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If you’re charged VAT will you remove your child from their private school? I’m v stressed!

1000 replies

Liikklu · 27/05/2024 18:05

We won’t be able to pay the increase. Only hope is asking grandparents for the shortfall which we don’t want to do. Anyone else in a similar boat? Do you think it will literally be a 20% increase on fees or will schools absorb some of it? Our school has said they will address the matter ‘if and when’ it applies.

OP posts:
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RespiceFinemKarma · 28/05/2024 10:21

LittleBearPad · 28/05/2024 09:46

Keir Starmer’s children go to a state school.

They go to a super selective London Grammar - nothing like a state school anyone getting angry at private school parents would recognise.

I really think if you add up all the kids in super selective Grammar schools with SEN and FSM you would get nowhere near what the private school sector subsidises.

Einwegflasche · 28/05/2024 10:22

Ozanj · 28/05/2024 10:21

Yep. We crunched the numbers and we could buy a house in the 11+ catchment of any grammar in the UK if we wanted to. In the meantime we’ll absorb the increase to keep DS at Private primary, keep investing, keep our house in an outstanding non-selective state school. I’m diversifying some investments to ensure I get an income. I might buy a couple of houses to rent but undecided.

Privilege bubble comment award.

Ireallywantadoughnut36 · 28/05/2024 10:22

Floatingvoternolandinsight · 28/05/2024 08:22

Have you seen the cost of tutors? Especially if they are qualified teachers and examiners.

I have, we have one for my son! It's gonna be less than £8k a term! A 121 hourly session once a week costs us about £160 a month and supplements the state schooling for him. Its an option if its purely the academics that concern OP

EasternStandard · 28/05/2024 10:23

RespiceFinemKarma · 28/05/2024 10:21

They go to a super selective London Grammar - nothing like a state school anyone getting angry at private school parents would recognise.

I really think if you add up all the kids in super selective Grammar schools with SEN and FSM you would get nowhere near what the private school sector subsidises.

Generally on super selective grammars those who access them know how competitive they are. For good reason.

LondonPapa · 28/05/2024 10:23

Liikklu · 27/05/2024 18:05

We won’t be able to pay the increase. Only hope is asking grandparents for the shortfall which we don’t want to do. Anyone else in a similar boat? Do you think it will literally be a 20% increase on fees or will schools absorb some of it? Our school has said they will address the matter ‘if and when’ it applies.

Fortunately, we're in the position to pay so it doesn't change our plans although we're a year off from our DC starting school. I'd rather she is in a school with great amenities, amazing ratios and potential for better educational outcomes than send her to a substandard state school with large classes and less amenities.

RespiceFinemKarma · 28/05/2024 10:23

Alectrona · 28/05/2024 10:17

Regardless of how a change in charitable status might affect you, do you honestly believe that private schools are charities?

Ask the thousands of kids on full bursaries if they feel their school has been charitable.

kirbykirby · 28/05/2024 10:24

Clavinova · 28/05/2024 10:05

kirbykirby
*Besides, as someone above has highlighted, Keir Starmer is the type of champagne socialist who can easily afford to live in a nice, middle class area with million plus houses and send his kids to the nice, middle class school where all the other very rich people with million pound houses send their kids to school so they don't actually have to mix with the riff-faff but still claim they are left-wing/socialists. It's such a cliche.^

Or they gain selection in other ways. I remember reading that Harriet Harman sent one of her children to the London Oratory School and her other child to St. Olave's Grammar School in Kent - the schools are 20 miles apart. At the same time she was quoted as saying; "We are not in favour of selection." Similar with Emily Thornberry who sent her child miles away to a partially selective school.

She's also a multiple-property landlord but complains about the housing crisis! All these people are such cliches!

Elizo · 28/05/2024 10:25

Despite still having 2-3 x the state school funding. It’s laughable.

MagnetCarHair · 28/05/2024 10:25

LondonPapa · 28/05/2024 10:23

Fortunately, we're in the position to pay so it doesn't change our plans although we're a year off from our DC starting school. I'd rather she is in a school with great amenities, amazing ratios and potential for better educational outcomes than send her to a substandard state school with large classes and less amenities.

Fewer.

InterIgnis · 28/05/2024 10:26

Einwegflasche · 28/05/2024 10:22

Privilege bubble comment award.

Someone answering OP’s question, and explaining their own circumstances.

Errors · 28/05/2024 10:27

Another question - can labour just decide to do this if they get elected? Won’t they need to try and change the legislation and so it’ll have to go through the House of Lords who are probably very unlikely to allow the policy to go ahead??

Janedoe82 · 28/05/2024 10:28

PostMenPatWithACat · 28/05/2024 09:28

I don't know if it has been raised but we took the independent route because in our Borough not one state school taught three separate sciences, offered a choice of MFL or a classical language. It gave our DC a significant advantage as they both went to Oxbridge. Peers at primary who were as clever, if not more clever, did not. Their primary was a 97% SATs pass rate and Osted Outstanding. It was leafy, middle class and cofe. About 50% of pupils were tutored and that is why such good results were delivered.

Whilst there is a principle that independent schools should not benefit by avoiding a tax they should statutorily pay, if it is levied there needs to be far more honest debate about state school currulums and standards therein.

Finally, if tax is levied on independent schools, let's not forget the fee payers are also contributing to the cost of state education through income tax. I would venture that a corresponding rebate shoukd be introduced and if it is introduced for education, it should also be introduced in relation to the NHS for those who have elected to provide themselves with private health cover.

Does it not occur to you that this may be exactly why Oxbridge have been trying to level up to address the inequality of private school pupils proportionally taking more places? and why many people are supportive of policies such as proposals such as private schools paying VAT 🤔

Another76543 · 28/05/2024 10:28

Fairforallchildren · 28/05/2024 10:03

Abolish them all and make education fair for all. Finland do it, so can we. Private vs state is inequality to children, whether you like it or not.

Abolish them all and make education fair for all. Finland do it

This is factually incorrect. Finland have not banned private schools. What they do have is a system where private schools are not allowed to profit from the basic element of education. The state funds that part. The state subsidises the Finnish private schools.

Labraradabrador · 28/05/2024 10:30

Sickoffamilydrama · 28/05/2024 10:18

At least half of DD class have SEN talking to the parents, unfortunately they are the SEN that doesn't get much support because to get an EHCP is practically impossible.

Those that are moaning about privilege, if you had a SEN child and could afford by scraping the money together each month so they could be supported and stand a chance in life I'm sure you would.

I don't think it's right that parents and children with SEN whom don't have the finances to access private don't get as much support but this policy won't change that and will probably make it worse as some will inevitably have to leave the private sector and put more pressure on already stretched schools

We'll find a way no matter what, we are already scraping the money but considering my DD had stopped talking and was self harming when she went to a big comp it's worth every penny.

This is my post about the difference it's made to her https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/_chat/5014089-yesterday-i-cried-at-parents-evening

That was a really lovely and uplifting read - just what I needed in the middle of all the vitriol

Another76543 · 28/05/2024 10:30

Janedoe82 · 28/05/2024 10:28

Does it not occur to you that this may be exactly why Oxbridge have been trying to level up to address the inequality of private school pupils proportionally taking more places? and why many people are supportive of policies such as proposals such as private schools paying VAT 🤔

Cambridge have scrapped their state school admission targets this year, presumably because they’ve realised that this blunt tool does not necessarily mean they attract the best calibre of students.

OvalLemon · 28/05/2024 10:31

WindsurfingDreams · 28/05/2024 10:20

That's not how it works though. They don't have all that money upfront and presumably they have very little equity (so won't be able to put down a big deposit) and don't spend on holidays or cars or treats or hobbies or private tutoring at present so one might expect some of their money will be diverted in those directions...

Actually I imagine that if they are paying for private school and sacrificing those things already then buying a house or even renting to get their child into the best school is probably their top priority.

Janedoe82 · 28/05/2024 10:31

Navymamma · 28/05/2024 10:04

@OvalLemon please can you provide a link to the study? I’ve just googled and not found it.

It is the Daily Mail. Bound to be accurate. I am sure when surveyed all the private school parents were truthful about their ability to pay the 20% 😜

SerendipityJane · 28/05/2024 10:32

Errors · 28/05/2024 10:27

Another question - can labour just decide to do this if they get elected? Won’t they need to try and change the legislation and so it’ll have to go through the House of Lords who are probably very unlikely to allow the policy to go ahead??

HoL can't stop manifesto legislation. It's why they could block Rwanda.

Einwegflasche · 28/05/2024 10:32

RespiceFinemKarma · 28/05/2024 10:23

Ask the thousands of kids on full bursaries if they feel their school has been charitable.

I'd be interested to read how many children really benefit from bursaries, the general consensus is that it's not many - however that may be a myth!

SofaThrow · 28/05/2024 10:32

InterIgnis · 28/05/2024 10:26

Someone answering OP’s question, and explaining their own circumstances.

Sorry but I agree with the poster calling out massive privilege - that comment was just...well...

noblegiraffe · 28/05/2024 10:33

PropertyManager · 28/05/2024 10:19

Ah ha, so none then, other than copying a table - 20+ years working in education, staff governor, finance committee member.

If you think a school can actually function on c£7K per pupil / per year, you are being daft, we spend nearly £200K per quarter on electricity alone, before staffing, building repairs, expansion planning, new builds etc..

It all has to come from somewhere, and doesn't all come via capitation. we couldn't run on capitation alone.

we spend nearly £200K per quarter on electricity alone

No you don't.

You also though the LA was giving you £5k per pupil per term.

RespiceFinemKarma · 28/05/2024 10:33

Janedoe82 · 28/05/2024 10:28

Does it not occur to you that this may be exactly why Oxbridge have been trying to level up to address the inequality of private school pupils proportionally taking more places? and why many people are supportive of policies such as proposals such as private schools paying VAT 🤔

And how many super selective grammar schools leapfrog the real state kids?

And how many of their parents have multi-million pound homes with pools and went to private schools themselves and have been hoarding wealth for decades?

Think outside the tiny box Labour are giving you people!

Einwegflasche · 28/05/2024 10:33

InterIgnis · 28/05/2024 10:16

Apparently you seem to think people need to, in order to not be considered ‘narrow minded’.

I mean, if that makes you happy then go for it, but it’s (once again) ironically quite narrow minded to believe that someone couldn’t possibly have given considered thought to a subject and yet not come to the same conclusion as you.

Nope, just stating that it is quite narrow minded to have such a narrow perspective.

Another76543 · 28/05/2024 10:34

Alectrona · 28/05/2024 10:17

Regardless of how a change in charitable status might affect you, do you honestly believe that private schools are charities?

Not this again. Charitable status and the VAT position are entirely separate. The Labour Party have scrapped plans to change the charitable status position of private schools. Around half of private schools aren’t registered charities anyway.

OvalLemon · 28/05/2024 10:34

Ozanj · 28/05/2024 10:21

Yep. We crunched the numbers and we could buy a house in the 11+ catchment of any grammar in the UK if we wanted to. In the meantime we’ll absorb the increase to keep DS at Private primary, keep investing, keep our house in an outstanding non-selective state school. I’m diversifying some investments to ensure I get an income. I might buy a couple of houses to rent but undecided.

Same here I’ll have to cross that bridge when we come to it. I actually think they should subsidise private schools like they do in other countries to make it more affordable. At least then more people have a choice. But it comes down to a culture war on here.. Not sure why everybody on here thinks the local state school is always good fit for their child!

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