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Elderly parents
Original poster

What's wrong with selling a house you don't live in?

299 replies

Kendodd · 08/09/2021 22:48

On the back of the NI increase.
If an elderly person living alone moves into a care home, well, why wouldn't they sell their house anyway? They're not going to be going back to live there, the house would be sitting empty and we don't have enough houses for people to live in. The elderly person would then also have a huge amount of money to supplement their income in their last few years. As far as I can see the benefits for everyone far outweigh any reasons for keeping the house.

For what it's worth, I don't think there should have been an NI rise or people paying a fortune for their own care. I think inheritance tax should have been increased instead. I don't get the outrage about selling houses nobody lives in though.

OP posts:
SuperCaliFragalistic · 08/09/2021 23:00

Well, that obviously makes lots of sense and I agree with you. But some people want to have their cake and eat it.

PermanentTemporary · 08/09/2021 23:01

I have no idea why selling an asset to pay for care is such a terrible thing, no. It's a bit of a one generation deal though, very soon nobody will have these big debt free assets, so it needs changing.

HeddaGarbled · 08/09/2021 23:01

Inheritance. An obsession of Conservative voters.

MistySkiesAfterRain · 08/09/2021 23:02

Because they may have wished to pass on some of the value of their house to DC/GC.

OldScrappyAndHungry · 08/09/2021 23:03

Totally agree. It’s batshit. Of course your house should be sold to pay for care. There literally isn’t any other option that is affordable in the long run.

But the OBSESSION in this country with inheritance is insane.

PamDenick · 08/09/2021 23:04

The people who may benefit from this are likely to be conservative voters: the people who will be paying for it (for instance the care workers) are likely to not be conservative voters…

AlexaShutUp · 08/09/2021 23:05

I agree with you about inheritance tax. It's the obvious solution.

However, what happens if one person is still living in the house while their spouse needs care. Would they have to sell up to release the funds? That would seem quite unfair tbh.

25yearsnhsworker · 08/09/2021 23:05

Because people want to pass it down and not use for care. Imagine some of the price increases of some of these properties.

Original poster
Kendodd · 08/09/2021 23:06

I've read the average stay in a care home is two years. So that means the house would be sitting empty for two years, being of no use to anyone.

OP posts:
25yearsnhsworker · 08/09/2021 23:08

Does anyone know the percentage of people that require social care? None of my grandparents have. 3 lived to 80's and one to 95.

AlexaShutUp · 08/09/2021 23:08

@MistySkiesAfterRain

Because they may have wished to pass on some of the value of their house to DC/GC.
Well, yes, they may have wished to pass it on, but if they need to use the money for their own care, then that's just one of those things, isn't it?

Yes, it's a lottery because some people need a lot of care and others don't. That's why heavily taxing inheritance would help to spread the risk. People would not be able to pass everything on to their DC, but they would be at less risk of passing on nothing.

Original poster
Kendodd · 08/09/2021 23:14

I don't think people should have to pay for care (accommodation, yes, care, no). I do agree with higher inheritance tax though, enough to cover the NI increase. I don't understand why its preferable to take money from people that they work for and have to carefully budget to make last but not ok to tax a huge unearned windfall. I don't really understand why lottery wins aren't taxes either.

OP posts:
MyOtherProfile · 08/09/2021 23:16

Totally agree with you @Kendodd

AlexaShutUp · 08/09/2021 23:18

I don't understand why its preferable to take money from people that they work for and have to carefully budget to make last but not ok to tax a huge unearned windfall.

Presumably because a lot of Tory MPs and their wealthy donors stand to gain much more from keeping their inheritance than they will lose through the increased NI payments.

SuperCaliFragalistic · 08/09/2021 23:20

Not everyone needs to go into residential care. Many people use the care system for personal and nursing care whilst remaining in their home (sometimes with a spouse or adult child). Some people downsize or move somewhere more accessible and free up cash to make their latter years more comfortable, negating the need for a care home. There aren't loads of empty houses sat around while their owners are in care homes.

Dinkydonk55 · 08/09/2021 23:22

I work in this field and just today had a family member quite aggressive saying why should my father have to sell his home, so he shouldn’t have worked all his life then and saved should he, he should’ve been a council tenant and then you’d pay. Or something along those lines.
I think people can see their inheritance slip away.
And sadly with the cost of care homes being what it is, for many people all the money is used up.

I can see both sides. It does seem massively unfair that for example because my grandparents were all lucky enough not to get dementia and didn’t require years of care, there is a lot more ‘family money’.

BasiliskStare · 08/09/2021 23:27

I think ( & grandparents were in this situation ) it is fair that their assets pay for care. If that means less inheritance - well so be it. Not sure they should have been able to hang on to their house but others pay for their care.

MistySkiesAfterRain · 08/09/2021 23:31

I think its likely inheritance tax will increase eventually.

OldScrappyAndHungry · 08/09/2021 23:35

@AlexaShutUp if there is a surviving spouse then the house doesn’t need to be sold.

OldScrappyAndHungry · 08/09/2021 23:39

@25yearsnhsworker but massive house price rises are inequitable unearned wealth so it would be absolutely fair to take that to pay for care.

We’re in this position - own a house worth a lot of money. If either DH or I need a care that’s what we’d use. If we don’t then our kids will get it. Life’s unfair but the kids know not to bank on inheritance because it’s not a given.

serialname · 08/09/2021 23:39

I agree entirely. If you have a house and move into residential or nursing home and leave your house empty of course you should sell it to pay.

If I had £500,000 in the bank I'd be expected to pay. I don't see any difference.

All this "but I worked for it and want to pass it to my children" is irrelevant and selfish.

Boomkin · 08/09/2021 23:44

It does seem massively unfair that for example because my grandparents were all lucky enough not to get dementia and didn’t require years of care, there is a lot more ‘family money’.
It’s also massively unfair that some families own houses to leave to the next generation and others don’t. But we aren’t implementing a tax to even out that inequality. So why should we implement a tax to even out the inequality that some people need care and some dont?

SinisterBumFacedCat · 08/09/2021 23:46

If we had affordable housing no one would be bothered about inheritance, but for many it is now the only way of finding a deposit. People have been sold for years on the idea of home ownership guaranteeing you can pass something on to your children and grandchildren, it’s not really unreasonable that they are fed up that they can’t, especially when they end up loosing the life lottery already when it comes to ways to die ( who would really choose the slow, terrifying decline of dementia for themselves or their families).

Dementia is genetic, both my parents have different forms young, I know what is likely to happen to me and really little amount of lifestyle choices is going to make a difference. I also know the stresses and strains this will put onto my family, because I have lived it, and trust me, if it’s 2 years on average in residential care the family have been gradually picking up years of care themselves before it becomes impossible, for years they save the country money.

Contrary to everything on social media today not every elderly person in a care home is a landlord sitting on millions, they might have one local ex authority terraced house that they wanted split between their GC to pass on a deposit.

I get that no one really gives a shit about families like mine, in future generations you will easily spot those with the added bonus of dementia because they will all be trapped in poverty.

SinisterBumFacedCat · 08/09/2021 23:50

Thank Christ the NHS was started in the 1940’s, there is so little empathy now.

OldScrappyAndHungry · 08/09/2021 23:56

It’s not a question of lack of empathy - we are a massively ageing population, we don’t have spare cash to fund this stuff.

My dad died in a care home of dementia so it’s not a question of not giving a shit either. His care was so fucking expensive and the staff caring for him paid a pittance. Those same staff are now facing tax hikes so that those people lucky enough to make a killing on the property market can hold onto their money.

That’s disgraceful and totally unjust. They are the people I worry about. I couldn’t work in a care home for all the tea in China and I’m in awe of those who can. We’ll be utterly buggered without them and we’re already facing a care staff crisis.

This half arsed piece of shit plan by Johnson isn’t going to help the staffing crisis one bit.