Daughter unable to attend her graduation ceremony as it is full. Advice please

[mildlyfried]

My daughter has just finished a three year Bsc (hons) at a major University. She has been advised that she cannot attend her graduation ceremony as it is full and she is on a waiting list. All the other ceremonies are at capacity too. She has been told that if a place does not become available then she can either try to graduate in November without her friends or have her certificate posted to her for a £10 fee.

To say we are upset and disappointed is an understatement. Has anyone ever heard of this before? I did not think a University would do this and would make sure they had enough graduation days/dates for all their students. The students have paid tens of thousands in fees and slogged for three years to be denied the chance to get their degree in a ceremony with their family watching.

Is there anyone out there with any advice? maybe someone who works at a University? I'm tempted to go to the local paper and tell the story so other students know what to expect at this University. Students should be told when they are choosing the University that they are not guaranteed a graduation.

Thanks for reading

Oh for goodness sake that was not the point of my post and it is not comparable to buying tickets to a concert. A graduation should be a given, not something you have to get in a ticketmaster queue for. I doubt anyone who has paid £40k+ for their studies would appreciate your sentiments and sarky tone.

Does it matter when she tried to buy if there weren't enough.

Presumable the limit was numbers not a date.

Maybe the 'deadline' the OP talks about is the date the website for booking tickets for graduands/guests closed. And the 'first come first served' bit related to the earlier RSVP'ing as to whether you wanted to attend a ceremony in the first place?

Yes I do. And a large part of my job is organising graduation ceremonies. And I settle all the bills and expenses so I know what I’m talking about

Maybe you aren't very efficient then. I am pretty sure the university i last worked wasn't having to pay a huge amount out for expenses or external contractors. E.g no flowers and while musicians paid they were recent music graduates and not paid huge sums. Not sure how much event medics cost but surely not more than 1000 for an extra day. Most work done by internal staff.

To be clear, OPs daughter applied late but before the deadline. Regardless of a first come first served policy, the venue should be big enough to accomodate every graduating student plus one or two guests. When the deadline passes, additional spaces should be allocated to people on the wait list, not before. Graduation is hard earned, and college fees are high. Every graduating student has the right to be there if they want to be. The university is at fault here for not choosing a venue with adequate capacity, or planning a second ceremony. Deadlines are the boundary, and she was within the boundary.

Oh wow! I think the person knows her job!

I agree. The person playing the academic overture on the organ for twenty plus graduation ceremonies in a row won't be cheap either. Nor is the laundering of all the academic gowns, hire of the venue (if relevant), lots of other things.

I work at a UK university and this does not sound right to me. All students will be offered a ticket, then one or two for friends and family. There is then a ballot if to apply for more. The ballot can be full but the student ticket would not be affected. Have you spoken to the university or could there be a reason your daughter is not telling you that she doesn't want to go? bullying etc, I hear that a bit

Clearly Theyve increased student numbers but havent increased the size of their graduation ceremony venue
In which case they either
offer less guest spaces ( people can book extra guests after the booking deadline , so I’m guessing there’s extra space for guests )
or have more ceremonies
That comes at an extra cost so to facilitate that perhaps they should charge all guests to attend.

You can't always just book extra ceremonies. Venues can be booked way in advance, which is why the university would have earlier asked for notification of intention to attend a ceremony later in the year (which OP's DD ignored and didn't reply to). Over all the schools there will be a lot of ceremonies. The venue will be booked accordingly. If someone suddenly changes their mind or decides to come after all, they may not have the ability to book an additional day or two for more ceremonies. Someone else might have it booked. The clean up might be booked for specific dates. etc.

Yes I’m aware
however
They do know their student numbers so will have an idea how many may want to attend based on average / max stats over many years

If it’s just a few people with no space for them then obviously there is always a margin of error

However
Why not make sure there are plenty of places always in excess of the maximum based on figures for previous years
Seats can always be sold to extra guests. Lancaster always have more guests attending than they can seat, that’s why they put on an extra venue for people to watch the ceremony on a live feed.

So less graduate / ceremony ( depending on how many have actually lost out but again they will know that with their year on year stats )
sell more guests seats
Make money from that to pay for an extra ceremony
Mix that ceremony amongst the colleges if need be but at least everyone gets a ceremony

I'm not sure if trends are consistent to allow such prediction but I am aware that there are a large number of students who no longer choose to graduate in person. I'm sure that can make it tricky. I've never known tickets to be sold to a graduation. We were just given them.

Maybe there could be one extra optional graduation session for all schools in the event of an overflow. I suspect people wouldn't respond well to a mixed ceremony like that though.

Is that how they do it, multiple ‘deadlines’ not just a line in the sand deadline ? Sounds totally confusing and even more unfair if that’s the case,

No, it is not a ‘given’. But she CAN graduate. She can graduate in November. She COUld have graduated with her friends - but she was too disorganised to do the booking. She is NOT being being denied a graduation ceremony!!

Yes we were given two free guests tickets
Extra guest places can be sold if space allows

Im not saying Lancaster charge atm. They don’t
I’m switching that up to say they should
Graduation ceremonies are expensive, Universities are broke
and clearly Lancaster can’t accommodate everyone atm

So charge

The academic gowns are rented. Why do you think the person playing the organ "won't be cheap"

How much do you think they should charge though? I'd hate to see anyone make a financial decision not to attend or not be able to have family there because of the cost.

I have graduated three times. I didn't go to the last two because we were all allocated three tickets. We had the option of turning up on the day to see if there were additional ones. This would have made me pick and choose which of my children could come, which I wasn't going to do because how horrible to be the children left out. So I just made it easy and didn't go. Travelling, the expense and only having the hope we could get extra tickets wasn't worth the risk.

Do you know anything about professional musicians? They are no cheap, ever, and they shouldn't be. It takes years and years to get that good, and a lot of expense and time. I know they won't be cheap.

At my unis we got to keep the cap. They aren't rented. They are given to the students. The small amount for gown rental doesn't cover all the costs.

Lancaster own the venue and are not booking anything out . Same for most of the older universities i can think of.

You think the venue just sits there all year long and is only used for graduations?

Yes, I know musicians who have played at graduation ceremonies. They are often music students or ex students ime and not paid huge sums. When I say gown rental I am referring to the gowns academics wear. Student's pay to rent their gowns.

How much a seat should be for guests would depend on the cost of running the ceremony
Currently the Unis my boys have been / are going to allow two guests each so everyone can have at least some guests there. It was the same in my day

If there were less students graduating and more guest seating your kids could have attended
So my suggestion would have worked in your case in terms of availability but yes you would have had to pay for the seats
Just because Unis don’t atm doesn’t mean they shouldn’t
They haven’t got the money

My husband paid hundreds for his. Might have been a couple of thousand. Some of them own theirs. Prior to that he's never been charged, though he is usually just given the local one then.

It's an idea, but I'd like to see some sort of system for those who really can't afford the tickets, like a hardship thing. Attending graduation shouldn't be a privilege for those who can afford it. In this day and age, live streaming graduations could be an option too.