Transition from independent to state

[Starsugar]

Due to increases in school fees we are having to move my daughter from her prep school into state, she is in year 5 and we have given notice for her to leave after Easter.

The class sizes are small and she has had access to lots of space, opportunities and great facilities. Our local primary schools that have places in her year group are not great. When it comes to high schools our two nearest are in need of improvement and the third does not do well academically.

We aren't really in a position to move and although I am willing to travel, we are not in catchment for the good schools, which are oversubscribed.

Has anyone else been in this position? How have your children coped with the change? Can a child successfully make it through a bad school with the right support at home?

Sorry to hear you're having troubles.

Obviously, your focus should be secondary not primary. You have 10 months to figure out where you could get her into and any changes needed for that. It's not long, but it's enough if you really focus on it now.

Have you actually visited all the state secondary schools she could get into from where you live? Online information will only tell you so much.

Do you have grammars close by, and is that an option for her academically? Get her a tutor now if so.

You say moving isn't an option. Why? You do have time before the October application date, if you want to. You're saving a year's worth of fees by pulling her out of school before you planned, so that would go some way towards costs.

Do you have any other DC you also need to consider in a house move or for their future school?

I agree, focus on the secondary school. Go and see your local ones, talk to parents and any children you know who attend.

yy consider carefully if you could move. Even locally there may be somewhere prefer.

But to answer your question, yes dc can do well. My younger two were at an RI school which despite this had many strengths; they got good GCSEs and went to uni.

Hi, sorry to hear you're having troubles.
Can't speak for all obviously but have friends who have changed their children's school this academic year and been in state since September - their twin girls have really struggled with maths because the state school has been way ahead, perhaps in preparation for sats next year. The girls are catching up now but it was pretty shocking for them - they'd been told they were really strong at maths back at their little prep school, only to find themselves in morning booster groups and needing the ta a lot during lessons.
This is obvs just anecdotal but I'd make sure to ask the new school what they cover and where they're at so that you can all get ready for the jump after Easter, in case it's a similar case.

Don't think it's indicative of how good the prep school was, it's just that they don't do sats so didn't have the same urgency to embed skills so early.

Good luck, I hope it goes well.

Thanks for the reply.

We haven't been able to actually get inside any of the secondary schools to have a look, the ones we have approached have said to wait for the open days next September, which doesn't really leave much time to make changes for the October application deadline. We don't have grammar schools in this area, our nearest is 1.5hrs away, which would just be impossible with work.

I'm living with my parents as I can't afford to buy/rent on my own, which makes moving very difficult. They were paying the fees before but a combination of retirement and fee increases has meant they can't continue with it. I don't have any other children, which does make it a little easier.

I do feel very stuck for options, but I'm hoping that other children have made the same transition and have turned out ok!

That is really interesting, we had noticed that when children had joined the prep school from local state schools they often got put straight into the top sets. Definitely something to be prepared for as I would have expected it to be the other way around!

I agree that it doesn't reflect on the prep school, they do seem to work more on building confidence and giving them a positive outlook for learning.

@Starsugar You have to bear in mind catchment areas and the address you are living at. There’s often a deadline for living at an address and catchment so check this out.

Many schools that are RI can improve. Depends what the RI was and quality of SLT to ensure improvement. I’m not sure anyone looks round schools early. Most do go to open days that are in y6 before preference deadline. So you are just like everyone else.

When she gets to the new primary, quickly get to know parents. Where are their dc going? There will be ones who are trying for the better school of the options. However check the options are realistic and what their previous application distance is. Also check progress 8. This tells you more than exam results. Also check fsm and sen. Previous attainment tells you a lot too. It might not all be doom and gloom. Many go to good unis from non grammars in my grammar county. Support at home and like minded friends are key.

Have you asked about a bursary especially as you seem to be a single mum?

Yes, we did approach the school but they aren't in a position to help. Its a little frustrating when she's only a year and a term away from finishing.

I know quite a few families who have been in this kind of position as several independent schools have closed in our area (not VAT related- well before that.) We saw the writing on the wall at the school my DC attended and made the move to state early, so got our first choice of school which we were more than happy with but lots of people didn't. Obviously there were lots of families looking at the same schools all at the same time and not all of them could be accommodated exactly where they wanted. Some ended up in the worst schools in the area as they were the ones with spaces. Obviously it is not what anyone would choose, but more or less all of my DC's former class mates seem to have done well at school, and those that didn't had other unrelated things going on. Quite a few managed to move to better schools later on as once the bulge in demand created by the closure was over, places did open up in other schools. But others stayed where they'd been placed and did fine. A supportive home environment makes a huge difference even if school is not ideal and there are always some lovely kids and good teachers in any school, even the "bad" ones.
One of my DC's friends had a particularly rough time. When the school she attended with my DC closed she was in year 5 so moved to another independent school for year 6. She stayed there happily until in year 10 that school announced it was closing too. She then had to move to one of the poorest performing schools in the county for year 11 - you probably can't get much more disruptive than that. Anyway, she's now an Oxbridge graduate and doing very well for herself and says she feels that though it was difficult at the time, that experience actually benefited her.
Look carefully at all your options and try not to assume the worst OP. There may be positives to be found even if they are not obvious right now.

I’m wondering what your plans had been for secondary my understanding is that private secondary education is much more expensive so were your parents planning on funding that too?

As it will be an in year transfer, the whole catchment thing is slightly different. Have you spoken to your LA yet? If not, when do you plan on doing that? You might want to get yourself on various school waitlists now, see what position you're in and, you never know, you may strike lucky. That might mean that your DD has to leave her current school mid-term but, if the result is that she's in a better school for the remaining 4 terms, that could be worth it.
What out of school clubs does your DD do? If she joins a local brownie group or a weekend drama or sports club, she'll get to know some other children, some of whom might be at the school she ends up at.
The worst bit of moving schools is waiting to find out which school it is. Once you know that, you can start bigging up some aspects of her new school which her current school doesn't offer. DS made the move the other way in Yr5 and really missed some bits of his state school which the smaller prep school just couldn't offer.
As others have said, unless your school is properly academically selective, you might be surprised at the standards in the state school. DS went from being around middle with additional support in some topics to being well into the top quartile at the independent school.

My parents had originally planned to pay, but for health reasons my dad is going to be retireing much earlier than planned. I have been contributing about 25%. We had hoped to make it through to the end of year 6, but it was really tight even before the VAT.

Yes, we've spoken to them and have been given a list of all the schools near us with spaces. Those with spaces seem to be the ones that aren't doing as well. She is on a waiting list at 3 schools. She does go to brownies, but the schools where her friends are at don't have any space.
It does sound as though she might get pushed a bit harder academically, which is a plus we hadn't thought of.

@Starsugar All the other parents have been able to get the better schools and you are late to apply. It’s inevitable the best schools are full. I’m slightly surprised you have left it until now to look given the finances.

My dad has been diagnosed with a condition which has meant he will need to retire early and consequently my daughter will need to change from independent to state.
She is in year 5, so I am not 'late to apply' I think you might have misunderstood.

Slightly different as my DS moved from an international school in January on year 6, but he had no problem with SATs he had to prep some of the SPAG but not much. It was a very smooth transition.

@Starsugar I meant the other parents have got into the best schools. If you don’t apply at the set times you are, in effect, a late in year applicant.

The impending move was unexpected. What's so difficult to understand?

Obviously I completely understand. However the op says the better schools are full. That’s no surprise, is it?

And that comment is helpful how?

OP, I wouldn't assume your DD will be behind going into state education. We looked at sitting the 11+ with one of our kids, she was in the top sets in an outstanding primary school, but the maths needed for the 11+ was ahead of what they were covering in school (in fact she didnt cover some of it until yr8!), yet friends with kids at the local private school were already at that level.

It’s an explanation! Some parents who have never used the state system are not aware of stating a preference by a given date. It’s a statement of fact. Nothing else. Ditto the advice on making sure the op understands which schools she should realistically look at for secondary. What you want isn’t always what you can get. It’s not helpful to be over optimistic either.

"That’s no surprise, is it?" That's not an explanation to someone who you are implying may not understand the rules.

Parents choose their school places at reception age, this has nothing to do with OP's child who is in yr5. People move, school places will certainly have come up in the following 6yrs since reception. It has nothing to do with parents stating a preference by a given date 6yrs previously.

I wouldn't assume that she'll be behind going into state, we've recently moved the other way in year 5 (because he is very able in maths and his primary wasn't providing stretch goals in any way, just bragging that he completed all the maths for the week in the first lesson on Monday then was such a good boy to help his classmates learn for the rest of the week - lovely but he's 9 not a teaching assistant!). English I'd say is very similar, the IT and DT provision is just in a different world (my kids at state primary got 1 hour a week of IT, but only alternate weeks actually involved using a computer, whereas DT was some food tech like making a sandwich but mostly making things out of recyled materials), after school care is obviously pitched differently and the state primary had most of their events for parents during school day, whereas the prep does more after school to fit around work. Our state primary had probably similar outdoor play provision, forest school etc and actually I'd say the kids had a similar amount of PE and activity in their day (daily mile for example) whereas prep relies more on them choosing after school clubs for this. State a lot of science was theoretical whereas prep he has access to the labs so they do more hands on science which has really excited him but I don't think either are really easier or harder, just a slightly different way of teaching. Year 6 is structured very differently because prep don't do SATs but state spend a long time revising the content for SATs, however it does mean any content that was missed will be covered so she's at a similar place before secondary (we have found that he's redone some topics that he'd already covered at state, and some topics especially in IT his prep counterparts have a much more thorough understanding of than he does). This was an outstanding state primary so I really would take it with a pinch of salt how well performing they appear to be (my mum was a teacher in a primary that went from requires improvement to outstanding in the space of a few years, the SLT make a huge difference so see if you can meet with the head of the school you're considering to see their attitude towards their school). The important thing I would say is how nurturing they are. We only have experience of one state primary (our eldest did go through year 6 so we do have experience of sats), and one prep, but his prep is brilliant for treating the children as individuals, using very positive language, fostering confidence and self worth. He has always been a very shy, scared child but the change in him over the last year has been amazing. Some of his primary teachers were similar, but a few were very shouty as a way to control 30 small children in one room and for me the attitude of support and nurture would be the bit that she may struggle with more than any academics so if you haven't yet chosen the primary she's moving to try to meet with anyone you can at them to get a feel for the teaching environment as a whole rather than the academics. I know there is a big attitude of state till secondary, then the secondary is the priority for many people for private if they're doing a few years (we were these people) however having experience of prep now I'd actually say if I could only afford one or the other I'd choose prep every time, because the belief in himself and confidence comes from those earlier years, so in that regard I think your daughter is very lucky to have had the formative early experiences if her prep has been similar. I'm sure she'll thrive in either, it's scary making the move to a new school where she knows no one but all schools do try to make sure new starters are given a buddy or encouraged into a friendship group and hopefully she'll settle very quickly.

I'm fully aware of the situation, which is why in my original question I was asking how have people coped with the transition, especially to schools that are not doing so well, as we don't have much choice.

I just hoped to hear some success stories, maybe even some positives I hadn't thought of to make us all feel a little better.