Should I bother to complain about this privatised homework scheme?

[Caligula]

My DS's school recently sent home a leaflet about some kind of private homework scheme, which consists of some marketing and education guy coming round and assessing your child, then drawing up a homework plan for them until they are 11 (because we have the 11+ in Kent), with the threat that if you don't buy it (at £64 per term or something ridiculous like that) a) your child will be less likely to pass the 11+, because only 25% of kids do, and you don't want your kid to be in the other 75%, do you and b) you are obviously an uncaring, feckless kind of parent who is too busy spending money on piano lessons, swimming lessons and all those other unnecessary extra-curricular things that won't help your child to pass the 11+ and therefore receive a semblance of an education in Kent (salesman actually said to my friend that they didn't bother to go and assess children in houses on such a such a council estate because none of the parents there cared enough about their kids to commit to the programme).

Pontius-Pilate like, the letter from the school said that they didn't endorse the scheme, but thought some parents might be interested. I was quite annoyed actually. I don't think the school should be acting as the Direct Marketing department of this private company which is using scare tactics to sell its academic product. (It's taken school time and resources to send letters and leaflets to every parent.) And I'm sure its academic product is perfectly good, but shouldn't the school be teaching my child to pass the 11+, if that is the function of education in my area (which it appears to be - I may not like it, but if that's what they think their job is, shouldn't they be doing it, rather than sending me info about a private company who does it?)

I'm sort of outraged by it, but I'm so used to being outraged by life in general, that I no longer know what's worth making a fuss about!

Damn!

Anybody else remember/still got the details?

Preusmably they'll be in contact soon - even more damning if it is a hard sell!

I didn't post their name, didn't want to give them publicity. Is student in th etitle? Think so.

YAY! Was it these people? Found it among some stuff asking parents to bring in clean old loo rolls ("There is a competition for the best decorated (empty) toilet roll", wtf?!) and clean empty tin cans on a newsletter from a random school, from 2002 here

That's them! Obviously an organisation that needs looking at...

just going back to the 11+ bit (i'd not logged on since start of thread). I meant I would help his with 11+ question technique, not sats. We have a grammer school system, but only two grammer schools, lots of comps, so competition is very fierce. My son is top of his class, and I would say very able, but not experienced in exam technique,so I feel to review the questionning techniques will just give him a nudge, as it were. I know of one child, not at all bright, has had tutoring a long while, and I agree that if she gained a grammer school place, would not manage the standard of work when she get there.

This is it. I think too few parents consider the effect on their child if tutoring gets them a place at a grammar school but their child is not academically or otherwise suited to a grammar. I can remember 2 girls at my grammar school having to leave and go to the local secondary modern because they couldn't cope with the work. Not only did they have the humiliation of having to leave, but they were bullied mercilessly at the other school for "thinking they were too good for us".

I do think some of these tutoring companies prey on the worries of parents, particularly in areas where the grammar school system exists. The thing a lot of parents ignore is that many of the comps are extremely good schools and their child would probably do just as well there as at a grammar. Some of the children at DS1's school were told categorically by the primary head that their child was not grammar-school material but insisted that the child sat the exam. Needless to say the child failed and the parents are not happy with the comp they have been allocated.

Because our school usually have just 2 or boys or girls AT THE MOST that pass, I think it is easier to assume they will all go to a comp, and take it as a bonus if they pass, then there is no disapointment. My son wants to pass, but I have told him not to be too optimistic,as it depends on the ability of other children at other schools, ie if it is a 'bright' year, but we will do what we can to prepare.

we had this - about 2 weeks after dd1 had started in reception!

A bit odd as we don't have grammars down here anyway.

I chucked it in the bin, tbh I would think that is the best thing to do. If you complain it will only get some nice free advertising for them and they'll be able to crank up their marketing bullshit.

wow are grammar schools really that competitive now - even when you get there? I went to one and once you were in it seemed like an easy enough ride for the kids there - certainly don't remember anyone getting thrown out for not being able to keep up.

I don't think the grammar schools are competitive per se. Just that the workload is quite intensive - after all they are primarily a very academic school. Application by the student is quite important. You can be very bright, but if you're not prepared to apply yourself, then you will struggle with the workload and fall behind.

Having said that, there were a number of girls at my school who couldn't be bothered to work hard and just drifted along. Don't think they came away with many qualifications, so that was a waste of a good education.

I agree with Freckle. It's not that the schools are competitive but they do work the children rather hard. If a child has been tutored with the express purpose of attending a grammar/selective school and gets in but cannot do the work then what a disaster. My son's school gives them a lot of work including a large amount of homework. Fortunately my son revels in it. One of his friends didn't get in despite tutoring, but is rather relieved because he would hate to have to work consistently hard. When we applied to DSs school what impressed me was the Head teacher saying that we should be sure that our child suited the type of school because they are all only small boys for a little while and that they should enjoy their childhood. I was impressed that he cared enough about the boys to say that. The boys in the school seem really happy. I know that my son is.

I'm shocked by the number of parents who hire private tutors here in Kent. Although schools are not supposed to coach children some of them obviously do more than others. I didn't hire a tutor for my daughter, but had I felt under-confident about helping her myself I might well have done. All that was needed was some common sense and experience of working to a time limit and a few attempts at old papers. Amazon do some books on how to do verbal and non-verbal reasoning, explaining all the likely types of questions with hints, and there are online sites like 11plusswot.com (I think) where you can subscribe and have them marked and marks recorded online, but it can all get hugely tedious for the child. I would not be impressed at that letter coming home. I can imagine some of the council estates the company doesn't market to - that would incense me and I would certainly let the school know. Who would trust a company of educators with such a prejudiced point of view (and such cocky salesmen)?

The private tutoring thing is a bit of a vicious cycle. Some parents do, so those who wouldn't normally think they have to in order for their child to compete on equal terms and so it goes on. If no parent hired a tutor, things would settle down.

It is all a matter of preying on parents fears and worries. Made worse by the fact that some of the best high schools make parents jump through hoops in order to get a place and make it very plain indeed that they won't accept children who fail the 11+. So, if you put your child in for the exam, you have to be very certain that they will pass or face being allocated a poorly performing school on the other side of town.

A group of parents in Kent are taking the local authority to the Court of Human Rights saying that it is an abuse of their human rights to have to choose their child's school before they know the results of the exam. Thing is the local authority agrees with them. The current system is imposed by the government.

Hmm, that's interesting Freckle. I wonder what the outcome of that case will be. But I'm still not entirely clear why it's bad that you have to choose the school first - what difference does that make?

I've only had experience of choosing primary schools, and I only chose 2 and got offered a place at both, so obviously secondary school is a completely different ball game, but why is it bad that you can't choose schools after the exam? Is there some kind of limit on how many schools you can apply to?

Around here there is no question - the "brightest" kids go to the grammar schools in the neighbouring boroughs, so the secondary schools locally get fairly medicore results (regardless of the fact that the teaching is good - they simply don't have any of the brighter kids who can raise the aspirations of the class). The fact that if you attempt the grammar school route you lose the chance of any decent alternative at all is just raising the pressure on kids and parents.

Caligula, you have to make a school your "first choice". Many schools (especially if they are oversubscribed) only consider you if you have put them first. So if you want to try the grammer school you must put it first, but if you fail to pass the 11+ then you get into the first undersubscribed school on your list (ie the one other parents weren't keen on). So if there is a risk that your child might not pass you have to consider putting a non-grammar school as first choice.

To illustrate locally, these are the league table percentages (ie number of pupils getting 5 GCSEs A-C)

Grammer school: - 99%
Best local non-grammar school: -62%
Nearest undersubscribed school:- 27% (though up from 15/16% a couple of years ago.

So under the current system, I can put ds in for 11 +, but if he fails he goes to the third school. Or I can not attempt the 11+ and settle for the middle one (which btw is an 11-16 school which I also have issues with....)

Hence for me why the number of children passing 11+ has been an issue in choosing a primary school! And, unless he has SEN I am happy to coach him through 11+.

The current system has parents listing their 3 preferred schools. Now, if your child is not sitting the 11+, you would put 3 high schools in order of preference. However, if your child is sitting the 11+, you would naturally put a grammar school as first choice and then list your preferred high schools. The difficulty arises where your child then fails the 11+ and your preferred high schools operates a "first preference" selection system, i.e. they only offer places to pupils who list them as first preference. Normally all available places will be offered to those who list that school as first preference, leaving no places available to children who sat the 11+ but failed. So those children will then be offered the place at the nearest high school, which will normally be the one which is undersubscribed for obvious reasons.

There is no point in listing a high school as first preference and a grammar school as second preference on the basis that, if your child then passes the 11+, you could appeal to the grammar school for a place. If you are offered a place at your first preference school (in this case the high school), there is apparently no mechanism available to appeal against this and expect a grammar school place.

Clear??? Not easy and a dreadful dilemma for a lot of parents.

I'm bumping this because our school have just done it AGAIN and asked me to provide my children's names, address and dobs to The Student Support Centre, even if I'm not interested. So complaining obviously made sod all difference in my case. Grrr.

Grrr. Go on, You and Yours. Or maybe one of our journalist members would like to expose these vultures? I remember your thread well www but had missed caligula's.

Caligula, the reason people hire private tutors for 11 plus tuition is that the Kent Grammars require such a high pass mark to get a place. There is such competition for places (I'm in East Sussex very near the Kent border so lots of children round here go to the Kent Grammars) that its not enough to pass, you have to get in the high 90's to get a place.

Your school will be making money out of the private option they have sent out, they won't be able to recommend it as such (LEA won't allow them to)but it is an option. Otherwise you can just ignore it or find a different private tutor. But this is the reality of the system now I'm afraid to say.

Id be pretty cross to be on the receiving end of that as well. Oh, but I wouldnt be! our UK house is on a council estate

I have just had a letter from my school about this Student S Scheme (I too, dont' want to give out full name to restrict their publicity).

I have never felt so cross about anything do with my children's school. I couldn't believe that they were marketing this stuff to us parents. It's like saying "we're probably not doing a good enough job... so why don't you pay to get someone else to teach your kids".

My daughter also came home from school today saying she'd got in trouble because she hadn't taken the reply slip back in the next day.

I have now complained to the school.

Thanks for posting the previous messages about this as reading your replies made me realise that my initial instincts about this were well founded.

We've just had a letter from school just like this and although I had my doubts about it I am so glad I've come onto MN to check it out.
Rotton company. And grrr at school.