children (apart from an exceptionally tiny number of people).

So, it seems your argument that adults don't get DLA was indeed nonsense, as I said, and you even went on to confirm as such.

Many adults do seem to still get DLA. those numbers will be dwindling, it is only those born before a certain date who never got re-assessed for PIP. There are still a fair few of them though.

[Babyroobs]

@Babyroobs

No, people cannot make a new claim for DLA. Some older people have been on DLA for years and don't get re-assessed, so if they had mobility before turning pension age they just carry on getting it forever really as don't seem to get re-assessed. I guess DWP think that as people age , then mobility is unlikely to improve. If however a person is already over state pension and not in receipt of a disability benefit already when they turn state pension age, they can only apply for Attendance allowance which has no mobility element. So you end up with two elderly people who may be equally restricted with mobility issues wheras one can be getting DLA or PIp and a motorbility car paid for, and another can't get any mobility component. It's an unfair situation and many older people get very upset about it when they find out they can't get a motorbility car ! I guess the government think that eventually most elderley people's mobility would be poor enough to qualify nd they can't be affording motorbility cars for all. many people do continue to drive well into their eighties and I guess as mobility gets poorer, they rely on their cars more yet many can't afford to get any help like those that get morobility do.

The most frequently asked question I get at work is "why can't I get a motorbility car like Joan next door has, I'm far worse than she is. It's hard to explain the rules to people sometimes. People sit at community coffee mornings and church groups and hospital clinics and compare the benefits they are on and tell each other what they can and can't get without knowing the specifics of the rules regarding benefits.

[Babyroobs]

@boboshmobo

Does your mum get dla just for being old and having dementia ?
My mum is in this position , I didn't know you could get dla ! 🤔

If your mum does not already get a disability benefit like Attendance Allowance, PIP or DLA then she can make a claim for Attendance Allowance if she has significant ongoing difficulties during the day or night or both and has had these difficulties for 6 months. So if she has difficulties getting washed and dressed, moving around the house or needs help with supervision, prompting, phone calls, paper work etc then she could apply. If awarded attendance allowance and she has a formal dementia diagnosis then she could also apply for the severe mental impairment disregard which would give her money off her council tax bill ( 25% ).

[Lovelydovey]

The fact that your DSis is paying your DM the equivalent of what she would have otherwise received in cash suggests that your sister views this as her personal vehicle.

Not sure I could bring myself to shop her given the risk of family fall out, but I certainly wouldn’t be offering any more lifts and would make the point thay she had the car specifically to support DM.

[Chateau13]

@Brotherlove

It's not illegal. Every case is different and to be discussed and insured as such with motability. A child's motability car can be used as the family car to do everyday things while the child is in school. Motability will approve this - they don't expect 2 cars to sit on the drive needlessly.

My S is an adult and lives at home.

[Dinoboymama]

If the person is paying someone the equivalent of the DLA motability money then that is wrong. It means it's not being used for their needs which a motability car is meant to be used for.

The disabled person does not need to be in the car at all times when it's in use. Our child has one. We are allowed to use the car as a family car as they are a child. The car is in their name despite being 12 years old.

Couples, parents etc can go to work with the car if they live with the person and support them as long as the income is also to benefit the disabled person the exception to that rule is if you were a delivery driver etc.

If your dsis lives away from your DM has the car been recorded as being at hers if not that could breach the contract also if she lives more than 5 miles away they could put a tracker on the car to record where it's been used. Not everyone gets a tracker but they are using them a lot more where there could be a suspected breach of the contract you sign.

With a blue badge it's different it can only be used when the disabled person is getting out or entering the car. They can't just be sitting in it in the space and not entering or exiting this is where people get muddled up between the two and think they must always be in the motability car when in use.

I'd report it to motability tbh alot of people use the service correctly but if they are not they should lose that. We are so grateful to have access to a motability car. We wish we didn't need one but having one has changed our lives for the better.

[boboshmobo]

@Babyroobs thank you , I have got her both of those . I wasn't sure if you could get dla on top.. she is self funding her care due to assets so anything I can claim back will help !

[bubbles2023]

There a few different issues here. If your dsis is paying your dm the equivalent then your dm is no worse off financially. However this agreement relies on your dsis actually paying your dm. What would happen if your dsis stopped paying? Would your dm be in dire straits financially?

The rules around motability use are very general. If your dsis picks up a prescription once a month or does a bit of shopping for her dm then this would prob be seen as reasonable.

If your dm is not of sound mind then your dsis should've consulted with the other siblings. Does anybody have power of attorney?

[TiptoeThroughTheToadstools]

This sounds like a case of benefit fraud to me. Be careful though as your mum would get in to trouble too and could loose her pip/dla

[premicrois]

@TiptoeThroughTheToadstools

This sounds like a case of benefit fraud to me. Be careful though as your mum would get in to trouble too and could loose her pip/dla

She is entitled to the DLA and just have been for many years so that's not at risk. The car would be lost, not the mothers overall entitlement to her DLA.

[premicrois]

Must have been

[Babyroobs]

@bubbles2023

There a few different issues here. If your dsis is paying your dm the equivalent then your dm is no worse off financially. However this agreement relies on your dsis actually paying your dm. What would happen if your dsis stopped paying? Would your dm be in dire straits financially?

The rules around motability use are very general. If your dsis picks up a prescription once a month or does a bit of shopping for her dm then this would prob be seen as reasonable.

If your dm is not of sound mind then your dsis should've consulted with the other siblings. Does anybody have power of attorney?

Surely it's not really about the mum being worse off is it ? The motorbility scheme is very good value for the value of the higher rate mobility component, and therefore it benefits the disabled person. If the sister is benefiting more from this great deal and using the car for her own use more than anything else then this is clearly not right ?

[sashh]

@Mrsjayy

Why didn't your sister just lease a car it makes no sense, your poor mum probably couldn't say no and thought she was being nice! Just give your Sister your mum's appointments and errand lists and let her crack on.

No road tax?
Lives near a toll road / bridge / tunnel and doesn't want to pay?

[Mrsjayy]

@sashh

No road tax?
Lives near a toll road / bridge / tunnel and doesn't want to pay?

Ah of course free road tax !

[MamaDollyorJesus]

@sashh & @Mrsjayy you can get the free road tax for a car without having a motability car as part of DLA/PIP.

However, the rules for that do state that the vehicle must only be used by or for the disabled person - but I'm sure plenty of people don't follow that rule & does seem silly as people like my aunt can't drive but would be eligible yet they couldn't use it on the family car as my uncle is the driver & it's not only used for my aunt.

[qpmz]

Who has the disabilities that warrant the motorbility car? Is it your sister or your mother?

[ancientgran]

@Babyroobs

People just carry on getting it indefinitely if they've had it before they turned pension age. And DLA was so much easier to get than PIP is now. Personally think it's ridiculous it carries on forever when the scheme often seems to be abused by family members.

I don't think everyone gets it indefinitely. My DH got it as a lifetime award as there is no prospect of his condition improving but at the time we were told not everyone got the lifetime/indefinite award and he might have to be reassessed from time to time, I think it was every three years but I'm not sure about that.

[premicrois]

@ancientgran

After pension age it should be a light touch 10 year review, not a 3 year

[ancientgran]

@Babyroobs

No, people cannot make a new claim for DLA. Some older people have been on DLA for years and don't get re-assessed, so if they had mobility before turning pension age they just carry on getting it forever really as don't seem to get re-assessed. I guess DWP think that as people age , then mobility is unlikely to improve. If however a person is already over state pension and not in receipt of a disability benefit already when they turn state pension age, they can only apply for Attendance allowance which has no mobility element. So you end up with two elderly people who may be equally restricted with mobility issues wheras one can be getting DLA or PIp and a motorbility car paid for, and another can't get any mobility component. It's an unfair situation and many older people get very upset about it when they find out they can't get a motorbility car ! I guess the government think that eventually most elderley people's mobility would be poor enough to qualify nd they can't be affording motorbility cars for all. many people do continue to drive well into their eighties and I guess as mobility gets poorer, they rely on their cars more yet many can't afford to get any help like those that get morobility do.

Being disabled enough to get DLA when you are young isn't fair either. We definitely lost out financially when my DH became disabled in his 40s and couldn't work. I don't think the difference between DLA and AA after 65 compares to what he lost. I'm not really sure how we can make everything fair. He's never chosen to have a motability car though.

[ancientgran]

@premicrois

@ancientgran

After pension age it should be a light touch 10 year review, not a 3 year

Thanks, it was 30 odd years ago so I wasn't sure. He's never had a review though, I have suggested he applies for a review as his care needs are higher than they were 30 years ago but he doesn't want the hassle and uncertainty. I think he has higher rate for mobility and middle for care.

[Change2banon]

@Mrsjayy

Ah of course free road tax !

Free road tax
Free insurance
Free breakdown recovery
Free tyres
Free servicing/routine repairs/mot

Its a very good scheme - for those that are actually entitled, unlike OP’s sister who is definitely abusing this.

OP, I’d do as you plan, send your sister a list of all appointments, shopping etc - tell her that as she has the use of ‘mum’s’ Motability car, then all errands etc are now her responsibility. If she doesn’t carry out these responsibilities I would then report to Motability.

[Mrsjayy]

@ancientgran

I don't think everyone gets it indefinitely. My DH got it as a lifetime award as there is no prospect of his condition improving but at the time we were told not everyone got the lifetime/indefinite award and he might have to be reassessed from time to time, I think it was every three years but I'm not sure about that.

Indefinitely doesn't mean that any more unfortunately I had the old mobility allowance for life but didn't get pip automatically I had to jump through a million hoops it was a nightmare despite having the exact same condition as before.