School want a meeting, I prefer to do it by email...

[annielouise]

Sorry it's long...
My son's school want a meeting. He's been bullied and has retaliated. The meeting isn't specifically about his retaliation - he's getting detention for that which I don't have a problem with. What I do have a problem with is that they're now downgrading it to a problem "between" my son and this other boy whereas for months they seemed to be accepting it was bullying - albeit my son is retaliating (which is not great). Also,I've told them my concern they're not following their bullying procedure from what I can gather - recording of incidents, speaking about bullying in assembly, details about bullying up around the school. Worst of all they've left my son in a vulnerable position on a number of occasions - e.g. sending him on a school trip with no teacher on the school bus or at the leisure centre where they went which resulted in him being ganged up on by 5, pushed into walls, jumped on, called gay and saying he's got mental health issues on the bus back home (no teacher with them), empty bottles thrown at him etc and supply teachers on other occasions that haven't been able to control the class who my son has gone up to for help who have done nothing. The school trip was when they knew these boys were troublemakers yet they put no teacher with them, knowing that so no foresight.

The thing is I'm so stressed and wired up and close to breaking down in tears I don't think a meeting would be conducive to anything. My experience of them is there'll be 2 or 3 of them against me (I know I can take someone else in but it'll be me having to do all the talking) and I'd be at a disadvantage. I'm feeling emotional, naturally, and envisage it falling apart as I have very little faith in them. I've already had one conversation with them which fell apart as she only focused on my son retaliating not what they were doing to stop the bullying in the first place. I also know how they can twist things to their advantage so I imagine it will end up confrontational.

I've requested my concerns be answered in writing - either email or letter - and am willing to listen to anything they have to say if they write it down to me. I've explained this will give me a chance to digest it and respond accordingly. To my mind it takes the emotional aspect out of it. They don't seem to be ready to do this, inanely keep offering a meeting as they know they will have the upper hand. Am I being unreasonable to insist communication is by written word to avoid confusion/confrontation? And are they being unreasonable to insist I go in?

Apart from retaliating to bullying my son has an exemplary record - and I really mean this. I think he's the only boy in his class not to have any behaviour warning at all (yr 7).

My son is refusing to go back at the moment and has been off since last Thursday. They don't see particularly bothered, just saying they look forward to his return.

Sounds frightening.

Find your most practical and sensible friend. Possibly someone who has to deal with difficult circumstances in a work context and who will be constructive but not easily intimidated.

Then sit down together and decide what outcome you want from the meeting.

Next draft an email which sets out your concerns, evidenced where possible, the impact and what action you feel needs to be taken. Stress that your concern is the welfare of your child. Then say that you are willing to meet and that you expect unless you hear otherwise for the meeting to reflect the content of your email. Explain that you will be taking a friend because you are very upset and you believe this will help keep the meeting on a practical and constructive footing.

Then do your best to be calm and hold it together. Your friend's aim is to help you do this, but also be a witness and to prevent misrepresentation after the event. She might visibly be seen to be taking notes.

After the meeting it is worth writing to thank them for a "constructive" meeting and listing the areas of agreement and future action, again stressing that the aim is the welfare of your child. The more paper trail you create the more careful they will be.

Ideally you work in partnership with the school and vice versa. Maybe they are worried. But somehow you need to get them beyond the defensive, to acknowledge any problems and talking about simple and practical action.

Good luck. You are clearly and rightly upset. But if you can see it through, it should be worth it.

Thanks Needmoresleep - really good suggestions. Thanks also to Sleepinglion. I think my feelings about it all deep down are I don't trust the school. I don't think it's good enough for my son. There have been too many errors and I don't like the way the tide is turning. I would take him out in an instant as have been considering home education for years. I think schools have been plastering over the cracks of bullying for years. No my son shouldn't have retaliated but a decent framework needs to be in place by a school to try and avoid things like this happening. This is not the only incident. I'm just generally not happy with it and my son is coming round to that train of thought too. I'm trying to be impartial to him. I don't want to make the decision whether to leave for him but at some point I might have to say enough is enough there has to be something better than this - because this stinks. He's constantly looking over his shoulder to see who is going to start trouble for him next. That's not a life.

I've been in the very same position as you... bullying of DD, DD retaliating, the suggestion that it was entirely her fault and several uncomfortable meetings culminating in me siting opposite the Head and 3 teachers who all told me that DD was perfectly happy in the school. This was the child who would come home crying, distressed and angry and who refused to attend on occasion because of the bullying!

I sent an email asking 3 perfectly reasonable questions, such as what the school was going to do about the bullying. It took 9 months, the emails being cc'd to the Head, year head and deputy and eventually a formal complaint and the threat of legal action for failing to comply with their duty of care before I got, in another meeting and not in writing, an unsatisfactory response. Then the beggars told me that I was wasting their time with too many emailed questions and that they wouldn't be answering any further ones!
Rest assured I told them that had they answered me 9 months earlier they might not be in this position.

This too was one of the academically most successful schools in the county.

My advice is to email them, having spoken in advance to the Children's Legal Centre, who are a wealth of information and support. Speak to one of their solicitors and CC every email to them.

I got nowhere with DDs school and was grateful to move house recently, which necessitated a change in schools. DDstarted her new school just today. It isn't as successful as the previous one but today she came home smiling and looking forward to going back tomorrow. TBH I fear that it's all too common for staff to close ranks and deny there is a problem or, as in my case, turn the 'blame' onto the bullied child and if that's the case your son would be better off the hell out of the school.

Wishing you good luck.

Val

Val - this is exactly what I know will happen and I'm not putting myself through it. They will duck and dive and skirt round the issue and introduce new issues showing it's his fault (which is now what has happened). I've asked them to back up by email exactly what he has done. They won't do it - they keep suggesting a meeting, which I know will result in an unsatisfactory response and no clear answer as in your case. They blind you with waffle. Two simple questions I want answered. From my experience it's a losing game, you just go round and round in circles asking the same questions in simpler terms so there is no misunderstanding and they still won't answer them. They will not commit to paper because I know they can't back up what they've said to me.

Thanks you for responding. It backs up my feelings that it would be a frustrating waste of time. I wish your DD all the very best at her new school. My son now wants to be home schooled. He's been off a week and it doesn't look like he'll be in next week either.

annielouise - wonder what the school would say if you were to ask them outright if the reason they won't discuss situation by email is because they can't back up what they're saying and won't comit to paper ?
If you have the energy seeking out a reporter on local newspaper to cover your story might make you feel better ?

Hi violetqueen - it's got to this stage where I've said this to them, that they need to tell me specifically what he's done and if they can't they need to retract it. Relations have broken down so much that I've said I don't believe you can support what you're saying with any facts, which is the reason you won't commit to paper. In the last email I've said any more procrastination and not giving me straight answers I'll be voicing my concerns to the LEA, Estyn (Welsh version of Ofsted) and the local MP. Valhalla's situation sums it up completely. I've asked two simple, straightforward questions - what he's done exactly for them to consider him part of the problem and why this view has changed as for the past 2 months they've accepted it was a bullying problem and had in fact managed to stop 4 of them, just not the one that's persisting. Head of year even told me that this boy has said he's concerned about my son and she believes it! Ridiculous that she's taken in by that after everything he's done - threatening to batter my son to the ground, jumping on his back, pushing him into walls, throwing sharpeners at him, taking people out his work groups, telling people to go up and annoy my son. The head of lower school has spoken to him on a number of occasions about these things. This boy has been in enough trouble before that it needed a letter home to his parents about his behaviour even before he turned his attention to my son. The head of the lower school even said to me when we were speaking that "gangs" were forming (of which this one was involved) which he then said "oh, maybe that's too strong a word". My son is the only boy left in his class that hasn't even had the lowest form of behaviour mark. Yes, he's reacting but that doesn't make him the instigator and they need to clarify that to me. I honestly do not believe they would in a meeting as per Valhalla's experience. They'll fudge it and skirt round it which is why I want the to spell it out or retract it. Still deciding what to do about my son's return to school. I've completely lost faith so not sure it's a good idea anyway. This is the best comp in the area. As far as I can see it's run by people with very little common sense who are struggling to deal with bullying and behaviour. Thanks for the interest. It helps so much to get other views.

Oh gosh ,sounds so awful.
Wish I could think of helpful advice.
Your son's lucky to have you .

Thanks violetqueen. I really appreciate your comments and for saying he's lucky to have me. It helps to talk. Feeling really positive about home education for a while if that's the route we go down. He's a keen learner so not worried about having to push him.

There's this www.mumsnet.com/Talk/home_ed
that might help .
Although you probably know that already !
Feel sure you're right not to leave him at that school .
I always think ," if that's how they treat the parents ..."

Thanks violetqueen, I've been looking at the site already. After a talk this morning, he says he doesn't want to go back. Shame as he got so much out of the extra curricular stuff. We'll have to make a decision soon as we're in limbo at the moment and need to get on with life.

I'm sure you'll find extra curricular activities in your area .
My son likes his Wing Su ( sp ? ) which is defensive martial arts ,swimming ,and now older live action role play ( he does www.spearheadlrp.co.uk/,but they're all over the country www.legionofdreams.com/.has filled a big gap in his social life .
Good luck .

I have a Parent Support Worker (she is nothing to do with school) who I can take in to meetings at school etc,
She is there for ME, not my child or the school,
Im not too good with words etc and she can & will talk on my behalfif I need her to.
The SENCO at sons school (hes Y6)got in touch with her I belive thro our local Childrens Center.
Im unsure as to how things work in secondary school my children arnt there yet,
but If you've had meetings with Form/Class tutor, Head of Year and prehaps Head of th school, It would be the Goverors next to meet with, then your LEA.
I also like the idea of the Voice/Tape recorder,
Just a few thoughts

Thanks majafa. Glad you've got that support. It is so stressful. Finally got them to agree to email. As expected they're fudging stuff, no straight answers. If I do end up agreeing to a meeting I will definitely take the advice here and take someone like a parent support worker in and a tape recorder. I've learnt my lesson on that one - 3 years ago a particularly nasty teacher (who didn't like me, not my son) spent 10 minutes of a parents evening going on about how my son - age 8 at the time - kept ignoring his instructions about not wasting half a page of paper (starting a new page with each task). Of course he thought it deliberate not considering that 1) his written comments on this in my son's books weren't clear and my son couldn't read it to see what it said and 2) he was dealing with a typical 8 year old boy who forgets this type of thing. He banged on about it for the whole 10 minutes. Wish I'd had that on tape.

Thanks also to violetqueen for your suggestions of the other day. Didn't want to reply straight away in case it bumped it to the top again but seeing as it's there now anyway, thank you. (Took me a while to realise what bumping was).