WWYD better school or stay with friends?

[cremeeggs]

Having a bit of a dilemma re DD who has various learning difficulties incl dyslexia and dyspraxia. She is at a local state school that she absolutely loves and has loads of friends there. However she achieves very little and is in a huge class. They don't seem to have the desire or the resources to accommodate her needs and because she doesn't have a statement keep saying they are not obliged to offer her any extra help. so at most she gets a 15 minute session once a week to help with spelling and maths.

I feel she needs so much more one-to-one support, as she is falling further and further behind every year. I've found a small independent school that has spaces and very small classes and is offering one-to-one support for her several times a week. She could stay there until end of Year 11. I think she'd make a lot more progress and would learn in a way that suits her rather than being made to fit into a standard "mould" that doesn't. however she would miss he friends SO much - I don't know if it would be counterproductive? It's a 20 minute drive and likely that her new friends would be spread around the county rather than all local like they are now. It's so hard making the right decision!! WWYD?

Keep her at school, but use funds you were going to use for indi school to pay for specialist support outside school? Or ask school if you could pay for support within the class?

Tough one. Obviously you want her to do the best she can, but friends are v important for self esteem, esp when you factor in the dyslexia/dyspraxia.

Thanks Great TT - yes, we are looking into paying for extra support though there's very little available in this area and school won't let her have time off in the day, which is the only time the extra help is available!!

I totally agree about the self-esteem - she loses confidence very quickly so it really worries me.

Jajas it's so hard isn't it? part of me is really angry that we have a state system that fails these children so that out only option is often to sacrifice friendships/social interaction to give them a chance of achieving anything academically and having a future.

At DD's school the "golden" children who are academically able and good at acting, singing etc get all the attention so that those less able are left to their own devices. it seems so unfair that if DD is to have the education she deserves we have to take her away from her friends.

I was wondering about getting a one to one with experience of dysl/dysp to sit with her in class, and support her with what the rest of the class are doing. Might it be worth being creative and advertising for an ex teacher who wants to work part-time to do the role (assuming you can get permission from school). Perhaps pay for the person to attend specialist training (if it exists) or pay for them to have some research time before they start? It is a long term issue, so it may be that it takes a while to get the right things in place, but could be so worth it.

If they are a good teacher, then many of the skills will be there anyway. Lots of teachers who don't want class responsibility might love a role like that. Worth a thought?

Thanks Great TT that's actually a really interesting idea! I'd be very surprised if school would okay it as they are so short-sighted about everything and intriniscally quite lazy about anything that changes the status quo, but I could look into finding someone like that for after-school or saturdays!

well cremeeggs, if the school can't/won't provide... It has to be worth asking/telling them that you are investigating support for her as you don't think they are meeting her needs. Isn't there a website that helps with these sort of situations?
What was the reason for not getting a statement? Did you appeal? It sounds v strange that she is not getting support in class already.
I reckon a tutor could be the way to go though - maybe if they were not 'allowed' to work in class, the school would be able to provide all the relevant curriculum/assessment info for them?

She hasn't got a statement as in our LEA we've been advised you can only get them for things like Autism and ADHD-they don't give them for non-behaviour based difficulties.

She behaves beautifully in class (probably because she's miles away-she absents herself in terms of concentration and it's only recently been acknowledged) and because she has a very high IQ her overall results place her in the bottom quarter of the year rather than bottom of the year (but she's massively underachieving compared to her potential!) so the school believes there are others with similar issues who need their limited resources more, as their achievement level is lower. I can kind of understand that argument but I still feel it means DD is deprived of the help she needs.

Move her.

She can still keep in touch with her local friends and see them on the weekends. In fact, it's a plus to have friends aside from the friends you have at school (esp as you get older). Also, if it really does not work out at the new school she can always go back to the old one.

The current school sounds very short-sighted. I would say move her, and enrol her in some local after-school activities that allow her to keep in touch with local friends. If the independent school is worth its fees, it will encourage your dd to make new friendships.

cremeeggs - perhaps post on the SN boards, I am sure people there have a wealth of knowledge about how to get LEA's/schools to provide support.
I get what you say about the school though, your dd isn't a problem behaviourally, and is not in the lowest groups, so 'is achieving' as far as they are concerned. The fact that she isn't achieving to her potential is the issue. Maybe then is she isn't so very far behind, a few hours tuition each week would make the world of difference?

I say this as a firm supported of state schools though - amumm and lutyens - do you have experience of indi schools? My impression is that many fail to live up to promises esp in relations to SEN.

cremeeggs, how easily does your dd make friends? Do you think she could cope with a new school and new friendships - is she open to new things/change?

how old is your dd cremeeggs?
how would the extra x mins drive time fit in with youf lifestyle/other children/work etc?

Thanks amumm and Lutyens - I am leaning towards moving her but reluctantly so, as it does seem like "giving up" on the state system, though it's given up on her!!

Great TT - yes she makes friends incredibly easily at activities but tends not to get invited to parties/playdates much. i have come to the conclusion this is down to the parents' prejudices as she speaks like a partially deaf child due to speech difficulties from the dyspraxia, and she is very "full on" - not in a difficult way but she is so full of energy and bursting with things to say - a bit like an over-excited puppy!! So I think some Mums just find her too much and she missed out a lot because of that.

Definitely not an expert! Either in independent schools or in SN children. I went to an independent school, and the particular one I went to were fab with SN children (they weren't called that then, of course!). There were 3 SN children in my class, and all 3 got shed-loads of support and were always a fully integrated part of the class. Doesn't mean that would happen in every indie school, I admit.

IME if you are paying fees, then the school is providing a paid service and cannot fob off your genuine concerns simply because it means some hard work or tedium for them. A normal state school is good for those who already have the drive to succeed. The average plodders or those not working to their full potential don't always get that vital kick up the backside in the overworked state system.

GreatTT she's 9. I have an older DS who gets himself to school so i could manage the extra drive in the morning - work PT but the school has a good before school club and DH could pick up on those days. So it's definitely feasible.

I've just got the feeling I'm way over my head with this thread, with no real experience to back up anything I'm saying. Sorry, will just quietly withdraw. Best of luck with your decision cremeeggs

Lutyens you don't appear over your head at all!! I agree that if you're paying for a service it's harder for them to fob you off - that's the reason we are even considering private school. The state school she's out only seems to be accountable to the state for SATs results and general standards not with regard to doing the best for individual children, and I sense that if we have to pay for DD we will get a better service. It's totally wrong and shouldn't be that way but in our area it seems to be the only option!

I went to a private school and hated it so I was hoping DD could stay in the same system. I have to admit though that DS is at a private school now as he was bullied at the same school DD is at and they turned a blind eye. he loves his new school but he's very academic and takes all his work in his stride and is very different to DD.

We went through this dilemma last year, when ds was 9. Dyspraxic, struggling with some aspects of school and bored out of his brain the rest of the time. No support because bright enough to appear to be coping.

We moved him. He has made friends at the new school much more quickly than at the old one and is thriving. The learning support has been superb. Best thing we could have done for him, and he is far happier than he was at the old school.

He came home absolutely fizzing with delight at the end of last term - he came top in the class history test!

The only proviso is that you need to check that the new school is as good as you hope they are - we were up front with the head on the problems our son had and he had a two day assessment at the school before they offered him a place. I also checked out the numbers of learning support staff to make sure that the claims were viable!

Thanks neversaydie that's all very encouraging - v. glad everything has worked out for your DS ! You hear so many tales of children being failed by the system it's nice to hear a positive story!

V good advice too about asking the right questions - DD will have to have a day's assessment at the new school so we should get some idea how she settles from that. they say they offer dyslexic support every day so will ask them for figures about exactly how much, what form etc.

Just make absolutely sure before you move her that the extra support is definitely in place, and will continue and is of sufficiently high quality. Make sure the person providing it is properly qualified and experienced in dealing with children with the specific issues you child has. Ask tons and tons of questions and get assurances in writing about the support you child is going to get.

This isn't a private/state thing - I would say the same to anyone moving a child to a different state school because they had been promised specific support.

And the distance thing is important. My dd goes to a school that's 15 miles from home. Her best friend lives 25 miles away from us and there is no public transport. If they want to have a Saturday evening of pizza and Friends together it means 100 miles of driving for one set of parents!

I could have written your post about my DD 12months ago. She was halfway through Yr3 in a bad primary school, struggling like mad and getting no help. We moved her a year ago to a smaller state primary where the staff seem more interested and the classes are smaller.

A year ago she was assessed at being a year behind (and this was after 12 months of private tutoring once a week as well). She's now doing really well and her teacher says she is near the top of her class and likely to pass her 11+.

DD has kept in touch with her closest friends from her old school, they still come round for tea. She's made new friends as well. I do think you've got to put education before friendship in such a situation. IME a bit of private tuition does not help if the 9-3 daily school is crap.

Stripey and seeker thanks - lots of good advice!!

Seeker I am a bit prone to trust what it says on the tin so to speak so thanks for the prompt re asking lots of questions! The school is city centre so the children are spread out around the city but not as far as your DD's friend I imagine. That must be very tough.

Stripey I think you have hit the nail on the head - i feel strongly that DD should get the right teaching all day and not just in short bursts or with a private tutor once a week. It's also about her feeling engaged at school and not as if she can coast at school as long as she has a tutor lesson afterwards...that seems the wrong way round! she has been seeing a tutor once a week for a general boost but it's not made much difference to her overall skills and she finds it very tiring after a day at school. the tutor isn't specialised as we took her on before we knew DD was dyslexic.

You really need to be sceptical until they have proved they can deliver. A private school with empty places MAY (note I say MAY) be prepared to stretch the truth a bit to get customers. Get everything in writing in advance.

You say "Stripey I think you have hit the nail on the head - i feel strongly that DD should get the right teaching all day and not just in short bursts". I agree absolutely. But you're going to be getting the same at the new school, aren't you? Didn't you say that she'd be getting some one-to one there?

It does look as if finding a tutor and leaving her where she is might be the better option. Have you really exhausted all options at her current school? And with statementing? I don't think an LEA can actually say they only statement for behavioural difficulties - but I am sure there's someone around who knows more than I do about this sort of thing.