Secondary state school worry

[Zssn]

Hello all,

I hope you all are well.

I am really worried about my child going to a public secondary school. The bad and foul language, the disrespectful behaviour and so much more. I just don't want my child to be around this, and whilst my child is a top student, I am also worried that peers will influence my child.
My child doesn't want to go to a private school, so we have instructed tutors and extracurricular as well as supercurricular activities and a boys club too, but I am incredibly worried.

Any advice greatly appreciated please

I'm sorry that you don't feel that you were able to fulfil your academic potential.

With regard to your kids...I guess you'll never know for sure how they would have fared within a comprehensive system, but if you live in a grammar area, are there actually genuine comprehensive schools available? How does that work?

You will find those issues everywhere. However, it would depend on where you send him. I am still to hear about knife crime in private schools so let’s face it is an issue.

I live in an area that’s comp but within reach of a number of selective schools with big catchments. My kids all had to travel for school.

You’re right of course. We can never know how things would have turned out school-wise had circumstances been different. Which is another reason why individual stories are pointless.

I do strongly suspect, though, that your daughter and your nephew attended high achieving, ‘colonised’ comps.

What exactly is a "colonised comp" as opposed to just a "normal comp"?

One in which well-heeled middle class parents buy into the area and elbow their way into the best comps.

But how can you tell that is the case? Thats what I'm asking...

A certain level of FSM?
Over subscription?
Results? (Gcse or a level?)

You can suspect what you like, but you would be wrong about my dd's school - it was not a particularly high achieving school and it certainly hadn't been "colonised" - it catered to a very diverse population socio-economically. Where it did have an advantage, I suppose, is that it was in a properly comprehensive area with no grammars nearby for kids to commute to.

I don't know enough about my nephew's school to comment. But I think it's very sad that you assume that kids can only do well in comprehensives can only happen if the school is usually high performing. You are mistaken.

But you made clear that you could have afforded private but chose not to. So it’s hardly unreasonable to think you live in a nice place with lots of other people with money.

If the school isn’t high achieving it would seem your daughter did well despite the school. Good for her (and you) but that’s not a recommendation of schooling.

You’d have to ask the parents. But house prices is a good initial measure.

@Rummly "My own experience is that my children’s education and opportunity was a great deal better than mine. I very much doubt it would have been if they had had to go to any of our local comps."

If your children went to grammar school, you did not have any local comprehensive schools.

That’s a bit semantic. There are no grammars except out of area. I doubt there’s anywhere in the country that does not offer some alternative to comps even if children have to travel, and even if the available privates are ‘St Cakes’ type dreadful schools.

Op I think it's natural to worry when they go up. I've been on both sides of this, teacher and parent, but generally kids who are well supported at home and motivated will do OK.

As a yr 7 form tutor, it did make me sad to see how quickly kids become hardened, but then, if you stick a bunch of 11 year olds in with older kids, that will happen regardless.

Mine attend a fairly rough one. Grammars over an hour away on the bus, so didn't even consider that for them. Dc1 is awkward and quiet. They are doing well. Dc2 is always laden with accolades, which suits their desperate desire to please. They may have been overlooked in a school with more like them.

Lol, you make a lot of assumptions. One of the reasons that we could have afforded private was precisely because we don't live in an expensive area and we didn't saddle ourselves with an enormous mortgage. But you seem determined to ignore the reality of my experience because it doesn't fit with the narrative that you have created for yourself.

And no, to be clear, my dd didn't achieve despite her school. As we have discussed, she achieved because of a complex mix of factors including innate ability, personality and work, parental values and support, stable home life and some excellent teaching. The latter is not unusual in average comprehensives, regardless of what you might think. And contrary to what you believe, it's actually very normal for bright, hardworking kids in average comprehensive schools to do well.

There are no selective state schools in commuting distance from us - not in our county or the neighbouring two counties.

It isn't a semantic difference at all. You can't have proper comprehensive schools if there are selective schools that kids can travel to.

I can’t know your reality, only what you choose to put on here. Which included the information that you could have afforded private education, so £20-30k every year.

And if there are no grammars near you (your post below) there will be private schools - as you testify!

Far more children go to private schools than grammars. Private schooling makes much more of a difference to comprehensive intake than grammars do.

Yes, there are private schools which obviously take some pupils. It's a very small percentage around here though - as I've already said, it isn't a particularly affluent area.

You're right that we can never have a completely comprehensive system because of the few that go to private, but it's much better here than in the grammar areas where we used to live. Enough kids stay within the state sector to ensure that there is a good cohort of bright, motivated kids in every local school.

I'm not saying that any of the local schools are perfect - no school is! I'm just fed up of people making assumptions about comprehensive schools that aren't based on solid evidence.

Hello,

Thank you for your reply.

So nice to hear that yours are doing well.

I am a teacher too, but for A-level students, and I am really worried about alot of what I have heard in general from schools on all spectrums i.e grammar, comprehensive, state ect... A-level students are incredibly different to those starting school.

I just do not want my child to fall in with the wrong crowd, nor fall behind academically as he has been a top student in his studies this far. He is still keeping up with his extra curricular, and supper curricular activities and studies, but I hope that is enough.

The school is really good academically, but I just found out this morning that someone was selling illegal substances to the younger years- police dealt with it but it shocked me immensely.

It's a big change for me too.

I teach A level too, but as part of a comprehensive school. Kids don't tend to 'fall in' with the wrong crowd, they make an active choice. Dc2 has already drifted from friends who are disruptive; dc1 has been on the periphery in certain lessons, but knows that any sanctions he had at school will be followed up at home, so has pulled it back. They both know that school is a tool to be used to access the next stage but I am under no illusions that my influence will dimish over the next few years. I just hope I've fine a good enough job so far so that they make the right choices.

@Zssn "The school is really good academically, but I just found out this morning that someone was selling illegal substances to the younger years- police dealt with it but it shocked me immensely."

To be honest, if this shocks you immensely, you are going to find the teenage years a challenge. Keep the lines of communication with your boy open-he will be fine.

Of the folks I know it was the ones that went to private school that were experimenting with drugs in their school days. I assume they have more disposable income for it. I work in a state comp. Drugs been found on kids a couple of times. They were permanently excluded both times

I think it's a valid concern. Although every poster on this thread has said the behaviour at private schools is worse, and they're full of drug addicts, that's certainly not been my experience.
I do think it's quite school specific. There are some excellent state schools and some terrible. We've moved DS to private school due to serious disruptive behaviour in his class. DD is in state school and thriving. They're both different children. So I think you need to research your local schools and consider how they'll work for your child.

I spent my gap year with a girl from a very big name private girls' boarding school. It was eye-opening to hear what she and her friends had got up to at school...it made my comp look like a teddy bears picnic! Suffice to say that 18yo me was extremely shocked!!

My dc are both doing well in their 20's despite their comprehensive school being in special measures. Home life matters so much, set a good example and most are just fine.

Hi, being a teacher I guess you have good insight on the students behaviour and how they transition to secondary?

Reading other comments here it seems most things that you find shocking and I would too, seems to be normal in any type of school. Selling illegal substances to the younger kids, to me thats really a worry, is that a normal thing in schools now?

When we visited 2 grammar schools in our area, the students seem well behaved, polite and it seems there was good all around positive vibe. Don't know what to make of it now...

Hello,

We visited a lot of all schools, and they were all incredibly well behaved, respectful and high achieving students indeed. Now upon hearing this, I think that prospective schools make an active choice to put the best or the best at the forefront of open days when potential families visit the school- they are after all wanting their school to be chosen for a potential child to attend. I did ask the school why did they not make potential parents aware of the ongoings with the selling of illegal drugs to younger students, and they said it was as they were under 18years old. Had a parent, and the local news not reported it, God only knows what else would've occurred.

What more troubling to me is that, there are these kinds of students/children in society ,and albeit it sad and worrying, how much of an influence will they play to a child growing up, and how that will affect them and society as adults?
I have told my dc to be kind, and to tell an adult or teacher if there is ever a problem he is worried about, or if he knows or sees something that makes him worried and that his father and I are always there for him. We are an incredibly close knit family, and I am hopeful that will add to positive influences too.

I guess it is a change I am needing to go through, and just try to be even more closer to my child, and hopefully build a stronger mother and teenager relationship. These are new waters for me indeed.

All the best for you