Elderly DM

[Guardsman18]

I'm hoping that someone wiser than me can help with this as I'm struggling.

I have posted before but things have moved on a bit. My DM (85) is getting over a UTI. I rang an ambulance, waited 12 hours but when they rang, she got to the phone before me and cancelled it.

Since then, just over a week, she has become very frail, not much of an appetite and very down although she does get herself to the loo now.

She insists that she doesn't want carers to help with showering etc. She wants me and my DB to look after her. I have said that if you want that, then it will have to be when we are available. (We have been to her house every day - DB am and me pm and I did go one evening to make sure she could dress for bed when particularly frail. One day isn't enough I know.)

Am I being horrible to not offer to bathe/wash her? I really don't want to do it, nor am I strong enough really. What if she fell in the shower? The cleaner washed her hair today and I suppose that's up to her. Where does it end though?

I feel so bad for not wanting to do these things but want to put things in place so that life is more comfortable for her. She won't have it though. She asked me today to do my DB's ironing as she's always done it. I did hers last week but feel that at 64 he should learn to do his own! It's as if I'm hurting her by saying that I won't do his washing but I don't see why I should. It just seems a bit late now to make a point.

I have to go out shortly so if apologies if I don't reply quickly. I would appreciate people's thoughts on where I go from here. Thank you.

You need to set the boundary. No, you aren't obliged to wash her/care for her/anything at all. You definitely don't do your brothers washing!!!!!
If she won't accept care then that's her right to make 'bad' decisions - you don't have to fill the gap. Continue to do only what you can manage, nothing else.

I completely agree with @Lightuptheroom
I would advise not to get embroiled. My DH is currently making 4 visits daily to his ‘D’F and it is killing him. This is not the retirement we planned.
Every additional task/visit becomes the norm and another is added. Your life is taken over.
It seems completely unfair to me that one persons choice should overshadow that of another person and eat up their life.
Please put yourself first, it is what you deserve.
BTW if your DM accepts the cleaner washing her hair then it’s a small step to accepting a carer.
Contact her GP and ask for an OT assessment and state that you cannot do what is being demanded of you.
Good luck

No! No! No! My mother wanted me to do everything for her including personal care but that is where I drew the line. In the 15 months before she went into hospital/home she had carers but she would beg me to get her ready for bed before the carer came! I managed to hold the line on that one but she was not happy with me. But I was in a better position than you because we had carers.

And, whatever you do, do not do your brother's ironing. It is the sort of thing my mum would have expected me to do. She was disabled with arthritis but she seemed to think that I would do all the stuff she would usually have done for other people - as well as all the stuff I needed to do for my own family!

Thanks for your replies. Why a woman of my age needs validation like this is beyond me but it really does help to know that I am not wrong.

A few years ago she asked me to do his ironing and when I said no, she was a bit shirty saying that she would ask the cleaner then. I just said - he's ok with that is he? It just seems such a ridiculous thing to get cross about. I can feel myself getting/feeling a bit childish about it. She says he brings her strawberries each day from his garden as he's encouraging her to eat - I feel like saying - bugger the strawberries, get him to do his own washing!

I find it difficult to know when the child in me is coming out (if it is) or when I am justified to feel as I do. It's not a competition but feel like it is sometimes - and I'm not playing. Yesterday I asked if there was washing to be put in - no, I don't think brother has brought his yet. So another thing that I'm not doing to help.

I don't think I'm cut out for this!

@Guardsman18 you have to be prepared to seperate 'daughter' from 'unpaid carer' - as we've all said, you're not there to do tasks... Visit, make a cup of tea, chat, laugh, listen to music etc but do not get drawn in to putting washing on, ironing, hoovering etc.. especially when it's not even your mums! He can put the washing on when he does his. Don't start to feel guilty about what you aren't doing. Each person makes their own personal choice of what they are willing (and able) to do - as said in another thread where the brother is doing nothing, you cannot make them do what they don't want to do - which goes equally for the brother who isn't bothered and thinks he's covering his bit by bringing strawberries, to the person who refuses to accept cleaners/carers/help of any kind.
Have a look in the elderly parents board for the thread 'cockroach cafe' (I'm useless at linking unfortunately) come and join us for chat and laughs, we all understand where you're coming from.

My mum is 75 but very frail, she's in and out of hospital all the time and always tells them "my daughter looks after me", do I bloody want to - no I don't, she self neglects but I've reached the conclusion that's her choice as she has capacity. The resentment for her that I now have is immeasurable. Being forced to be someone's carer is a terrible thing.

My mum would say to the carer "Don't do that - Hairbrush will do it when she comes in. Just sit down and have a chat!" As though I didn't spend hours with her every day anyway.

I was receiving Carers Allowance for mum but I hadn't realised that I had any say in the care I could provide. It was actually when we said to SS that we would do meals, food and shopping but I would not provide personal care that they actually looked to increase the care package. In the event it would not have been enough but I had no idea that "no" was an option.

Thanks so much for your replies. I'll join the cockroach cafe thread. I could do with a laugh! I just feel so guilty but justified in sticking to my guns. Maybe the guilt is better than the caring duties required?

I am struggling to understand how anyone who wishes to stay at home in their old age does not see that putting things in place will help that and not hinder. Perhaps when I'm 85 I'll come back and explain but it just seems so daft and a bit selfish tbh. That might be unfair of me.

Interesting about the cleaner doing her hair - maybe she could/would want to come more than once a week although I can't imagine she would want to do more personal care. She's a very sweet person (unlike me!) so she might.

All these maybes. I don't mind doing things like changing the duvet to the summer one because it's June and then changing it back again last week because it's colder. I can even get my head around ironing even though there were ten pairs of knickers and 8 tee shirts. Yes I counted them. I am so petty these days.

Just noticed the time - have to go. It comes to something when a visit to hospital for a scan is a nice afternoon out!

My mum has dementia and has someone going in 4 times a day to give her food and do some basic jobs. My mum hates it and isn't always nice to them because she feels resentful. But hopefully we compensate them for that in other ways.

But my sister and I alternate a week on and off, and we probably call at hers 4 or 5 times a week. We wash her hair twice a week and shower her once a week. I balked initially but it's fine now. And mum's so much happier. She'd definitely feel uncomfortable if a stranger washed her, though. I'd definitely look at engaging your cleaner to wash her hair regularly. And you have to put your foot down about carers because you really can't do as much as you're doing for too long. You'll just go under,and then you'll be if even less help to her.

Its hard enough looking after a parent but no way would I be taking on looking after a sibling as well.

I've occasionally done my mum's personal care but tbh I've then used that information as proof the current situation wasn't working, not in order to prop it up. Eg I sometimes took her in the shower when she was in hospital because the ward team including the very tough sister couldn't get her to do it and she was incontinent and stank of wee, but I then fed that into the discharge plan (still took one complete disaster before they accepted she needed something beyond the norm). I very occasionally help her to the loo in her current home tbh to be sure that my good opinion of their care is justified.

It sounds like this would be an extremely slippery slope. Dont do it. And of course you're not going to do a grown man's washing! But you're also not going to obsess over it. That's the point to have a laugh 'sorry Mum just because he fluttered his eyelashes at you for 64 years, it won't work with me, the lazy so and so! Do you remember when he was 8 and forged his schol report...' etc etc. Also try out a few things like 'oh that sounds difficult, what are you going to do about it?' Be her cheerleader, not the whole team.

I am struggling to understand how anyone who wishes to stay at home in their old age does not see that putting things in place will help that and not hinder. Putting things in place means admitting to yourself that there are now things which you can’t cope with, and that you’re further down the road to care than you would wish. It’s a misapplied “fake it till you can make it”

I just wanted to offer my support to you. Does your DB live with her? If not is he taking his laundry round for her to do?

I have two brothers, the patriarchy worship is strong in our family but the buck stops with me. My DM created this and it's the example set to her by her own mother who used to get my mum to spruce her up for a visit from her sons - always the women who had to do the grunt work whilst the men swan around oblivious.
I'm glad of this thread after I had to do a bit more personal care than I'm comfortable with last week. I hated every moment I've felt guilty about that ever since but I'm just not cut out for that sort of thing (I applaud nurses and carers everywhere). I'm glad to learn others feel the same about personal care.
Be kind to yourself and don't live by others' standards. And if at 64 your DB doesn't know how to iron then shame on him, and shame on your DM (sorry but it's true) for not teaching him.

OP
there is no planet on which these requests are okay.

what does your brother think? If she thinks the sun shines out of his arse, then if he thinks she needs a carer, will she listen to him?

My mother was like this. She has been dead now for almost a year and I feel anger towards her because she refused to have a carer and my two sisters had to look after her between them. I live in the UK and have teenagers. They put pressure on me to go to Ireland regularly to help. It put stress on my marriage and when I was in Ireland doing my share of care, I felt guilty about leaving my teens.

As a result I barely speak to my sisters now as they really were bullying me to come over and treated me very badly when I was there.
All could have been avoided if my mother accepted carers! (which she could have afforded)

Thank you for your replies. I haven't been logged in for a few days and had forgotten my password!

Things have changed a bit in the last few days. DM is feeling much better (UTI wise) and has now told me not to come - she'll see me when she sees me! Brother still bringing strawberries and has also added blackberries. It looks as though I won't need to do any caring duties after all.

There is something strange going on - she now feels that DF's will was too generous to my DC's and that the house should go to my brother. Not sure where that leaves me but there isn't a lot I can do. DM does have this thing where he should be entitled to things as the older sibling - a chair that's been in the family for many years, her wedding ring - but the house. I'm quite hurt to be honest but at least it explains why she's been pushing us away.

Anyway, should she allow me into her life I'll come back to the thread and re read the advice.

So she planning to change her Will in favour of your DB?

Very hurtful too!

I guess she'll have to. He asked her if he could have the house a few years ago. This conversation seemed more serious though. Talking to me about the money she has to give my DC's, feeling that DF was too generous/unnecessary and that because brother has not very nice neighbours, then him living in her house would be the answer. He could have a long wait - she could live until she's 90 +.

I am really hurt. I feel like a little girl! My DF would be very disappointed as I'm sure he thought that things were sorted when they did their mirror wills some years ago.

That could be very interesting indeed!
DB could move in and take care of all your DMs needs and you could continue to enjoy your life only seeing both occasionally !!

They have such capacity to hurt, don’t they!
The things my mum would say to me….
How did you respond to all this?

He doesn't want to live with her, just when she's dead.

I know - I find it difficult to wrap my head around - that a woman of my age could still be hurt but I am. I am nearly (not quite) at the stage of saying bugger the pair of you but that might not be even needed as nobody is bothering with me!

Mine still hurts me and she’s dead!!
They will bother with you as soon as they need help!

To answer your question - I said that it was awful to hear her feel like that about the money for DC's. That it was a gift from Grampa. Told her that it was half of what she thought it was. That I didn't understand where this was all coming from. She said that the house would have to be sold as per the will and I assured her that it didn't if DB wanted it. Asked her why she was worrying about it when it's for me and DB to sort from her estate. She just keeps saying that she wants him to have the house.